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Old 05-07-2004, 07:13 PM   #1
ebeck
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Question Cheap quiet RCA's please? Experts, please contribute.

I spent 60 bucks for 1 monster cable. That still picked up ignition noise. I spend a few bucks for some unknown, pulled out the monster xlr.... whatever, cable put in the no name and whalla , no no noise. Put back in the monster ther is that noise again. pulled it out, put in the no name, noise gone.

Can someone please tell me, unequivocally, what is a shielded RCA cable to run from my head unit to amp that does not pick up altenator/ignition noise? Not some reference, 2 inch thick, $30 per foot, jobby either. I got a crappy $8 cable that has good shielding, so money does not solve this issue.

No, I have no idea what it is, and the place has no more.
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Old 05-07-2004, 08:34 PM   #2
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Anything from the following should work just fine.

http://www.knukonceptz.com/productMa...0Interconnects

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Old 05-07-2004, 08:40 PM   #3
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twisted pair does not have to be expensive and works better than shielded.
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Old 05-08-2004, 08:03 PM   #4
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I really like Stinger cable personally

I got a few of the dream series when I built my set and they were only $25 each for 13ft.
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Old 05-08-2004, 08:19 PM   #5
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shielded and twisted pair are good for preventing different types of noise. Shielded single conductor cable can be susceptible to ground noise, which plagues cars.

going balanced is the best, but can be very expensive to convert. twisted pair has many of the benefits of balanced (which are also usually twisted or braided) without the expense of converting.

I'd go with an inexpensive twisted pair.

good luck
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Old 05-09-2004, 12:53 AM   #6
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ditto for knukonceptz.com, best for the money.
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Old 05-10-2004, 07:05 PM   #7
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Thanks for the good replies....... I will go twisted pair. My cheap ones I mentioned. They are a twisted pair.
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Old 05-10-2004, 09:43 PM   #8
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Have you considered the fact that the XLN is most likely FAR MORE clearer than the no-name stuff, hence transmitting more ground and ignition noise? At higher volumes, without the interference, the XLN will give you tons better sound quality.

Have you tried grounding your system better. That'll solve most of your problems.
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Old 05-10-2004, 11:06 PM   #9
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Twisted pair is designed for balanced use. Unbalanced, use shielded.
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Old 05-11-2004, 03:35 AM   #10
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mattjk used to (maybe still does) make the twisted pair cables.
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Old 05-11-2004, 04:10 AM   #11
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Not twisted pair. Braided silver with telfon dielectric.

BTW, I made these before Rockford!

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Old 05-11-2004, 08:31 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by redwagon
Twisted pair is designed for balanced use. Unbalanced, use shielded.
not necessarily true. balanced cables are generally braided, with the ground positive and negative conductor all braided together. twisted pair works well for unbalanced RCA's with the ground and conductor twisted for the same reasons, though, minus the additional inherent noise rejection of the balanced configuration.

the problem with shielded is that the shield (ground) isn't lossless, and the noise ends up coupling to the shield more than the center conductor. Unless you lift a ground at one end, you're potentially introducing ground noise into your system using shielded. Lifting the RCA ground at one end poses problems too.

twisted pair is afflicted by the noise in the same magnitude on the conductor and the ground, so it has less effect on the signal.

The ideal unbalanced cable would be shielded twisted pair with the ground lifted at one end. Coincidentally (or not), this is exactly the type of cable that is used in high ambient noise unbalanced audio cabling runs.
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Old 05-11-2004, 09:32 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally posted by robmarch
The ideal unbalanced cable would be shielded twisted pair with the ground lifted at one end. Coincidentally (or not), this is exactly the type of cable that is used in high ambient noise unbalanced audio cabling runs.
You may be right, but typical car audio components do not allow lifting the ground. I have read test reports on induced noise carried out between sheilded and twisted pair, and shielded did better at audio frequencies. If you have a noise problem, then look for a shielded, twisted cable. If not, just use regular shielded interconnects. There are more important things to worry about.

Linky
Another linky

Last edited by redwagon; 05-11-2004 at 09:45 PM.
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Old 05-12-2004, 04:28 PM   #14
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there is a lot of good information in those thread, and some that is open to interpretation. For example, the assertion that car audio RCA grounds can sink a lot of current to ground, and so noise on the coax sheild doesn't matter is 100% false. This exact case is why I've had to use Triaxial cables on some critical noise sensitive testing. Theoretically, ground is ground. In reality, transmission lines operate with instantaneous current on the "ground" lead. I'm not interested in being "that guy" so I'll just leave it at that, and encourage everyone to read the articles, and come to their own conclusions, as you and I have both done.

If we could all run Low Impedance balanced braided/shielded runs in our cars, we'd all be very happy.

As is, which is better, a cheap twisted or a comparably priced coax? We'll all have different opinions. It certainly depends on the equipment used, quality of design and grounds, and drive levels, as well as the proximity and frequency of the noise.
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Old 05-12-2004, 09:18 PM   #15
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For groung, I have an 8 guage wire. I drilled the floor pan, sanded it to bare metal, cleaned it with MEK and ran a stainless bolt through with lock nut. The ground is solid.

Still, the cheap wires make no sound. The high dollar Monster XL... make noise. Even if I switch the channels, so it is not the channel. The noice goes to what ever speaker the Monster cables ar hooked to. I will say that the noise is minimal. Much less than the other wire I had laying aroung which prompted me to buy the monster cable. (kids broke my other no noise cheap cable)

If grounding was the problem then
A) wouldn't I hear the altenator whine with either cable sets.
B) the cheap shielded cable is better at defeating noise.

I would have expected more from an expensive cable. Perhaps those cables only work in th eperfect world.

My car is next. Full JL Audio. Any specific product model wires to use would be nice. The knukonceptz seems nice. Any others?
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Old 05-12-2004, 09:27 PM   #16
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I don't want to argue circuit theory either, but I tend to believe Dan's data on cable testing since he isn't selling any
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Old 05-12-2004, 09:33 PM   #17
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that's cool. it's important to have trusted sources. not everyone can (or wants to) do the comparisons themselves.
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Old 05-12-2004, 09:33 PM   #18
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All I know is that the only logical reason why most audio still runs unbalanced signals, is to keep monster cable in buisness.

Other then that, I am getting losed, back to the ICIA training I guess
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Old 05-13-2004, 04:51 PM   #19
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I'm runnin stinger's right now and It is sounding pretty nice
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Old 11-29-2004, 11:38 AM   #20
ebeck
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I had the same problem. Monster cables were crap. And no the cables are not sooo good that you hear noise other cables mask becasue they are inferior or some other nonsense argument.

I made the same post. I read through it all and bought Stinger cables. Twisted shielded ones. Problem solved. Real cheap. The lightning audio worked well to and are cheaper.

Interistingly enbough, Monster does sell a cheaper line of twisted shielded cables. They are translucent red jackets with foil sheilding. I bet they work well. Large chain stores love hoaring out the super expensive Monster stuff that does not perform. Well, at least not in my car. And yes the ground points were the same. I ran the cables over the seats to the amp. I could plug and unplug the cables and you could hear the noise from thre Monster XLx cables compared to the Stingers.

Same problem in my wifes mini van and apparently your car too. Must be problem with the Monster XLx cables or at least mine. shrug.

Bought Stinger, Zero noise. Zero. Nothing else changed.

Good luck
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Old 11-29-2004, 01:22 PM   #21
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I've also heard bad things about the monster cables.

I've used stinger and knu cables in my installs and never had a problem with either. The build quality on the stinger dreams was definitely better than the knu, but they're also more expensive. I'm using both right now in my car actually.
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