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Old 01-04-2004, 10:22 PM   #26
dsmperformance
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I just ate a cookie!
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Old 01-04-2004, 10:26 PM   #27
Zornorph
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Kevin, I have listened to you a lot on this board. Once again you have displayed your unbelievable ego.
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Old 01-05-2004, 02:20 AM   #28
wgknestrick
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According to Red Rocket, he is the first person to ever port a wastegate. I can't wait to tell my children about the Red Rocket (and Al) "I" used to know after they read about them in text books at school. What a pioneer. Is "lol" appropriate after this?

I try to only flame when necessary, but Red Rocket please re-read your post again to understand why we think you sound "flame worthy".

Just trying to help STI owners out, but this thread will grow out of hand now.
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Old 01-05-2004, 03:07 AM   #29
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Don't get it. Why is boost creep so horrible? It seems to happen when you punch it in 5th or 6th at lower RPMs, the boost builds up, the cylinders are drawing in some air but because the RPMs are low, the cylinders don't draw air faster than boost builds = boost creep. So more boost = more hp. Not so bad. Ok, you go over 17.5 or so PSI and then you get fuel cut. Don't think you get fuel cut. That's dangerous, it's probably ignition cut. Big deal. I bounce off the rev limiter all the time when I autox.

I've punched it plenty of times with a TBE installed in 5th or 6th for quick passing but I'm never on it for a long time. If I really want to get going, I drop it into 3rd or 4th. Never got ignition cut. Even if I did, that wouldn't bother me. What I see as a problem is installing an FCD and getting 20+psi. Even then how bad is that. No one has tested to see how durable our engines are.

So why is boost creep so bad?
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Old 01-05-2004, 06:54 AM   #30
bigdong123
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i went with an external wastegate on my sti with my gases venting into the atmosphere i am 1 of the first people to have one on i custom designed the upipe and attached a tial 38mm no boost creep unbelievable response and setting boost controllers is a piece of cake. i will be selling the upipe needed or perhaps a whole entire external wastegate kit if any1s interested please say so im going to take a tally..
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Old 01-05-2004, 11:25 AM   #31
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Thanks for the pics.
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Old 01-05-2004, 02:27 PM   #32
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So what type of exhaust setup would be appropriate to put on the STi with some boost gains and w/o causing damage? I don't know enough or have tools to create my own. How much boost (or spool up) is "safe" for the VF39?
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Old 01-05-2004, 02:32 PM   #33
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The VF39 CAN'T make more boost than is good for the engine in the lower gears (1-4th), 5th and 6th it appears that the midrange boost can get up there, but I have no evidence for or against the safety of running 20+ PSI on a stock turbo, tune, and fuel system STi.
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Old 01-05-2004, 02:42 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally posted by XT6Wagon
The VF39 CAN'T make more boost than is good for the engine in the lower gears (1-4th), 5th and 6th it appears that the midrange boost can get up there, but I have no evidence for or against the safety of running 20+ PSI on a stock turbo, tune, and fuel system STi.
You will compromise turbo life running higher boost pressures on the VF39.
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Old 01-05-2004, 06:27 PM   #35
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Hey Bill, nice write up on the creep!

I had my first CEL today after running a TurboXS TBE w/ hi flow cat for the last 6 months. It is 9F here with a wind chill of -7F. The turbo usually tops out under 17 PSI, but today it spiked to 18 flat. I will probably not port the wastegate as it rarely gets this cold here. I will try to be gentle under 20F.

Now I need a cookie.

{EDIT: Crap...we are out of cookies}

Last edited by Hummer; 01-05-2004 at 08:36 PM.
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Old 01-05-2004, 06:30 PM   #36
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You should still port it cause when yor car spikes to 18-19 the car detonates and then pulls timing then you lose performance.
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Old 01-05-2004, 06:41 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally posted by carguy19
You should still port it cause when yor car spikes to 18-19 the car detonates and then pulls timing then you lose performance.
Spiking does not = detonation{unless you REALLY spike it}. 18 flat is the HIGHEST it has ever hit and that is at 7F.

What a pain to be in Kansas and need crap done such as porting. Shelfing the car for a week for a problem that has reared it's head 1x since last June {plus the cash that should go to other priorities}. The temp here is increasing 10 degrees per day for the next 3 days so we shall see.

Last edited by Hummer; 01-05-2004 at 06:48 PM.
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Old 01-05-2004, 06:45 PM   #38
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Again a request for turbo removal instructions on an Sti. I f I knew how to take off it will be much easier to send it to deadbolt.
Is there any harm in running the ported turbo and wastegate with the stock exhaust while I wait to hear from Vishnu?
Thank you.


Mitch
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Old 01-05-2004, 06:50 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hummer
Spiking does not = detonation{unless you REALLY spike it}. 18 flat is the HIGHEST it has ever hit and that is at 7F.
Your car is most defiantely detonating on an 18lb spike on 93 octane, I guarantee it, you may not hear it over the motor or windnoise inside the car, but it's there.
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Old 01-05-2004, 06:59 PM   #40
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technical evidence, please.

Quote:
Originally posted by carguy19
Your car is most defiantely detonating on an 18lb spike on 93 octane, I guarantee it, you may not hear it over the motor or windnoise inside the car, but it's there.
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Old 01-05-2004, 07:01 PM   #41
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Here you go enjoy.....

PING PING PING Click here
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Old 01-05-2004, 07:03 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally posted by carguy19
Your car is most defiantely detonating on an 18lb spike on 93 octane, I guarantee it, you may not hear it over the motor or windnoise inside the car, but it's there.
No way you can say that for certain without monitoring.

-st
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Old 01-05-2004, 07:05 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally posted by carguy19
Here you go enjoy.....

PING PING PING Click here
How does that prove that a spike (momentary) to 18PSI causes detonation?

-st
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Old 01-05-2004, 07:12 PM   #44
carguy19
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Well then keep driving you car thinking it doesnt ping.

If you want proof, go to a shop with a dyno let them make a pull with your car stand inside where the car is about 15-20ft away so the nois isnt right in your ears. Listen close.... that sound that sounds like metal bb's being dropped in a coffee can or garbage can is detonation. I've been in 5-6 sti's besides my own, stock and modded they all detonate. Its such a big problem subaru issued an ECU reflash to cure it, but yours must be the only one that doesn't ping
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Old 01-05-2004, 07:17 PM   #45
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I was informed that the SOA reflash solution, instead of fixing the problem just masks it by taking away power. And that info was dyno proven. As much as 20hp lost. I sure dont plan on getting the reflash.
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Old 01-05-2004, 07:29 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally posted by carguy19
Well then keep driving you car thinking it doesnt ping.

If you want proof, go to a shop with a dyno let them make a pull with your car stand inside where the car is about 15-20ft away so the nois isnt right in your ears. Listen close.... that sound that sounds like metal bb's being dropped in a coffee can or garbage can is detonation. I've been in 5-6 sti's besides my own, stock and modded they all detonate. Its such a big problem subaru issued an ECU reflash to cure it, but yours must be the only one that doesn't ping
All STi's do NOT have issues with detonation. 91 octane can make the STi ping, overboosting from the factory also appears to be related. Shiv theorized that it might be related to the way the timing advance is handled. He hasn't confirmed whether or not this changed in the new reflash. Search is your friend.

-st
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Old 01-05-2004, 07:45 PM   #47
Hummer
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Quote:
Originally posted by carguy19
Well then keep driving you car thinking it doesnt ping.

If you want proof, go to a shop with a dyno let them make a pull with your car stand inside where the car is about 15-20ft away so the nois isnt right in your ears. Listen close.... that sound that sounds like metal bb's being dropped in a coffee can or garbage can is detonation. I've been in 5-6 sti's besides my own, stock and modded they all detonate. Its such a big problem subaru issued an ECU reflash to cure it, but yours must be the only one that doesn't ping
You should read more and post less.
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Old 01-05-2004, 07:53 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally posted by MITCHELL
Again a request for turbo removal instructions on an Sti. I f I knew how to take off it will be much easier to send it to deadbolt.
Is there any harm in running the ported turbo and wastegate with the stock exhaust while I wait to hear from Vishnu?
Thank you.


Mitch
Did you get the service manual yet? You can download the files for $20 from subaru. The whole assembly is really simple, you should be able to figure it out with the manual.

...or you could keep waiting. I would guess someone will post a step-by-step eventually.

-st
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Old 01-05-2004, 08:33 PM   #49
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There are instructions at TurboXS's website (stage 4 install instructions, but no pics). A 2-3 hr task is one sentence on those too. Someone needs to make detailed turbo install instructions. Getting the turbo outta there is easy. Putting it back on with all hoses properly connected is another. Oil return is IMPOSSIBLE to reach as it is burried by the uppipe and engine, plus aligning everything else all at once proves to be a frustrating task.
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Old 01-05-2004, 10:40 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally posted by wgknestrick
According to Red Rocket, he is the first person to ever port a wastegate. I can't wait to tell my children about the Red Rocket (and Al) "I" used to know after they read about them in text books at school. What a pioneer. Is "lol" appropriate after this?

I try to only flame when necessary, but Red Rocket please re-read your post again to understand why we think you sound "flame worthy".

Just trying to help STI owners out, but this thread will grow out of hand now.
Quote:
Originally posted by Zornorph
Kevin, I have listened to you a lot on this board. Once again you have displayed your unbelievable ego.


Wow, you guys are just so super! Yay, slam me when I rightfully take credit for my accomplishment. Get off your god damn high horse.

No kidding I'm not the first person to port a wastegate, or any other car part for that matter. But when I did it, there were several people on NASIOC struggling with boost creep, with no solution known, and I was the first one to get up the balls to take a grinding bit to my $900 turbo to solve the problem. I didn't even know if it would work, but it did. I researched it it on the net to get tips, so of course it's not an original concept. But I take credit for bring the concept to NASIOC and the US subaru community. Austin also deserves alot of credit, I bounced the concept off him, then he did it after me and made a nice writeup.

(I won't even go into how I did it outdoors on one of the coldest weekends of the year, at a "garage day"....that's a little NESIC legend).

You two can bite me.

Kevin
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