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Old 03-30-2004, 08:01 PM   #1
wildbill99
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Default 2000 subaru 2.5rs intake and functional hood scoop

Im pretty new to the sport compact thing but im learning and it seems to me that if you just mate a good cone filter directly to the throttle body then remove the piece of metal that blocks up the hood scoop on the rs you should essentially have a cold air intake minus all the piping. the only problem i can forsee is the hoses coming from the valve covers and the intake manisfold. i have a solution and that is to tap a hole in the top of the filter and then run all the hoses to it. if there are any flaws in my thinking i would appreciate the info. i really dont want to spend 200+ dollars for a cold air if i can get the same results from a 50 dollar filter and some engineering.
thanks scott
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Old 03-30-2004, 08:56 PM   #2
SjYankee006
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And what happens when it rains? Do a search and you will find tons of threads about this and the different things people have tried; some worked, some didn't... I'd just save my money and get the COBB when you can afford it.
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Old 03-30-2004, 09:02 PM   #3
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Hoodscoops seem to be mostly beneficial to WRXers and their top mount intercoolers. Most threads on this subject will say that rain will be a major factor to any cone filter place under/near the scoop (water ingestion). Though some have had success with the setup you describe.

IMHO I have a MY01 RS and have a Ganzflow+K&N panel setup (CAI Tube+Filter= $110). Intake sound is great and air flow is smoother. There is a thread in the N/A forum discussing air temps of different CAIs. There are also a ton of thread in that forum about conefilter style CAIs.
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Old 03-30-2004, 09:18 PM   #4
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there is a whole intake setup made like that and its called the gravelsport intake sold for around 300 buckaroos

now heres a few things to think about since your new here. Its said putting a filter right on the throttle body will make a huge loss of torque due to the ramming of hair right into the engine. Also is the water soo if you use anything other than the K&N filter it will suck water in. But to much water the K&N wont be able to block it all. Causeing hydrolock but people say water in the engine isnt to bad as long as the intake isnt like submerged.

personalyl to me is wait for a good deal to pop up on an intake and buy it otherwise dont do this
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Old 03-30-2004, 09:42 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally posted by piker28
Its said putting a filter right on the throttle body will make a huge loss of torque due to the ramming of hair right into the engine.

damn hair getting in the engine
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Old 03-30-2004, 09:44 PM   #6
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damnit even if i fix it now people will know, oh well
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Old 03-30-2004, 09:55 PM   #7
Dr Ken
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Uggh, I don't mean to inflame, but I just feel I need to speak frankly.
There is a deeply held belief of the culture of this forum that rain ingestion is a real damaging entity. I would ask for substantiation of this theoretic concern, as I will contend that it is simply a myth.
I would advise that the aviation community has been using our Subaru engines, with raw ingestion of foul weather for decades. Their intake is basically some foam and about 8 to 12" of wide ducting... pretty much like a 'gravelsport'. What is more is that the typical cruising revs of these aviation engines is about 2400 RPM, not atypical from ours. The interest in the EJ blocks with essential stock internals, has only grown in interest as a very robust and reliable engine in the interim. As you can imagine, this is with very strict concern of resultant damage from adverse weather conditions. The fact remains, ingestion of rain into these engine poses no adverse effect as determined by people who places the lives of themselves and their passengers on their engine's performance ... and of the liable bureaucrats that insure this practice. I would defy (and, in fact, appreciate) anyone to find evidence to the contrary.

Now, hydrolocking is a large and sudden bolus of ingested non-compressible fluid, such as from a cold air intake introduced into standing water. No question this is a cause of real damage. This is an entirely different entity from that of raw rain ingestion.

There are many who have plugged a cone on the intake and noticed loss in low end ... something about a standing wave to maintain this...but the physics is beyond me. The intakes that perform have a minimum length.

Thanks,
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Old 03-30-2004, 10:32 PM   #8
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-Good point. SOME water is not a great thing, but not the engine-killer that a full cylinder of water woudl be. I've splashed a little water into an old car, and had it stutter a bit, but nothing a 106k mile rustang LS couldn't handle...which is to say not a whole hell of a lot. Still, the cone filter on the TB thing seems like arbitrarily 2nd-guessing the basic design of the intake, and I can't see any reason to do that. You get a decent supply of cool air by simply removing the snorkus and blocking off the fender well. That's absolutely free, arguably legal, and at least won't have Officer Friendly asking pointed questions when you get pulled over for having done absolutely F'K All.


-did I wander a bit?
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Old 03-30-2004, 10:40 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dr Ken
Uggh, I don't mean to inflame, but I just feel I need to speak frankly.
There is a deeply held belief of the culture of this forum that rain ingestion is a real damaging entity. I would ask for substantiation of this theoretic concern, as I will contend that it is simply a myth.
I would advise that the aviation community has been using our Subaru engines, with raw ingestion of foul weather for decades. Their intake is basically some foam and about 8 to 12" of wide ducting... pretty much like a 'gravelsport'. What is more is that the typical cruising revs of these aviation engines is about 2400 RPM, not atypical from ours. The interest in the EJ blocks with essential stock internals, has only grown in interest as a very robust and reliable engine in the interim. As you can imagine, this is with very strict concern of resultant damage from adverse weather conditions. The fact remains, ingestion of rain into these engine poses no adverse effect as determined by people who places the lives of themselves and their passengers on their engine's performance ... and of the liable bureaucrats that insure this practice. I would defy (and, in fact, appreciate) anyone to find evidence to the contrary.

Now, hydrolocking is a large and sudden bolus of ingested non-compressible fluid, such as from a cold air intake introduced into standing water. No question this is a cause of real damage. This is an entirely different entity from that of raw rain ingestion.

There are many who have plugged a cone on the intake and noticed loss in low end ... something about a standing wave to maintain this...but the physics is beyond me. The intakes that perform have a minimum length.

Thanks,
Werd,

As long as there is a significant amount of air inducted instead of all water, there should be no problem.

-paK +2
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Old 03-30-2004, 11:56 PM   #10
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I have used the filter on top for over a year with no issues at all. I even take my car to the drive-thru car wash and still runs like new. The water never seems to touch the filter. It feels like you lose some lowend not to much but, it sure picks up on the topend side. I say try it and I'm sure you'll like it since you will only spend a few bucks.

Thanx,
Art
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Old 03-31-2004, 12:19 AM   #11
wildbill99
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appreciate all the info. had a chance to see how much water could come through the scoop when it started to down poor shortly after i posted. took the metal out blocking the scoop and duc taped (im from ga) a old t shirt in place and drove around for a while. after driving for a good hour and half in a down poor the t shirt has almost completely dry. ive decided to go ahead with my plan. with the way i drive the loss at the lower rpms shouldnt have much affect on me. and besides if i dont like it i already have the filter right. thanks again will let you know how i like it.

scott
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Old 03-31-2004, 09:23 AM   #12
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whenI had that setup, I used breathers on the cam covers
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Old 03-31-2004, 02:42 PM   #13
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Could someone please verify this:

I've heard that small amounts of water/moisture are the best thing for cleaning deposits from an engine. People will purposely drain water into the intake of a running engine to clean out any carbon deposits. Apparently it works better than anything else. And if you're running a turbo motor its like mother nature is providing you with a free "relative" octane boost.
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Old 03-31-2004, 03:03 PM   #14
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uhhhh i wouldnt do it but you can be like the test hampster for us all
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Old 03-31-2004, 03:55 PM   #15
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dont drain water in, but spraying water in is ok, like from a bottle water spayer. just dont go over board.
Shane
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Old 03-31-2004, 09:39 PM   #16
donut
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Default RAM AIR

Hey Guys
does anybody have any pics of wut they have done? i have been toying with different ideas to make a real ram air intake. i know a couple of guys with some GM cars with factory ram air. they let me poke a prod there cars to see how gm does it. all i realy found was that they put a hole in the hood and a small dam to catch the water tha s builds up and then the air filter.

Wut i want to do is make a box that would fit right under the scoop for a flat filter. the box would direct the air right into the throtle body throught the MAF sensor.but i heard the MAF sensor could not handle alot of vibration so i would have to isolate it some how. i started working on a prototype using sheet metal just to test fit and work out some bugs. but i'm an electrician and not a real good metal smith yet. i would like the final peice to be fiberglass or plastic. if anybody has any other ideas shoot them my why

later Donut
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Old 03-31-2004, 09:54 PM   #17
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To do what you want to do, donut, you would have to mount the MAF right on the throttle body, and that wouldn't leave room for a filter. Now, if you did it using one of the hood vents (there is a little scoop you can buy to replace the vent), that would probably work much better, as you would be able to pull the air down then through the MAF, and then have a smooth tube from the MAF to the TB. And from what I've heard the MAF in the 98 is a hot wire style MAF, much sturdier than the hot film MAF in the 99. The MAF in the 98 shouldn't give you any problems.
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Old 03-31-2004, 11:51 PM   #18
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Here are pictures of my current setup:




My old setup:


My future setup:


any questions?
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Old 04-01-2004, 08:23 AM   #19
donut
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Default sweet

thanks for the pics. i remeber seeing the scoop for the vent but i haven't seen it for a while. machine where did you get those breathers?
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Old 04-01-2004, 09:44 AM   #20
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[IMG]http://img1.photobucket.com/albums/0903/MachineAgeVictim/impreza25rsintake.jpg[/IMG

where did you get that tiny filter thing?
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Old 04-01-2004, 10:08 AM   #21
PARANOID56
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at lest you could do it right
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Old 04-01-2004, 10:09 AM   #22
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and those breathers are avaliable from almost all autoparts store. you can also get them from www.summitracing.com
expect to pay about 10-20 a piece. oh, and i dont think that will pass smog either.
Shane
www.paranoidfabrications.com
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Old 04-01-2004, 10:51 AM   #23
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not my autopart stores
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Old 04-01-2004, 11:34 AM   #24
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www.summitracing.com go there
Shane
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Old 04-01-2004, 01:01 PM   #25
wildbill99
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went out and bought me a cheap advace auto cone filter yesterday and put it on. it feels like i did loose some low end but when compared to the gain in upper end and the sound id say that the 20 dollars spent on the filter and the short amount of time spent installing was more than worth it. does anyone have any # confirming that you do lose in the lower end or is it all just speculation. from what i can tell its almost like the bottom end just stayed the same but the fact that there was such a big gain in the upper it just feels like you lost. again thanks for all the info.

scott
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