Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Wednesday December 17, 2014
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Home Registration is free! Visit the NASIOC Store NASIOC Rules Search Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Calendar Archive NASIOC Upgrade Garage Logout
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC General > Newbies & FAQs

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-08-2004, 11:25 PM   #1
hoku123
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 41853
Join Date: Aug 2003
Vehicle:
2002 Impreza WRX
RED

Default Down Shifting from 2nd to 1st

Ok So i dont know what to say so i will just say it all and i hope it makes sense. I down shift a lot and i was just wondering why is it that i cant go from 2nd to 1st going like 35 mph i put the clutch in and then move the stick up but there is a big force holding the stick basically in neutral. After i hold the stick there for a good 2 seconds (still going the same speed) the stick goes into 1st. IT just seems really wierd to me because down shifting from any other gear doesnt do that and i was just wondering if that is normal, or am i doing something wrong? By the way once i get the stick into 1st and before i let out the cluch i rev the engine enough but i dont think that has much to do with my question. So if someone could just inform me a little on this subject i would appreciate it.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
hoku123 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2004, 11:32 PM   #2
Mike Wevrick
RIP 1/19/64 - 7/23/11
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 24654
Join Date: Sep 2002
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: saraseager.com
Vehicle:
1957 Taggart Comet
atlasshruggedpart1.com

Default

It's normal. 35 mph is pretty high to be downhifting into 1st. Try double-clutching; that will make it go into 1st much easier.
Mike Wevrick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2004, 11:32 PM   #3
skimmilk68
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 53385
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Hippyville, CO
Vehicle:
05 Titan 4x4
Puh-tooey

Default

hey be happy you can get it in 1st at all . .. seems like you're forcing it in though, most of us cant get in 1st at all when the car is moving. i love my wrx in almost all aspects but tranny is bleh... i guess you can consider our cars the perfect girlfriend with a 3rd nipple
skimmilk68 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2004, 11:50 PM   #4
hoku123
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 41853
Join Date: Aug 2003
Vehicle:
2002 Impreza WRX
RED

Default

thanks guys i appreciate it
hoku123 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2004, 12:05 AM   #5
joebobanaught
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 43566
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: BA
Vehicle:
2002 WRX Sedan
Silver

Default

You can try rev matching and double clutching. It makes getting into gears a lot easier, but 35 mph is pretty high for 1st
joebobanaught is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2004, 01:19 AM   #6
virulous
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 14035
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Union City, CA
Vehicle:
2002 Impreza WRX
Midnight Black

Default

Quote:
Originally posted by joebobanaught
You can try rev matching and double clutching. It makes getting into gears a lot easier, but 35 mph is pretty high for 1st
exactly... rev matching should be enough
virulous is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2004, 11:15 AM   #7
Mike Wevrick
RIP 1/19/64 - 7/23/11
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 24654
Join Date: Sep 2002
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: saraseager.com
Vehicle:
1957 Taggart Comet
atlasshruggedpart1.com

Default

Quote:
Originally posted by virulous
exactly... rev matching should be enough
Well for whatever reason its not. Double-clutching does the trick for me most times. 35 mph should be at least 3000 rpm in 2nd, though, so why would you want to downshift into 1st at that speed?
Mike Wevrick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2004, 11:24 AM   #8
Mopho
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 32334
Join Date: Jan 2003
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: Suitcase-my stuff lives in LA
Vehicle:
05 Outback
Caterham 7 Superlight R

Default

I've never owned a car that would let me put into first at anything less than a crawl. They are designed that way (with a lock out), so people who try to put it into first at 35mph don't blow the tranny/engine/diffs/etc.
Mopho is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2004, 12:04 PM   #9
WRXGR
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 58487
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Boston, Mass
Subaru Stars

man it's no wonder everyone is blowing tanny's!!!! i don't know of any car that would allow u to put it into first at any speed higher then 5 mph. I'm a mechanic and know better. when you force the tanny into that kind of abuse your only asking for trouble. This is why I'll never buy a used wrx
WRXGR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2004, 03:45 PM   #10
ITWRX4ME
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 24472
Join Date: Sep 2002
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Marshall, Virginia
Vehicle:
2001 Miata
White

Default

Quote:
Originally posted by WRXGR
man it's no wonder everyone is blowing tanny's!!!! i don't know of any car that would allow u to put it into first at any speed higher then 5 mph. I'm a mechanic and know better. when you force the tanny into that kind of abuse your only asking for trouble. This is why I'll never buy a used wrx
So, would you say that accelerating to 35 mph in first gear then lifting the throttle, allowing the car to decelerate, is abusive?
ITWRX4ME is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2004, 03:55 PM   #11
Aphex28
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 11506
Join Date: Oct 2001
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Nashua, NH
Vehicle:
2015 WRX
WRB +TE37-TA

Default

I don't really get the car back into first unless im going slower than 10mph.. i don't like forcing it in there. But if you really need to get in there, double clutching and revmatching works
Aphex28 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2004, 04:16 PM   #12
Gfunk720
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 42549
Join Date: Aug 2003
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: You can find me in the 203
Vehicle:
E92 BMW M3
2011 VW TDI Wagon

Default

Quote:
Originally posted by ITWRX4ME
So, would you say that accelerating to 35 mph in first gear then lifting the throttle, allowing the car to decelerate, is abusive?
No, but dont expect first gear or your syncro's to last very long when you are forcing it into first gear at 35. Go in the NE forum and ask Zac if you dont believe me, he went through 2 tranny's playing that game. I havent really been able to do it in many other cars, but forcing it is not the way. If you really need to, try to rev match it....
Gfunk720 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2004, 05:27 PM   #13
Caddy Daddy
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 11070
Join Date: Oct 2001
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Wisconsin
Vehicle:
2004 SG9, Audi S8
Ducati ST2, BMW R100/7

Default

Quote:
Originally posted by WRXGR
man it's no wonder everyone is blowing tanny's!!!! i don't know of any car that would allow u to put it into first at any speed higher then 5 mph. I'm a mechanic and know better. when you force the tanny into that kind of abuse your only asking for trouble. This is why I'll never buy a used wrx
no kidding

HOKU - if you like your car, dont put it into first gear or reverse unless you are at a complete stop.
Caddy Daddy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2004, 10:08 PM   #14
hoku123
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 41853
Join Date: Aug 2003
Vehicle:
2002 Impreza WRX
RED

Default

what is rev matching? is that just reving it to where i thing it wouldbe in that gear at that speed? but i will take all your advice and not do it.
hoku123 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2004, 10:18 PM   #15
Caddy Daddy
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 11070
Join Date: Oct 2001
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Wisconsin
Vehicle:
2004 SG9, Audi S8
Ducati ST2, BMW R100/7

Default

Quote:
Originally posted by hoku123
what is rev matching? is that just reving it to where i thing it wouldbe in that gear at that speed? but i will take all your advice and not do it.
thats the idea of it. to answer your original question, to downshift into 1st from 2nd, push the clutch in, drop it out of 2nd and into neutral, let the clutch out completely, give it a little throttle 'blip' (not too much), and while its 'blipping' push the clutch back in and gently direct the shifter from N into 1st. that way, you dont hit the lockout on 1st, and the car is much happier. this should all take place in ~ 1 second, and when you do put the car into 1st gear, you should not be exceeding 5-10 mph unless you want unpleasant surprises down the road.
hope this helps

the term 'rev-matching' has been thrown around and defined with different meanings, FYI
Caddy Daddy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2004, 10:55 PM   #16
collegedropout
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 42569
Join Date: Aug 2003
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: M-Dub & L-Town
Vehicle:
adds to the douchery
level round' here...

Default

Doesnt 35mph seem a little high for a downshift!!!! I mean that would be above redline in my WRX.
collegedropout is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2004, 11:25 PM   #17
Mike Wevrick
RIP 1/19/64 - 7/23/11
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 24654
Join Date: Sep 2002
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: saraseager.com
Vehicle:
1957 Taggart Comet
atlasshruggedpart1.com

Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Caddy Daddy
if you like your car, dont put it into first gear or reverse unless you are at a complete stop.
bah! You are right about reverse of course, but there is no reason you should not downshift into 1st just like other gears. Not at 35 mph, though, and not by forcing it in.

And AFAIK there is no "lockout" on 1st.
Mike Wevrick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2004, 12:10 AM   #18
WRXGR
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 58487
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Boston, Mass
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Gfunk720
No, but dont expect first gear or your syncro's to last very long when you are forcing it into first gear at 35. Go in the NE forum and ask Zac if you dont believe me, he went through 2 tranny's playing that game. I havent really been able to do it in many other cars, but forcing it is not the way. If you really need to, try to rev match it....
you hit the head on the nail Gfunk720....again in any car u dont want to drop it in 1st above 5mph. anything above and your'e really chewing up the syncros
WRXGR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2004, 02:04 AM   #19
LatentWagen
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 50315
Join Date: Dec 2003
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: New York
Vehicle:
0508 Saabaru & specB
Stage: Maintenance

Default

complete stop for first is nonsense... how else does one expect to rip out of a hairpin turn (on the track of course)? my wrx loves that move... hard breaking into a turn, heel an' toe to second at 50, again to first at 25... music to my ears.

back to reality... for day to day driving, the downshift into first isnt very important. try a little throttle blip, to match the rpms to gear (figure the ratio according to your speed). dont fuss with downshifts tho too much. its fun to engine brake and all... but wouldnt you rather wear your brake pads than your engine/tranny/clutch?
LatentWagen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2004, 03:48 AM   #20
firedust
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 38795
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: West Midtown Atlanta
Vehicle:
2003 WRX
Sonic Yellow

Default

doesnt first gear in redline hit 35 mph?

heh...dont do that.


once the oil warms up i can get into first at about 12-15 mph if i need to....i double clutch if i need to in stop n go traffic..but as of late im just a bit harder on the brakes. i need this tranny to hold up another 30K but i got plenty of moeny for new pads and rotors.
firedust is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2004, 10:53 AM   #21
fastsubie
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 21999
Join Date: Jul 2002
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Central PA
Vehicle:
2012 Wrx
OBP

Default

maybe if 1st had a triple cone syncro like a real tranny should you could get it in above 10mph. Mine is worse than anyones. Mine wont go in above 5mph! Double clutch, rev match, heel toe, nothing will get it in. I'm saving for a 6spd swap or maybe just a RA gearset and new syncros. This car would be sooo much better at the track if you could wip out of a low speed corner in first at 60000 rpm instead of 2nd at 3000rpm.

My $0.02

-fess
fastsubie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2004, 11:41 AM   #22
Jaux
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 56923
Join Date: Mar 2004
Vehicle:
04 wrx
silver

Default

Down shifting on 35mph, 1st gear...in any car I think it is pretty high I wouldn't wanna risk anything.
Jaux is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2004, 01:39 PM   #23
Gfunk720
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 42549
Join Date: Aug 2003
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: You can find me in the 203
Vehicle:
E92 BMW M3
2011 VW TDI Wagon

Default

Quote:
Originally posted by midnite_wrex
complete stop for first is nonsense... how else does one expect to rip out of a hairpin turn (on the track of course)? my wrx loves that move... hard breaking into a turn, heel an' toe to second at 50, again to first at 25... music to my ears.
Why do people keep encouraging down shifting into first at over 5-10? Do you not realize that the tranny will just not tolerate action like that for long? There is a reason that it doesnt just pop into place, because there is too much tension on the gears to make the switch cleanly.
Im not saying it cant be done, because it can. But if you value your tranny and arent looking to do a gear swap in the next 20k miles, why even attempt it?

Like I said, If you dont believe me go search around in the tranny forum. Countless people have destroyed these weak trannies because they think they can drive this car like their old honda or BMW. Fact of the matter is that the suby gear box is out dated, and cant really handle the power being driven through it..

I guess it is a good way to motivate yourself to switch to RA's, which will be several thousands of dollars
Gfunk720 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2004, 01:59 PM   #24
joebobanaught
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 43566
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: BA
Vehicle:
2002 WRX Sedan
Silver

Default

Quote:
Originally posted by midnite_wrex
complete stop for first is nonsense... how else does one expect to rip out of a hairpin turn (on the track of course)? my wrx loves that move... hard breaking into a turn, heel an' toe to second at 50, again to first at 25... music to my ears.
It is possible to get it into 25 w/o much trouble with correct rev matching, since you're matching the engine speed to the transmission speed, there isn't much tension on it (correct me if i'm wrong). Because if i'm going 15 mph, and i need to get into first, let's say because I need to go up a hill, then being on such low RPMs in 2nd won't give me the power to do so. Therefore, the logical thing to do is go into 1st to get the revs for the power to get up the hill. When you're on a street, you can't just stop, get into first and then go. So it is possible to slide it in w/o much trouble if you can rev match correctly.
It's hard to get it into 1st gear if you just leave the car idling unless it is basically at a complete stop, but it becomes almost effortless if you rev match it.

Though, I rarely ever downshift to 1st, it is very possible to do so without going to a crawl or a stop and without forcing it to do so. I think 35 mph is really high to be in first, but 25 doesn't sound too bad.
joebobanaught is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-10-2004, 06:59 PM   #25
jedjed1
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 46937
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: New Jersey
Vehicle:
2004 STi
Silver/Silver

Default

Why would you possibly want to downshift into first at all? Second is such a versatile gear. In my STi, I can be going 3 mph and have no problem just chillin in 2nd. I was taught to never ds into 1st when I first learned to drive a manny. Why would you want to do that?
jedjed1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
90 loyale shifting from 2nd to 3rd brokenrim Transmission (AT/MT) & Driveline 0 10-11-2006 11:16 AM
Shift from 2nd to 1st on tight turn. How?? Rally Punx Motorsports 56 04-09-2003 12:09 PM
('93-'01) Can you downshift from 2nd to 1st at 15 mph? Cupholder Impreza Forum 36 10-22-2001 08:44 AM
('93-'01) Test drove a WRX (again) - No problem downshifting from 2nd to 1st Cupholder Impreza Forum 4 10-21-2001 09:04 AM
weird noise when down shifting from 3rd to 2nd Ghostrider Vancouver Impreza Club Forum -- VIC 7 03-31-2001 05:55 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:19 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2014 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2014, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.