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Old 09-11-2000, 09:01 AM   #1
Tkacik
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Post Firestone going under

I just want to get a good reading from everyone who thinks that Firestone could go under with this whole tire thing going on? BTW: a family friend of mine owns a dealership, and is really hurting for business.
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Old 09-11-2000, 09:15 AM   #2
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If it doesn't outright kill them, it will hurt very badly.

They may have a point though in blaming Ford. Firestone apparently says that the only people who have died have been in Exploders and Ford may be in some way responsible.
 
Old 09-11-2000, 09:17 AM   #3
horseflesh
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I think the company is too big to be put under by this. The lawsuits and poor publicity will hurt them, but a company that size can run at a loss for a long time.

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Old 09-11-2000, 09:19 AM   #4
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I doubt they'd go under... Firestone (& its parent company, Bridgestone) is a rather large company. Wasn't there something about Firestone & defective tires back in the 80's as well?

They said something about some of the tires missing a ply, right? In that case, I'd think that none of this would be Ford's fault, except that they probably should've been aware of this situation well in advance before the media frenzy.
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Old 09-11-2000, 09:21 AM   #5
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Quote:
Firestone apparently says that the only people who have died have been in Exploders and Ford may be in some way responsible.
Yup that's why yesterday on the news they said that a 4Runner crashed b/c a tire blow out, guess what kind of tire it was. Firestone is just trying to put the blame on some one else.
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Old 09-11-2000, 09:24 AM   #6
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Rally Man - Didn't see that one. But I haven't had the chance to hit any news sites today yet.

 
Old 09-11-2000, 09:28 AM   #7
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It's not the tire... it's those Damn Sport Utility Vehicles! That's why people die. Blow outs happen all of the time, even with 18-wheelers. And where do the deaths occur? SUVs!

Yes, the Firestone tires are failing due to a defect. And yes, Firestone is responsible for fixing that. But let's cure the SUV problem before we blame it all on Firestone. I haven't seen a lot of rolled vehicles in my life. But the ones I have seen are all SUVs!
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Old 09-11-2000, 09:31 AM   #8
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Wink

I saw Pat roll his Subaru in that other post.
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Old 09-11-2000, 09:44 AM   #9
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I'm sick of the lawsuit mentality of the american society, it's so lame.
If you drive an underinflated tire at speeds over the legal speedlimit and the tire blows, guess what?
You choose to do so, the tires are made to be used at certain pressures, the whole chassis is a very complex mass/spring setup and the tire is part of it.
And if you go too fast anyways you should be held liable alone, noone made you go 100mph.
even if there are faulty tires and they blow, the percentage of blown tires within all mounted tires is sooo low(below0.1%), it is just mediahype to say that Firestone tires are bad in the first place.
If a tire blows on a passenger car you go to the curb and change it, no big deal.
If the tire on a live rear axle POS blows, the one wheel not only drops a significant amount, it also tilts the wheel on the other side. The rear axle starts "steering" in a way that helps the car flip(strongly simpified!).
So, SUV's are safe, aren't they.
LOL
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Old 09-11-2000, 09:56 AM   #10
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I have taken to trying to check out the front tires of SUV's that I get close to and one thing I have noticed is that the front tires almost always seem under-inflated.

I can imagine the 'normal' SUV owner never even bothering with maintanence other than oil changes (done by someone else) and gas. I wonder how many failures are a the result of not only a defective tire, but of a tire with a defect amplified by a lack of maintanence (checking air pressure).

My 2 cents.
 
Old 09-11-2000, 10:08 AM   #11
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We had a brand new Goodyear blow out on a Suburban. The tire had recently been mounted and the tire pressure had been checked only hours before the accident. The driver of the vehicle had been complaining of a thumping and slight shaking of the vehicle. Visual inspection yielded no defects of the tires. All tires were checked for proper inflation.

The vehicle was traveling south on I-77 at about 70 mph. The tread from the Goodyear separated from the tire causing the tire to blow out. The vehicle skidded to the shoulder of the road, slid sideways, and flipped when the left rear rim (the tire that was blown) dug into the dirt. The vehicle completed an entire revolution in the air, landed on its side and continued to roll coming to rest right side up.

Durings its rolls it landed upside down on a section of abandoned concrete culvert. The culvert crushed the passenger's side roof almost level with the rear of the bench seat. In the process the passenger suffered several compression fractures of her veterbrae.

The driver was able to extracate herself from the vehicle by crawling the length of the truck and exiting through the rear doors. The passenger had to be cut using the "jaws of life."

Originally I was scheduled to drive that vehicle that day. Instead, I was driving another vehicle a few hundred feet in front of the Suburban.

This accident proves that these problems aren't only experienced by Firestone and not only by Explorers.
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Old 09-11-2000, 10:19 AM   #12
WRC666
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Hope she's going to be alright.
That's sad.
Rear axle, right?
And women buy those SUV's (or get them bought by the caring husband)because they feel safe.
Back injuries are tough...
:^(
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Old 09-11-2000, 10:30 AM   #13
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I work in the tire industry, for a sub-vendor, outside supplier. If Firestone is going to go down, it will be because they are too busy making replacement tires for Ford to make any tires for profitable sale at the US plants. The unions aren't being very helpful either, neither are the general news media. It's a clusterf**k. Our factory (in Asia) is busy making tens of thousands of ATV and golf-cart tires for Firestone because all of their US production is busy supplying Ford.
Lots of current industry news on http://www.tirebusiness.com
You'll notice that BFS aren't the only ones who have a duff tire or two slip out the factory gates...
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Old 09-11-2000, 10:51 AM   #14
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I'm far from a 'tire biz' insider, but I have read that when supplying the tires to Ford, BFS rec'd an inflation of 30#.
Ford's rec'd pressure in its owners manuals etc is said to have been 26#. I dont know what a vehicle of that weight really needs, but think about the inflation you use in your RS, and what do they weigh?
I do know that an under-inflated tire flexes more, which builds up internal heat, which could contribute to failures. If any of this inflation disparity proves to be true, I think Ford is going to be embroiled in this more than they are at the moment.
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Old 09-11-2000, 12:01 PM   #15
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Good replies everyone keep em coming: My friend who owns the Firestone dealership, says that his tire sales are down almost 78%, and his sales of oil changes, and other mantinence items is whats keeping him alive. I think that Ford better step up if this is more their fault than Firestone's. Firestone has been around for a very long time. This situation can do nothing but hurt their name.
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Old 09-11-2000, 12:14 PM   #16
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firestone may not go under ...but bridgestone may spin them off. so they can file for chapt. 11 ...firestone will come back as a discount tire chain like the K-mart brand ...i can't remember its name now... ford along with other car makers are thinking of changing brands of tires if they do that it will finish firestone in its current state. ...WSJ, NBC nightly-news, and Datek online.
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Old 09-11-2000, 12:21 PM   #17
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Faraz, yeah I agree. Kinda like when Valu-Jet changed its name to Air-Tran. Same product different name.
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Old 09-11-2000, 03:23 PM   #18
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Good points XT6. I agree. I was just saying that at this point in time no one has taken the blame. Someone better fess up. Firestone blames ford, Ford blames Firestone. At this rate nothing will be solved anytime soon.
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Old 09-11-2000, 03:31 PM   #19
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If anything happens to Ford it will be because they did a recall for the tires in more then 9 other countries yet never did one in the US. Reason is in other countries the car manufacturer is responsible and in the US the tire manufacturer is responsible. Hell Ford knew of the problem as far back as late 97 early 98 and never said a word of it. They didn't bother to quit using the bad tires as orignal equipment. The CEO of Ford Nasser can say they didn't know about it but all their executive memos were shown on the news already and yes they did know about it.
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Old 09-11-2000, 04:09 PM   #20
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The sad thing is Bridgestone bought Firestone about 9 years after Firestone's last recall. Firestone was in heavy debt at the time and limping financially. Bridgestone nursed them back to health and then? This is their reward. Ironically I think Bridgestone's founder (some Japanese guy) was an admirer of Firestone, hence the similar corporate name.
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Old 09-11-2000, 04:17 PM   #21
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estimated cost of recall, 350 million, bridgstone/firestone, worth well more than that.

The recall will not put them out of bussiness, it will however hurt them signifigantly, I work at a Lincoln dealer, we arent having any problems at all w/business, the company that owns my dealer is even, taking all the firestone wilderness tires off of there new mountaniers and replacing them w/goodyear,(evan if the firestones are not in the recall!) And the company owns over 30 dealerships, not all ford we are the only one I think. not sure

Jay McDade
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Old 09-11-2000, 06:47 PM   #22
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Well, I haven't owned a Ford in years (92 Explorer) and never will again ! I will also never buy a car or truck with Firestone or Bridgestone tires, nor will I ever buy a Firestone or Bridgestone product. Both companies have behaved badly and don't deserve our trust or business.
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Old 09-11-2000, 07:15 PM   #23
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I know the SO-2s rock, and the 730s and 940s and RE71s are all great tires, but after the RE92 experience...no more Bridgestone for me.

A lot of people swear by Firestone; a lot of people swear they suck. After this fiasco, I'm inclined to believe the latter, even though it's a limited kind of thing. Just not enough proof otherwise.

I'm happy with my Dunlops.
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Old 09-11-2000, 10:21 PM   #24
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If you're going to bash everyone but the companies involved in the recall (i.e., the media and the drivers), you have to understand a few things.

1.) Firestone does have a higher pressure rating for its Wilderness tires than Ford recommends for the Explorers using them. And while Firestone notes this and points out that can cause higher tire temps, which in turn make the tire more likely to fall apart, it admits itself that may cause faster breakdown, BUT that shouldn't cause the tires to shred.

2.) Yes the lawsuit mentality sucks. The problem is, when its a part that's integral to the use of the machine--except under pretty extreme circumstances--the manufacturer is pretty much responsible. That's because part of what you are paying for when you buy a company's product, is the knowledge that put it together. You're not expected to know as much about it, therefore you're not expected to have 100% responsibility for it.

3.) "Media hype" is responsible for nothing. The media didn't cause the problem, car crashes caused the problem; and Firestone ADMITS the number of crashes that can be linked to faulty tires is ABOVE an "acceptable" level.

4.) On a personal note, I'll agree, SUV's suck. Unfortunately I have one [for a short time longer... till I buy a new MY01 RS!! ] Mine's a Jeep and while I hate it, hate the gas mileage and think they did a @#$*ing horrible job building it--I had an ENTIRE WHEEL FALL OFF while I was doing at least 70 on the highway--it was still stable enough to stay upright while I pulled off the side of the road and stopped.
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Old 09-11-2000, 10:22 PM   #25
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Firestone may suck, but Bridgestone is still very good- they also dominated in F1 racing.
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