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Old 06-27-2000, 12:51 AM   #1
Keiho
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Exclamation OT: SiR (or Si) or a Gti 1.8t?

A friend of mine is considering between these two cars. I've tried to get him towards a Subaru, but his price range forces him out of an RS, and he likes the RS extras compared to the TS. Granted, if you guys can convert him over

Anyway, fire away bout the pros and cons of each. Try sticking to technical critiques pls. He already knows that there are a million Honduhs out there.
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Old 06-27-2000, 06:08 AM   #2
Robin2
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Between the 2, I'd chose the 1.8T Golf...

Easy pic... You can buy this car and simply chip the car. This is the same engine as the 1.8T in the Audi A4 (1999 and 2000)...

Also, the interior is much better too... THe Civics now have an interior that ressembles GM cars such as Cavaliers or Sunfires.

Tell your friend to look at used RS. I'm sure there some for sale in Vancouver with a good price.

Robin
National Capital Subaru Club www.ottawasubaru.com
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Old 06-27-2000, 06:42 AM   #3
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Has he test driven a TS? All ya gotta do is let him drive an Impreza and let him get the feel. Granted, I'd choose the 1.8T over the SiR.

Well, the money saved on TS over 1.8T or SiR, he could do (at least) full intake and exhaust mods. And probably pulley, computer, tires.

Well that's my opinion. What is it, oh yeah:
1. TS (modded with tires, catback, intake, pulley...)
2. 1.8T (even MORE tunable then Impreza, but more expensive right?)
3. SiR (lotsa parts, very common, fun car though)
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Old 06-27-2000, 07:17 AM   #4
jaybird
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Check out this months Sport Compact Car. There's a comparo between the two. They basically said the same thing Robin2 did.
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Old 06-27-2000, 07:26 AM   #5
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Civics = too common. I'll bet one day he'll mistake another Civic as his own and try to open it coz their sooooo common.

GTi 1.8 turbo? Gracious.....spend $500 on a chip and you've got instantly 60-80 horse power!!!! You'd have to spend thousands on a Civic to get that much hp.

And remember, equally modded - the GTi will yield more HP than an Si.
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Old 06-27-2000, 07:54 PM   #6
Keiho
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Ok then, lemme change the topic a little then. Impreza TS or a Gti 1.8t?
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Old 06-27-2000, 08:08 PM   #7
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Correct me if I am wrong but the turbo in the golf 1.8t is K03 which is capable to bring hte car up to 180hp with a chip....reliably. Any higher and you're basically rolling the dice. But add and intake and exhaust you can get 200hp. To chip the car higher you need to upgrade the turbo to a bigger one which is K04. This would bring your car to 225hp reliably without intake and exhaust.
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Old 06-27-2000, 08:59 PM   #8
Hucker
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Err...Pick the VW.
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Old 06-27-2000, 10:57 PM   #9
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Lightbulb

Last checked, 1.8T is almost the same price range as the RS here (in Canada)... No SiR please - the driveability of both 1.8T and RS are better. The only reason for the SiR is weight.

Ppl are right about chipping 1.8T - You need quite a bit of money to tune the RS, and definitely need time and a good tuner.

Interior - I think 1.8T wins hands down - no contest

Point for RS against all others - AWD. You just don't convert any car to AWD, and Subaru has 1 of the best. And if there is money for the Turbo and tune it properly, beats anything that's about the same price (RS + mod)

Don't get me started with RS vs A4 (or S4) - they're just very different in taste. Stock 1.8T (A4 or Golf) is comparable to stock RS.

Hope this helps you convince your friend to go for the RS. But if AWD is not important (or fun enough), then sorry - can't help but go for the 1.8T
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Old 06-28-2000, 06:33 AM   #10
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hehe, what's going to happen when the Golf's and Jettas have AWD here like they do in Europe?
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Old 06-28-2000, 08:34 AM   #11
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harpy,

The 24V V6 Golf 4-motion has already been spotted in some rare parts of North America.

-Shane
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Old 06-28-2000, 11:09 AM   #12
kgb
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Lightbulb

I wonder about a 4motion golf too.....
Apparently, 4motion passat uses the same system as A4 Quattro, but 4motion golf (is that what it's called?) in europe has a different drivetrain.

But I think the 4motion golf w/1.8T or VR6 will be priced about the same as the A4, so RS is still the better deal, esp. against 1.8T (Golf/A4, Quattro/4motion or not)
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Old 06-28-2000, 11:26 AM   #13
harpy
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Xymox, I know there are a few cars out here, the only ones I know about are used by VW execs and their families, "normal" people can't buy them yet

kgb, I don't think VW would make them as expensive as the A4, the Passat 4-motion is already as expensive if not more in some cases, to make the Golf or Jetta that much would price the cars out of the market.

to venture a guess I'd say the two would be like with the A4's just add $1500 to the price of the FWD cars, but that's just a guess, if I think of it later I could ask around upstairs and see if anyone knows anything about them. (I work at the place that does VW's ads)

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Old 06-28-2000, 01:01 PM   #14
lackey
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Well, technically, you can convert cars to AWD. A company in Canada, called HPA, I think, can slap a Golf Rallye AWD drivetrain on your A3 Golf or Jetta. A while back, European Car (or some other tuner magazine) did an article on a 1999 VW Cabrio that had had the AWD system added, as well as a VR6 transplant. The VR6, if I remember correctly, had been bumped up to 3.1 liters and supercharged. Of course, all this requires work, including a new rear-floor pan, but it would certainly be cool to have a AWD VR6 Cabrio. I don't know if anyone has done this yet to the current A4 Golfs or Jettas.
For a neat GTI, check out this month's Performance VW magazine. An A4 GTI with an Audi rally car five-pot turbo motor and AWD drivetrain. 900hp!
The Golf and Jetta's (and TT's)4Motion system uses this electronic Haldex system. I think its basically front wheel drive until slip is detected, and then power is sent to the rear. I'm not sure if this is a good thing.
A chipped GTI 1.8T can get you up to 197hp, no other mods, and, get this, 240lbs ft of torque! That would be truely insane.
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Old 06-28-2000, 02:04 PM   #15
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I question anyone who would consider the Si and GTI similar cars. They are not. And for the price of the GTI, why not spend a little more and get an RS? The Si is NA, and still comes close to the power of the GTI. If you put $2000-$2500 into an Si (which would make it the same price as the GTI) it would kill the VW. Hell, just tack on a JRSC for that price and hit 200HP off the bat. No question, for the money, Si. If you're gonna spend $20,000, get an Impreza.
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Old 06-28-2000, 02:09 PM   #16
Xymox
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Hmm.. do you think having a Jackson Racing SC on your new Si would void your warranty? .....uuh..... OF COURSE!

The VW crowd is worried enough adding a chip to the 1.8T...but a SC would SURELY void all warranty.

-Shane
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Old 06-28-2000, 02:19 PM   #17
Matt Monson
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Can you actually get a factory Sir up there in Canada? If we are actually talking Sir vs. the Golf, the Sir would school that car.
Now if we are talking Si, that is more of a toss up. Personally, having owned 3 Hondas and knowing how to uprgade/set-up and tune one, I would probably still go Honda. But those VW's are real nice. I just don't know, but Oh yeah, I got an RS instead, I already made up my mind!!
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Old 06-28-2000, 02:25 PM   #18
Stickee
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Matt: Canadian badging is a bit different then yours. Here are the equivalents:
US = CAN
Si = SiR (160hp DOHC)
EX = Si (127hp SOHC)


[This message has been edited by Stickee (edited June 28, 2000).]
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Old 06-28-2000, 03:39 PM   #19
kgb
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Lightbulb

Few pts (Canadian view):
1) Extensive mod on most cars will void warranty (chipping 1.8T, SC the SiR/TC the RS, or putting 1.8T into AWD)
2) AWD conversion is possible, but I think it's cost prohibitive
3) Max Power-wise, SiR (Si in US), 1.8T and RS are similar - just have very different torque curve between SiR and the other 2.
4) 4motion option on Golf could get costly - just think of the price of the A4 1.8T FWD vs Golf 1.8T - it's not much of a difference
5) AFAIK, in Canada, SiR, 1.8T and RS are within $2000 of each other

Given that, I would say RS if AWD is important, otherwise 1.8T. Modding can only occur when you actually have the car and the money. (and at this moment, I have neither )
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