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Old 05-28-2000, 06:32 PM   #1
KooshDogg
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Member#: 134
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Washington, DC, USA
Question Outback H6 VDC vs. SUV's... pricing, etc.

after a very intricate SUV selection process my parents had narrowed it down to a 2001 Lexus RX300 (unrivaled service/luxury + SUV size/capability, without SUV-handling, gas mileage, or rollover risk) and i managed to get them hooked on the idea of a new Outback VDC H6. they didnt really want an SUV, and the two are pretty similar, of course the lex is ultimately nicer in terms of luxury, but the similarities were the overall dimensions... the outback is only 2 inches shorter, 7 inches longer, and .4 inches closer to the ground. the RX seems like a sort of medium-sized SUV, bigger than, say, a RAV-4 but smaller than an Explorer, and the lex had an unusually large (even for an SUV) turning radius of about 41 feet.

first of all, id like to know everyone's opinion on the choice of the VDC over an all-wheel-drive SUV or an audi wagon. power is not really a concern, although they definitely want at least a 6-cyl. space is not really important, but they definitely dont want somethin too small, so that ruled out the A4 avant as well as anything smaller than the RX300 (cr-v, rav4, grand vitara, etc.). towing capability is not at all important, hehe. safety (including rollover risk) is definitely a concern, so we basically ruled out the taller, larger vehicles as well. and finally, reliability. the outback seemed to fit right in, but what does everyone else think? any further suggestions? (no nissans, no american trucks, no VW's, hehe)

now, since the tentative release is about 4 months away, what does everyone speculate about its price? after throwing around a few numbers with some people, i came to a few conclusions...

based on the MRSP price of ~$26k for the 2000 OBlimited, i'd say the final MSRP (since the glitz of the new model will probably kill the possibility of invoice) would be about $30-31k for the VDC, and maybe around $28-29k for the llbean. i would say that the $4,000 difference should cover the costs of the auto & better AWD system, and the H6 itself, so whats everyone's prediction for pricing? (jus to get a better idea)
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Old 05-29-2000, 06:38 AM   #2
bryanw
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Post

What about the A6 Avant? Fantastic car, especially if they don't really want an SUV. The Lexus is also a wonderful car. The interior is stunning. Or what about a Volvo V70? The XC is a great car too and the R is really fast (260 hp), but the R will run you around 40k.
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Old 05-29-2000, 06:46 AM   #3
NickSTi
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Are they going to price themselves out of the market? Just wondering how many people will buy a $32k subaru as opposed to an Audi, or even worse, an SUV.
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Old 05-29-2000, 08:15 AM   #4
Paisan
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Post

Well, I am living proof that they priced themselves out of the market. I was ready to get the Legacy GT Wagon w/ Leather @ $24,000, until i drove it and it was a complete hog. I'd have waited for the VDC, but that will be at least $28+ K for the H6 and Macintosh Audio (and that is probably invoice price) so I went with a Trooper LS for $27,500, full loaded except for leather.

I hope they don't price themselves out of the market but I'm afraid they will.

-mike
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Old 05-29-2000, 09:30 AM   #5
Gambit
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Of course it will be more expensive! C'mon, these extra stuff costs money too! Also stop thinking that the Outbacks has lousy fit and finish. These days, the interiors in these Legacys are very nice and up to par with their class. So quit it with the pricing themselves higher. It will cost more. Alot of ppl who buys these Outback LTD H6 are quite loaded and not everybody wants a behemoth gas gussler leaf sprung Trooper which is by what? Isuzu?! Not to diss u paisan, u are a pratical person and I do hope u buying that SUV u will not use it to just go out to the market and grab some milk and carrots. But for ppl like Koosh' parents, the VDC H6 is a fine candidate. So what it's more expensive than an Avant, it has over 200hp and Mac systems etc.... I know alot of older folks like the luxury interior and won't mind paying for it. Can u tell me that your SUV trooper will be more quiet then the VDC H6? Or even close to the reliability of Scoobys? I hope some of you can get my point. Subaru has to survive too. If they are not making money with the Outbacks, we wud still be chugging along with Brats and ol XTs. Or worse, there would not be a Subaru presence here anymore. Which means many of us will prolly end up owning a Civics!

Sorry for the rant. If the car is worth it's value then why not support the creator?
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Old 05-29-2000, 11:14 AM   #6
John2.5RS
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Question

What does VDC stand for?
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Old 05-29-2000, 11:40 AM   #7
KooshDogg
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Location: Washington, DC, USA
Post

thanks guys for the responses thus far, and John no one can really explain VDC better than Subaru themselves hehe, so check the webpage, hehe

aside from that, hehe as much as i value paisan's opinion he's way too much of an SUV-enthusiast and biases this comparison hehe, like i said my parents didnt want one cuz of the incredibly large size and the trooper in particular is pretty high up... almost 11 inches higher than the outback

now, the a6 avant and v70 are basically pretty unremarkable, and if it were to come down to the VDC versus these guys, it would mean a difference of at least $6-7K less and probably better reliability, my parents arent the type to buy a car simply for the image (the es300 has proven itself dozens of times over though, hehe)

predictions for price? jus shout out whatever you think, remember i say the LL at $28-29 msrp, and the VDC $30-31k MSRP

thanks everybody,
Kourosh
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Old 05-29-2000, 03:37 PM   #8
Andy_T
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Post

"Pricing oneself out of the market" and "building a complete hog" are two completely different things (and if anyone thinks the Legacy is a complete hog compare to - what? a Trooper? - well, that's opinions for you ).

The VDC is supposed to be exceptionally stable under even ridiculous manoeuvres (it's been available elsewhere for a little while on the 2.5s). Very active management of throttle and brakes and allegedly very smooth operation/driver interaction, but not having driven it myself I won't comment further. The price will probably be close to the Audis, Volvos etc. but that's not surprising - all people want is a six-cylinder engine and they won't care about fit and finish, as long as it's got leather (and that six-pot). Why else would people still be buying truck-based SUVs?

I happen to think Audis are overpriced but that's only because they are priced as a premium product elsewhere (as in BMW-priced). Basically you'll never get a guy or girl out of their premium-priced German lifestyle wagons and into a Subaru, and you'll never get a Subaru driver (like me) into an Audi. Comparing merely on price is not a good idea.

Andy T
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Old 05-29-2000, 06:49 PM   #9
KooshDogg
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Post

actually one thing, the VDC would DECIMATE the trooper in terms of handling and acceleration, hehe roughly the same HP (diff of 3) but the trooper is bout 600 lbs heavier... anyways... i would place the outback (not the legacy wagon) in a different category than the audi and the volvo.. they're pretty much impressively-powerful AWD stationwagons, meanwhile the suspension and overall size of the outback make it a lil bit more than that, a better substitute for a small SUV..

and i dunno about the VDC costing near the same amount as the c70 and a6 avant (the a4 would be too small).. that would mean that subaru would have to justify about 8-9 thousand more for better AWD and 50 more horsepower

honestly, i think that the outback is a bargain for such a unique compromise

[This message has been edited by KooshDogg (edited May 29, 2000).]
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