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Old 03-12-2004, 11:25 PM   #1
98skuby
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Default sti long block ?

anyone know where i can get a japan long sti ej25 engine?
and what would it come with exactly? ECU? harness?

jimmy
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Old 03-13-2004, 02:15 AM   #2
Matt Monson
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try the vendor for sale classifieds. There have been about a dozen for sale in the last 2 weeks. But they generally come without turbo, intercooler, harness, ECU, or crossmember. But those things can be found around here as well, if you are ready to put your money where your mouth is...
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Old 03-13-2004, 03:36 AM   #3
CK02WRX
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Phil sold 5 of them. As far as I know there are only 9 or 10 in the country and I think that Crawford Performance has the other 4, if he hasn't sold them yet. I might be wrong but that is what I was told. They are selling for $4000-$5000.
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Old 03-13-2004, 01:49 PM   #4
Matt Monson
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Are you including the JDM Forester STi test engines that have been floating around? Regardless, I said about a dozen. 10 is about a dozen, and every one I have seen sell has been for $3500-4000. And there are a couple that I know of that are not being advertised. My point being that they are available if one is serious and has cash in hand. This is the reason Jon had Gr8wheels says not to call him unless you are ready to buy. He is a busy man and shoppers take up a lot of time.

But personally, for $4000-5000 I would rather have a complete v4-v6 STI swap than this trendy new engine that is still relatively untested at high output levels...

Or, I am doing an EJ20G closed deck swap for less than $1000. I just love how the first questions out of newbs around here is,"how can I get XXXX (super expensive, super trendy) engine in my car. I don't mean to flame, but there are som many affordable options. I have a freind who has his heart's set on a complete USDM EJ257 STI conversion. I have found him JDM v7 swaps for $4000, and he passes. He wants the EJ257, along with the Brembos, and the 6 spd, etc. It is all going to cost him close to $10,000. MY ghetto build will be pushing 275hp or so when I am done, and total cost is going to be less than $2000. I am just asking what you really want and are you ready to pay for it.

Sorry, I'll get off my soapbox now...
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Old 03-13-2004, 03:33 PM   #5
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I bought the engine because it is what I wanted. I was going to build a EJ257 block with EJ20 heads(not because it's trendy, but because I want 2.5L of displacement) but when I added up the cost it was about $3000 and I still needed a power sterring pump and alternator. So to me $4000 was worth it, since the USDM STI engine is about $8000 (yes I know it's new and the one I got is used). The point is, if you have the money, buy what you want and you'll be happy.

Last edited by CK02WRX; 03-13-2004 at 04:26 PM.
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Old 03-13-2004, 11:31 PM   #6
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Each person has to sit down and think ok what do I want and what do I want to spend. The ej257 sit is the cheepest and easyest way to go for most people with a wrx. Its going to give you the low end you miss and still make good power up top. With the wrx heads it will die off qucker then the STi already does tho...
A ej257 is also the cheepest way to go with an RS. A full jdm swap is a great way to go... its all in the type of person you are.

Quote:
Originally posted by 98skuby
anyone know where i can get a japan long sti ej25 engine?
and what would it come with exactly? ECU? harness?

jimmy
The ecu goes along with the heads... or it should. A full usdm STi swap into an RS is uncharted... good luck. The new ecu is very different then anything before. Check ou this thread hes thinking the same thing...
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...hreadid=520638

Last edited by totoherbs; 03-13-2004 at 11:59 PM.
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Old 03-13-2004, 11:55 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by CK02WRX
I bought the engine because it is what I wanted. I was going to build a EJ257 block with EJ20 heads(not because it's trendy, but because I want 2.5L of displacement) but when I added up the cost it was about $3000 and I still needed a power sterring pump and alternator. So to me $4000 was worth it, since the USDM STI engine is about $8000 (yes I know it's new and the one I got is used). The point is, if you have the money, buy what you want and you'll be happy.
I totally agree with what you have said here. Putting an EJ257 shortblock or longblock into a USDM WRX is a great option, and has a ton of bang for the buck. Hopefully, we will be putting one in my gurl's car by the end of the year.

My remarks were more directed at the topic starter, who not only doesn't not have a WRX to work with, but he is very green around here. My remarks about numbers of engines in the country obviously confused that since that was in response to things you had said. Obviously you are serious if you already have the engine in your car...



Quote:
Originally posted by totoherbs

A ej257 is also the cheepest way to go with an RS. A full jdm swap is a great way to go... its all in the type of person you are.
I totally disagree with this. If starting with a base RS, the cheapest way is a USDM WRX conversion, or buying a JDM swap. Even if you get just the EJ257 shortblock and build an RS-T, you are still going to spend $5000 to do it right, and this assumes you do all the sweating yourself. A USDM or JDM swap that is a complete powertrain, ECU, harness and other bits like DP,etc can be had for something in the neighborhood of $3000 or less if you stick to OBD-II engines to keep the wiring as "simple" as possible.
And as mentioned above, it can be done for cheaper if you are willing to use older parts. But what you say in the end, I totally agree with, it all depends on what type of person you are.

I apologize if I came off as patronizing above. I read what I saw as a pretty un-researched Newb question and got a bit righteous. I try not to be a "do a search" nazi around here, but this thread struck me as needing it. Like I said, the EJ257 has become all the rage of late and many people want one without having a clue as to what it entails.
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Old 03-14-2004, 12:07 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by Matt Monson





I totally disagree with this. If starting with a base RS, the cheapest way is a USDM WRX conversion, or buying a JDM swap. Even if you get just the EJ257 shortblock and build an RS-T, you are still going to spend $5000 to do it right, and this assumes you do all the sweating yourself. A USDM or JDM swap that is a complete powertrain, ECU, harness and other bits like DP,etc can be had for something in the neighborhood of $3000 or less if you stick to OBD-II engines to keep the wiring as "simple" as possible.
And as mentioned above, it can be done for cheaper if you are willing to use older parts. But what you say in the end, I totally agree with, it all depends on what type of person you are.

I apologize if I came off as patronizing above. I read what I saw as a pretty un-researched Newb question and got a bit righteous. I try not to be a "do a search" nazi around here, but this thread struck me as needing it. Like I said, the EJ257 has become all the rage of late and many people want one without having a clue as to what it entails.
No your right; I should have said wrx swap... but when I tell people to do or even list it as an option they say o well its not good enough. I do very much agree that a lot of people are comming up here not knowning what they are doing or even getting themselfs into. We need to throw a good FAQ up... I sopose I should finish the ej257 part of this thread. It may help people. http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...highlight=ej22

If I had an RS and was think of a swap. I would go full wrx or jdm before I thought about putting on a ej257 short block to its heads. That seems like a nightmare to me.

98skuby know that swaping a full ej257 STi long block in to an RS hasnt been done. Its costly, its risky, and the wiring is going to take a very very very long time.
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Old 03-14-2004, 06:24 AM   #9
CK02WRX
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I'm in the process of installing it now. It's actually in my living room and my wife isn't very happy about it either.
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Old 03-14-2004, 01:30 PM   #10
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what are you useing for an ecu? did you get the motor used?
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Old 03-14-2004, 05:52 PM   #11
CK02WRX
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WRX ecu and UTEC. Yes,it's used. It was said to have a few hundred miles on it, and I believe it. I removed the intake manifold so I could swap it with the wrx manifold, and it's spottless inside.

WRX intake manifold 36,000 miles

JDM forester STI 2.5 intake manifold

Last edited by CK02WRX; 03-14-2004 at 06:07 PM.
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Old 03-14-2004, 08:38 PM   #12
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A corollary question set for this conversion. Is the Forester engine in question equivalent to the USDM STi? I mean are the heads and cams the same, valve size and material, ECU, etc., or is the engine de-tuned from the regular STi (US)?

Mike M
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Old 03-14-2004, 09:33 PM   #13
CK02WRX
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Everything is said to be the same,but we won't know until someone has both heads sitting next to each other. I have talked with a person that has taken the JDM forester STI 2.5 heads apart and I was told that the valves and cams are much bigger than the usdm wrx. He also said that the intake ports are the small ones. He did not have USDM sti heads to compare so until someone does, we won't know. Phil said that SOJ "insisted these are identical in all regards to the US STI engine, ie heads and cams are the same (AVCS and DBW)".
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Old 03-14-2004, 10:25 PM   #14
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Ya, if you get a chance snap a pic of the heads and we can tell you if they are the same. From the pic posted in 2.5 factory the usdm STi uses the small port heads, like the uk STis. Not the larger port jdm or the larger/different spec C ver8 heads.
sti head thread.
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...light=cam+info
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Old 03-15-2004, 12:55 AM   #15
CK02WRX
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this is the same picture that I posted in the 2.5 forum.
JDM ver8 forester STI 2.5 head
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Old 03-15-2004, 03:14 AM   #16
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Is there agreement that the injectors are the same too? Both are yellow top side feed.

MM
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Old 03-15-2004, 05:28 AM   #17
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Yes they are yellow top side feed injectors.
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Old 03-15-2004, 11:22 AM   #18
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Thats what I said. But are they equivalent in terms of output, ie. 550 cc/min? They don't look precisely identical.

MM
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Old 03-15-2004, 01:35 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by MZM
Thats what I said. But are they equivalent in terms of output, ie. 550 cc/min? They don't look precisely identical.

MM
jdm pinks are 550ish, usdms yellows are 480s. Thoes look like the uk small ports to me... you can post them in the head info thread for better opinions.
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Old 03-15-2004, 05:43 PM   #20
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I've also been told that they are 480cc, but you can have Perrin mod them. I'm not going to use those injectors since I have the PE650's.
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Old 03-16-2004, 05:24 PM   #21
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As far as cost, I spent $1,500 on a new 2.5 STi short block in the crate. I bought STi V8 Heads for $1,500 with 7,500 miles on them. $500 more for ARP studs and gaskets and build cost. My full engine is worth $2,000 with Turbo, IC and exhaust at 15,000 miles.

A swap is very cheap if you do your homework and shop around. Of course you need the 6mt to hold the Viper torque this will put out with a big honkin turbo and AVCS. That does add another $3,500 to the mix. Sell yours for 1500 and it does not look so bad.

Oh yes, V7 ECU plugs right in if you want AVCS. Else save $500.
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Old 03-16-2004, 05:56 PM   #22
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Quote:
ebeck - As far as cost, I spent $1,500 ... V8 Heads for $1,500 ... $500 ARP studs gaskets and build cost
Of course cheap is a relative term. Compared to what? Don't forget the brackets you need, like the turbo, timing belt tensioner, etc. And the other engine pieces, like oil pump, water pump, timing belt, tensioner, and other belt bearings. Plus front engine covers, power steering pump and belt, alternater , crank pully, etc.

Don't forget the gasket kit. And for guys like me, a set of harnesses to buy or make that accept all the new engine harness plug ins, as well as the bulkhead and front harness. All this before you get a turbo, intake and exhaust and associated pieces, like silicone hose. Then there is engine management of some kind. This is a big project.

Not that its unworthy, just be realistic about it. BYW, anyone with a harness set contact me. I could be a good customer for you!!

Mike McBride
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Old 03-16-2004, 08:07 PM   #23
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Yeah, you left out the part about selling my parts bringing the cost way down.

Again my entire 2.0 wrx engine is $2,000 with turbo, IC, radiator, ECU, Hoses, exhaust, injectors and intake manifold. Not free but I guess it is relative. I stand corrected.

My cost was $3,500 for engine AND GB swap. Compared to $8,000 for a new v7 or v8 engine and $4,500 for the GB from subaru, it is cheap. That is all I was comparing to.

I was just illustrating shopping around can cut the price. By two thirds in my case.

Used pumps and crap are incidental. Try Kingpin. Be suprised. Good luck.

I will be pulling it this summer if anyone pops a motor or 5speed.
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Old 03-16-2004, 09:07 PM   #24
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Be very carfule if you use used oil pumps... or better yet dont.

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...0&pagenumber=2
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Old 03-17-2004, 11:48 PM   #25
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Thanks. I will source a new 2.5 one.
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