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Old 10-14-2003, 08:07 PM   #1
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Last edited by username; 12-31-2003 at 02:44 PM.
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Old 10-14-2003, 08:12 PM   #2
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That looks a bit better. I can see it looks like they are trying to make wings in part of the grill. I also notice that the edges are more rounded which looks so much better.
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Old 10-14-2003, 08:38 PM   #3
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The front end of that Junbug looks a lot better IMHO. Looks a lot more like a production car than concept on the outside.

Can we get that with a 1000cc snowmobile engine?
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Old 10-14-2003, 09:01 PM   #4
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Zapmans influence becoming prevalent, these a much improved designs from what we have seen in the B11S.

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Old 10-14-2003, 09:04 PM   #5
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How long before he gets the shaft for another guy?
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Old 10-14-2003, 09:33 PM   #6
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Thumbs up Another keeper!

Mr. Z not going anywhere.

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Old 10-14-2003, 09:35 PM   #7
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You make the call, Alpha1
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Old 10-14-2003, 09:44 PM   #8
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Default Harvest gold?

I used to have a refrigerator in that color.

The grille on this and the B9 looks even worse than on the B11S. Otherwise the car would look a lot like the current Nissan Micra, with a dash of Pug 206 around the windows. And here the current Legacy is such a nice looking car; is this what we have to look forward to?

Ed
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Old 10-14-2003, 09:55 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by SUBE555
How long before he gets the shaft for another guy?
I hear Chris Bangle might become available pending a sharp decline in 5-series sales next year.

Looks like they've removed many of the things I didn't care for on the B11S - the side ridge is now body colored, the hood ridge and vents are gone, and the grille shaping has been toned down.

I'm not really into the micro car thing, but now I really want to see the production-like B11S...
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Old 10-14-2003, 10:08 PM   #10
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I said it some weeks back, lets make a trade. I'd rather see what Chris could do for Subaru. His styling looks to fit more with a Subaru image IMHO.

Cummon, please lets trade!

BTW, I totally agree with lark, the Legacy is so appealing to the eye, why can't we work further with that idea?
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Old 10-15-2003, 04:06 AM   #11
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Of the new front ends, this is definitely the best. It doesn't look like a jet intake is the theme anymore (which it never looked like one anyway). Now it looks like a pilot's wings pin which is more universal for aviation. That's more fitting since FHI seems to be just a subcontractor and for the most part seems like it always has. The side ridge does a great job of choping down the tall body, and I notice it has those same flares that I'm betting we'll see on the Impreza.
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Old 10-15-2003, 10:50 AM   #12
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Default Won't happen

Quote:
Originally posted by SUBE555
I said it some weeks back, lets make a trade. I'd rather see what Chris could do for Subaru. His styling looks to fit more with a Subaru image IMHO.

Cummon, please lets trade!

BTW, I totally agree with lark, the Legacy is so appealing to the eye, why can't we work further with that idea?
What you're failing to acknowledge (or are in complete denial?) is that FHI, at the highest levels in their corporate structure have decreed that future Subarus will have a different look from those of the past. You can moan all you want for "the good old days," but it isnít going to happen.

Bob
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Old 10-15-2003, 11:21 AM   #13
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Default Re: Won't happen

Quote:
Originally posted by rsholland
What you're failing to acknowledge (or are in complete denial?) is that FHI, at the highest levels in their corporate structure have decreed that future Subarus will have a different look from those of the past. You can moan all you want for "the good old days," but it isnít going to happen.

Bob
nicely said bob.
change is good! something new to attract peoples attention.

this ride looks like the hot-rodded version of the R2. chopped, dropped, etc. looks pretty good in my opinion.

deal with the new grill people, its here to stay!
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Old 10-15-2003, 12:02 PM   #14
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I don't like the B11S grill, BUT I recognize that a change is needed and can be good. I tried a brainstorming thread on how to work with the basic new face and adjust it a bit to make it better, but that didn't go over so well. Sube & Ghost mainly- my brethren, let's try to get a bit more constructive. Ghost, you gave up on the 280PS Legacy crusade (not gave up, but put on rest ) and moved on to the anti-BS11 crusade. I find it all quite humorous, but it starts to get old like jokes about Ovaltine. -sorry for the Seinfeld reference. There's going to be a change, so unless you can think up something that is different and original and looks good, can we tone it down a bit? Please.
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Old 10-15-2003, 01:31 PM   #15
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Hmm, I love Ovaltine. In fact I had some last night. No really, I did! The chocolate kind.
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Old 10-15-2003, 01:40 PM   #16
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Default Re: Won't happen

Quote:
Originally posted by rsholland
What you're failing to acknowledge (or are in complete denial?) is that FHI, at the highest levels in their corporate structure have decreed that future Subarus will have a different look from those of the past. You can moan all you want for "the good old days," but it isnít going to happen.

Bob
Actually Bob, that's kind of funny in a way. Since in the REAL "good old days" (the beginning through about 1991ish), Subarus looked quite different from everything else. So when I say I want the "good old days", the B11 styling fits...just because it doesn't fit. So maybe it might happen for me. I don't know that I exactly love the new styling, but I could live with it perfectly well if the drivetrain continued to evolve in typical Subaru fashion.
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Old 10-15-2003, 01:55 PM   #17
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Default What I was referring to was...

everything prior to Andreas Zapatinas arrival.

Bob
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Old 10-15-2003, 02:59 PM   #18
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I like it, but that rear is a bit too much Alfa. Wake up Zap! You're not in Italy any more! Those seats remind me of del Sol seats with the colored insert.
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Old 10-15-2003, 03:02 PM   #19
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Are you saying AZ's designs are the only ones that will work for Subaru bob, the art major?

I never said change is bad, but I hate Alfa looks and I don't like what AZ has come up with. The 'it follows FHI Aerospace history' is BS as PPower said. Looking over their site, they've made a few trainers, and nothing spectacular, mostly subcontracts.

As I said I'm not against change, but I think this won't garner any more customers for them. Only marketing studies will tell, but then again, look at the Baja. Very radical, too much so.
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Old 10-15-2003, 03:08 PM   #20
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Default No need to get snotty Seth

Quote:
Originally posted by SUBE555
Are you saying AZ's designs are the only ones that will work for Subaru bob, the art major?
No, I'm not saying that at all. I'm saying a new day has arrived at Subaru. Get used to it.

Bob
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Old 10-15-2003, 04:27 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by SUBE555
As I said I'm not against change, but I think this won't garner any more customers for them. Only marketing studies will tell, but then again, look at the Baja. Very radical, too much so.
I would argue that the Baha was not radical enough. I think it's safe to say that if it was closer to the concept Baha, it would have done better, even if only slightly. If the new designs don't drag in tons of new customers, that won't bug me too much. I like driving what's unique anyway.
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Old 10-15-2003, 05:12 PM   #22
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Hey Bob, like I said in my PM, we're going to have to agree to disagree.

I agree change can be good. I disagree this change is good.

Opinions are like a$$holes, everybody has one.
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Old 10-15-2003, 05:52 PM   #23
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I'm not sure that "get used to it" is a great slogan for Subaru.

Let's picture their ad campaign:

"The New Subaru, it's ugly, get used to it!"

Hmm...not sure that'll sell many cars.

As to not-selling being a good thing because its "unique", that's not what the whole "upscale" thing is about--Subaru wants a bigger share of the market, and being sold only to a niche group who appreciate the "uniqueness" of their vehicles certainly will not increase their consumer base.

And, for giving up on the notion that they could still develop and market the New Legacy as their corporate "look", I say that concepts are just that--conceptual. They are set out there to gauge reaction before the product goes to market.

Hopefully, the reaction will be so negative that Subaru will change their mind, something they would have time to do.

Unfortunately, many people think "different" is good solely because it's different--but we see how well that line of thinking worked for the Baja and SVX and Bug Eye.

FWIW, I'd wish Subaru would put forth concepts from the two schools they have, the Alfa-brigade and the New Legacy Look and then see which gets the better reaction.

But, I doubt that will happen, as they seem dead set on running with the BS11 campaign. Perhaps they will have to do a running redesign like with the Bug Eye, perhaps not. Either way, I won't "get used to it" I'll just buy something else.

I'm not so amazed by Subaru's technology that I won't get an alternative, better-looking car.

There are more and more AWDs coming out, and some systems, like the new G35x, or Audi's Quattro system, seem equal or superior to Subaru's system.

And, considering I'm not rallying, the loss of the boxer heritage isn't a big deal (and even Subaru bailed on their heritage in WRC by making a 2.5L STI, knowing that few in the US would care).

As to "being more constructive", well, what's there to say? It's ugly, plain and simple. There's no way to improve it other than to avoid it completely.
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Old 10-15-2003, 09:13 PM   #24
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Chrysler design house continues to put out fresh concept vehicles, the Treo Concept will be showcase at the Tokyo Auto Show.

The Jeep Treo is the type of vehicle that Subara could build off their Micro frames.

Oct 15, 2003 Ė In staging the introduction of the Jeep Treo 'Urban Mobility Vehicle' at the 37th Tokyo Motor Show, Chrysler Group is giving a nod to the cultural environment that is seemingly light years away from Detroit by showing an original anime that has been created for the presentation of the vehicle. And arguably, the three-passenger vehicle is one with an overall futuristic design that is better suited to the Tokyo Show environment than it would have been in Frankfurt or for Detroit next January.

One of the characteristics of anime is exaggeration, particularly of eyes. That is translated in the Treo to the wheels and tires: 19-inch wheels are pushed way out toward the corners of the vehicle: the wheelbase is 2450 mm, the overall length is 3235. It is clear from those numbers alone that the 'wheels out' design approach is taking over at Chrysler. What's more, as this is a Jeep, the fenders are set well above the tires and are bolted onto the side of the vehicle, in keeping with the machine-meets-the-great-outdoors ethos that is characteristic of contemporary Jeeps.
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Old 10-15-2003, 09:49 PM   #25
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Whoa, Lunar Rover meets Jeep CJ.

I actually like it, wonder what it's got for a powertrain?
(assuming it has one, if not, wonder what it *would have*)
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