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Old 04-06-2004, 03:12 PM   #51
ivbdn
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Quote:
Originally posted by wrx grl
How do I fight it by mail? I don't know who to send anything to.
Call the Court's number provided on the back of your ticket. Tell them you'd like a "Trial by Written Declration." Have the bail money ready cuz you've gotta pay upfront.

They'll send you papers to fill out along with a due date. Fill it out and either send it certified mail to the courthouse or hand deliver it. I hand delivered it as I was kinda cutting it close to the due date.
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Old 04-06-2004, 03:14 PM   #52
wrx grl
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That's the thing. I have to go to court because I don't have the money. At least if I lose in court, I can get an extension for the amount.
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Old 04-06-2004, 03:21 PM   #53
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I went to the court and I only pay $10 administrative fees ... I don't understand why you can't get it corrected ... I got mine signed off and didn't have to pay such a big amount
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Old 04-06-2004, 03:23 PM   #54
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Borrow $$$ from a few people. When you get refunded after winning, pay 'em back. Do whatever you can and fight the ticket!
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Old 04-06-2004, 03:24 PM   #55
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Yeah I got mine signed off too, at the police station. But when I went to the court to pay it, the clerk said that there was a fine and there is nothing she can do because it is in the computer. I actually went twice to see if the first clerk was smoking crack but they both said the same thing.
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Old 04-06-2004, 03:25 PM   #56
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So you guys are saying that I have more of a chance to win if I fight it by mail than actually going to court?
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Old 04-06-2004, 03:28 PM   #57
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Yup...30% better according to ticketassassin. Plus if you lose, which is highly unlikely, you can go for a "Trial de Novo." That's a brand new trial w/ a new judge, but you have to go to Court. This gives you an opportunity to grill the pig and humiliate him/her.
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Old 04-06-2004, 03:28 PM   #58
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Replies are flying in so fast that this is almost like chatting
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Old 04-06-2004, 03:30 PM   #59
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Well okay then. I will try this mail thing. I have until May so I am still going to see the Ref to try and get a cert. saying my car is not louder than 95dB. Let's hope that it is not, ha ha.
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Old 04-06-2004, 03:32 PM   #60
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It usually isn't, especially if you've got a Stromung. My ass on the other hand is over by about 2 dbA and that's after fitting the mid-pipe w/ a 28" glasspack resonator
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Old 04-06-2004, 03:36 PM   #61
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I could always show up without a muffler and see what they say. I mean the cop did tell me I needed to take the aftermarket muffler off.

http://myimprezawrx.com/video/thetractor.wma
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Old 04-06-2004, 03:39 PM   #62
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Stupid cops will say anything to get a driver to remove their aftermarket exhaust system.
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Old 04-06-2004, 05:57 PM   #63
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wow ..

can anyone refer me to a legit website regarding the exhaust ticket becomes non-correctable as it was passed in january 200? ?

the cop that cited me is an IDIOT, he gave me "agency copy" ... I was lucky that I paid only 10 dollar administrative fees .. otherwise I'll be in the same boat as you are now.
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Old 04-06-2004, 06:06 PM   #64
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okay

which VC is non-correctable anymore?

VC 27150? <-- I got this VC cleared today and paid 10 USD administrative fees
VC 27151?
VC 27152?

or ?
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Old 04-06-2004, 07:57 PM   #65
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27151 is not correctable.
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Old 04-06-2004, 08:42 PM   #66
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I think this site is quite informative

http://www.bikersrights.com/states/c...a/CJCKnox.html

Quote:
Tuesday, August 22, 2000

Assembly Member Wally Knox
State Capitol Room 6025
Sacramento, CA 95814

Dear ,

Please find attached my ticket for an alleged 27151 violation checked as correctable by the CHP, the L.A. Valley Court non-correctable bail notice I received , a Fullerton Court correctable Bail Notice for a similar exhaust violation per your request.

When I read that my bail was $77 without mention of correctability, I called the LA Valley Court Clerk who advised me very definitely that 27151 was no longer correctable per the 2000 Bail Schedule. I have seen a copy of the 2000 Bail Schedule and see that 27151 is listed as non-correctable, but according to the law, it is definitely correctable.

Contrary to Mr. Tucker of the California Judicial Council's interpretation of VC 40303.5 sub-section (d), my read of it only serves to prove that 27151 is clearly a correctable violation. Regardless of his or the CJC's opinion or "feelings" about this or any law, the CJC cannot modify any law inconsistent with it's spirit or Legislative intent. To do so is beyond the Judicial Branch's Constitutional power and authority.

Last edited by MotorWerkz; 04-06-2004 at 08:49 PM.
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Old 04-07-2004, 01:31 AM   #67
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I don't exactly remember where I saw it, but that link helps quite a bit.
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Old 04-13-2004, 02:35 PM   #68
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For reference; a PM exchange between me and another user:

Here are the facts:

1) 27151 is not a correctable violation, according to California law.
2) If you pay the fine, you do not have to change anything on your car. The fine will increase the next time you are cited for the same violation. I do not know if a 27151 violation will cause any points on your driving record.
3) I don't know about getting a 27151 ticket signed off. I've never personally done this. Others have posted their experiences. I do know that when others get it signed off in California, it is a mistake. If you CAN get it signed off and pay the $10 fee (or whatever it is, some CHP or Sheriff's charge more), then do it.

I'm going to post this exchange in the thread for others to reference.

Aaron

Quote:
megabass wrote on 04-13-2004 11:05 AM:
I wanna clarify a couple things... If you pay the fine which is like $150, then you don't have to remove your exhaust? If you try to get it signed off, then you pay your $10 fee and then you are okay? I'm confused because people say different things. I have a full MRT Turboback w/upipe. It would be difficult to get it removed and then put the stocker back on. It would cost a lot of dough. If 27151(a) is non correctable then a referee will not help right? I'm sorry for all these questions but the threads are confusing me because most people don't really know what they are talking about except you.. Thanks in advance..

Eric


Quote:
mca wrote on 04-13-2004 06:46 PM:
Yes, I fought mine and won. I just wrote an argument using all of the information contained in the links in that post.

The exhaust ticket is not correctable, but some people have gotten lucky and signed it off and paid the $10 fee. THis should not happen according to the laws in place, but the clerks and cops make mistakes. If this happens and you canget it signed off, then you are fine. If you receive a corrected ticket, marking it as NON-CORRECTABLE (this happened to me; ticket was marked correctable, amendment from the court arrived and changed that) then you can either pay or fight it. I recommend you fight it. USe the links in the post and al the info is there.

Aaron

Quote:
megabass wrote on 04-13-2004 10:32 AM:
Hello,
I just saw your thread on the exhaust tix code 27151. It's my first time so I'm confused. It says correctable on mine but I'm not sure what to do next. Some people say that you can get it signed off by a referree and everything should be okay or some people said they just paid a $10 fine and everything was cool. I'm trying to find out the truth. Advise would be appreciated. I'm not sure if my MRT turboback will pass smog or decibel levels. I'm not sure what the referree even looks for. What exactly happened with your ticket? I think you fought it and won right?

Megabass
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Old 11-09-2004, 04:08 AM   #69
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thanks again for this thread
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Old 11-14-2004, 06:15 AM   #70
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Greetings, fellow So Cal enthusiasts. I've been lurking in this thread with great interest as I have also been experienced in fighting exhaust tickets.

It is true: exhaust tickets are no longer correctable as others have said already. Since measure A barely went down in LA County, expect the cops to make up for lost potential revenue in the form of bogus equipment tickets.

CVC 27151(b) is PART of 27151. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise. The legal limit of your exhaust is 95 db. When I was pulled over for my TRD exhaust, the officer argued that because the card mentioned 27151 and NOT 27151(a), my exhaust was illegal. Obviously, that was absolute BS. If you read VC 27151, it includes subsections (a) and (b). Toyota owners who sport TRD exhausts have certificates that read the following:

"This TRD Exhaust System complies with California's modified exhaust enforcement provisions (Vehicle Code Sections 27150 and 27151), [Q2 and Q10], which state that exhaust systems must meet a 95 decibel noise limit, (13 CCR 1036 (d) (1)). It is highly recommended that this certificate be kept inside of the vehicle for reference in the event of an inspection. In the unlikely event that a citation is issued for excessive noise, then please call TRD at (800) 688-5912 for documented noise compliance tests per SAE J1169 procedures."

It is assumed that CVC 27151(a) is covered. Remember, if the cop insists on giving you a ticket, just take it. DO NOT ARGUE WITH HIM. When it comes time to fight, he will more than likely remember you, especially if it is CHP. Those of you in the Rowland Heights area, beware...Colima is CHP's turf. And those guys will drag you out to Pomona (a notorious Kangaroo court) to watch you squirm before the commissioner.

If your exhaust comes with such a certificate as in my example, be sure that it CLEARLY refers to CVC 27150 and 27151. "50 state legal" only refers to smog, not noise, and is useless in your argument. Chances are that the citing officer will ignore your certificate and write you a ticket anyway, as in my case. When I fought the ticket, I used the following in my defense:

- The TRD certificate of compliance
- CHP Bulletin 98-100 (It's very important that you get your hands on this...the citing officer in my case claimed that it's illegal to modify an exhaust PERIOD...yet this is addressed in one of the FAQ)
- Copies of the exhaust tests for your particular vehicle
Note: If you performed other (illegal) engine mods, all bets are off. Typically these tests are done with stock vehicles.

Don't waste your time at a state referee if you know and can prove that your exhaust is indeed legal.

As far as a Trial by Declaration goes, use the Ticket Assassin templates as a guide in how to format your arguments.


DON'T PAY THE FINE AND GIVE UP. Because this is a non-correctable violation that we're talking about, it WILL go onto your driving record. The first hint is the fact that you're holding a "notice to appear" and NOT a "notice to correct."

For those that asked about the Ticket Assassin and how/where to send stuff, do a search as I know that the direct link to his shareware has been posted before in previous ticket threads. I highly advise taking time off to deliver your forms in PERSON rather than mail.

Anyway, you guys already have quite a number of ticket experts...I would look to them. I'd like to leave the URL to my ticket fighting expertise...if you frequent the So Cal region of the Celica or Matrix community boards...heck even highwayrobbery.net...and some other boards where my page ended up for who knows what reason...you'll probably recognize this page.

My ticket page

I hope it's of some help to you guys. There are direct links to the CHP FTBC crap (already posted here) and the bulletin (SEMA's link).

This is definitely a must-sticky thread...



Edit:

Oh, and one more thing...and this especially applies to CHP-issued tickets...

If you see CVC 24004 as part of your ticket, NEVER SHOW IT TO ANOTHER OFFICER. Some cops will trick you by saying that if you get stopped again for your exhaust...show the other ticket to that officer. DON'T DO IT. This is what CVC 24004 states:


24004. No person shall operate any vehicle or combination of vehicles after notice by a peace officer, as defined in Section 830.1 or subdivision (a) of Section 830.2 of the Penal Code, that the vehicle is in an unsafe condition or is not equipped as required by this code, except as may be necessary to return the vehicle or combination of vehicles to the residence or place of business of the owner or driver or to a garage, until the vehicle and its equipment have been made to conform with the requirements of this code. The provisions of this section shall not apply to an employee who does not know that such notice has been issued, and in such event the provisions of Section 40001 shall be applicable.


The CHP are notorious for attaching CVC 24004 to a non-dismissible equipment violation. An officer will suggest that if you are pulled over again for said equipment violation to simply show the original ticket to the second officer to let him/her know that you have already been cited for it. NEVER REVEAL TO ANOTHER OFFICER THAT YOU RECEIVED A PREVIOUS TICKET. When another officer sees the ticket mentioning CVC 24004, YOUR CAR WILL BE IMPOUNDED. Read the law again. That's right: it is illegal to drive a vehicle cited under CVC 24004 unless it has been brought into compliance with the law.

Last edited by alphasubzero949; 11-14-2004 at 06:22 AM.
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Old 11-15-2004, 05:16 AM   #71
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good thread i def. think this deserves a sticky
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Old 11-21-2004, 06:27 PM   #72
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Default Yay exhaust ticket....

Well I was driving on the 10 (I think, I was lost at the time) and got off at Via Verde. Not known to me was that there were 2 CHP and a mortuary to the left, which I LUCKILY turned into. I pulled ahead and U turned to get back on the freeway when one of the officers pulled me over. Gave me an exhaust ticket and now I have to drive all the way to the pomona court to get it signed off. He also told me I could have it checked through a decibel meter and get it dismissed if it passed but HKS Carbon/Ti + Invidia DP + Godspeed UP = NOPE. He also told me to give it a lil rev (I nicked the gas pedal for about 3-500rpms, being catless I don't want any afterfire popping) but all he said was "Yep, that's too loud"

Other than just telling my story, does anyone know if the stock exhaust + DP passes the decibel meter test? I'm not sure if they'll force me to test so I wouldn't want to waste my time driving out there and not swapping out both pieces. Also if I popped in the HKS silencer would that quiet it down enough to pass the 95db limit?

And if anyone has a borla hush, espelir or greddy evo2 and would like to swap + $$$ give me a PM or if the HKS silencer is enough to keep it quiet can I borrow it for a couple days, cash reward of course.

Last edited by kpxplaya415; 11-21-2004 at 06:33 PM.
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Old 11-21-2004, 07:03 PM   #73
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uh... the inspector can smell the fumes ... definitely a no no
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Old 11-21-2004, 07:21 PM   #74
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I guess I will end up swapping everything except the uppipe back to stock

Just to check if anyone can help me out, the date at the bottom is the very latest correct? Mine says 1-5-04 at 8:30am but it's possible to show up anytime I want between then correct? I did that for my tint fix it at the North County Justice Center and I'm sure the rules are the same for the Pomona center...

And the CHP officer told me *must bring parent* (also written on the ticket but not entirely visible, its half covered by the red lines of the signature box) but it's only a fix it, and I wonder if that's really necessary.... Would I be able to bypass the clerk with only giving the citation # and then having the officer sign it off?

ahh.. sneaky sneaky....
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Old 11-21-2004, 07:50 PM   #75
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kevin stop being retarded
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