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Old 05-19-2004, 11:01 AM   #1
SupraTT&WRX
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Default Can I run a VF39 with out tuning my car

Is it possibly or will I run way to lean? I will be running stock boost 14.7psi.

Chris
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Last edited by SupraTT&WRX; 05-19-2004 at 11:37 AM.
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Old 05-19-2004, 11:37 AM   #2
overdose
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hell you can't run the stock turbo without "tuning" it
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Old 05-19-2004, 12:09 PM   #3
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I would recommend against it. A few months ago, someone tried it and blew their motor at stock boost levels. I would recommend you get the supporting mods for any turbo upgrade.
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Old 05-19-2004, 12:34 PM   #4
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Default Re: Can I run a VF39 with out tuning my car

Quote:
Originally posted by SupraTT&WRX
Is it possibly or will I run way to lean? I will be running stock boost 14.7psi.

Chris
But at stock boost, that turbo is going to flow more air. You'll go lean, and it will pop.

Really, there should be a sticky or a FAQ or something.

Q. Can I do xxx to the engine without add-on management?
A. No
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Old 05-19-2004, 12:39 PM   #5
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Default Re: Re: Can I run a VF39 with out tuning my car

Quote:
Originally posted by ascott
Q. Can I do xxx to the engine without add-on management?
A. No
It's funny because it's true
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Old 05-19-2004, 12:48 PM   #6
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Default Re: Can I run a VF39 with out tuning my car

Quote:
Originally posted by SupraTT&WRX
I will be running stock boost 14.7psi.
stock boost is 13.5 and if you're gonna run a larger turbo without tuning, run it at even lower boost levels.
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Old 05-19-2004, 12:50 PM   #7
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YES YOU CAN RUN IT!!!!...........but you have to have it at much lower boost. If I were absolutly saet on running it without engine managment, I wouldnt run it any higher than about 8-10 psi.

And if you're going to run it that low, you're not going to have any fun with it so it will pretty much be a waste of time.
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Old 05-19-2004, 01:19 PM   #8
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if you had to you could run it off the wastegate spring but no more .. still not a good idea..

how ever
vf39 +injectors+cobb stage 2.5 +turbo back = huge bang for hte buck

350+350+595 +700.... ~2k should be good for at least 220whp
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Old 05-19-2004, 01:20 PM   #9
ascott
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Quote:
Originally posted by camz911
YES YOU CAN RUN IT!!!!
Well, you CAN do anything. You CAN drive the car off a bridge into a river, but you really shouldn't.

The computer runs the car. The programming is based on the components installed in the car when it was stock. *Any* change to a modern emissions-controlled vehicle is going to result in a non-optimal tune.

You've taken the computer program that runs the system and thrown out all the assumptions under which that system was designed. If the assumptions become wrong, the program becomes wrong, and the wrong program has a high probability of damaging the car.

If you plan on altering the power output of the engine, your first modification should be engine management and a competent tuner.
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Old 05-19-2004, 02:09 PM   #10
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ASCOTT, you quoted only one part of my post. If you would have taken the time to read the rest of it you'd realise that it was NOT a recommendation to do so, it was merely stating that he CAN do it if he wants.

Somebody needed to clarify for him his options. People who posted earlier said that it can not be done. I simply said that it can.

so correct me if i'm wrong. According to your post, engine managment should be gotten before a downpipe or even a catback.....WHY??? mods such as those are not great enough to necessitate the use of engine managment. It would help to utilize the power potential of the parts, but it isnt a do or die mod.
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Old 05-19-2004, 02:22 PM   #11
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I never said it couldn't be done, I said I recommend against it. You stated that you could do it if you lowered boost levels, he was talking about running 14.7 ... in which he would most likely run too lean. So, in the spirit of the original question, I would say it can't be done without the use of some sort of engine management.

However, this is starting to escalate into a flame war, so we should stop here.
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Old 05-19-2004, 06:08 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jaxx
how ever
vf39 +injectors+cobb stage 2.5 +turbo back = huge bang for hte buck

350+350+595 +700.... ~2k should be good for at least 220whp
Just a turbo-back and reflash give you 220whp. Seen
HERE.

VF34 + injectors + Cobb Stage 2.5 + TBE = 270ish whp. Seen Here. Probably a little less because he has some other support mods. Maybe in the 250-260 range.
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Old 05-19-2004, 09:41 PM   #13
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on a dyno jet

but not on a mustang or dynapack

but the point is mute ... get the supporing mods and have fun
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Old 05-20-2004, 02:25 AM   #14
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I have seen a guy grenade a motor on the dragstrip at the 1000' mark because he had a VF39(running 20psi), UniChip, TBE, and no injectors...it leaned out, and POP!!!

Good Thing you're doing your homework

Steve
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Old 05-21-2004, 12:57 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally posted by camz911
ASCOTT, you quoted only one part of my post. If you would have taken the time to read the rest of it you'd realise that it was NOT a recommendation to do so, it was merely stating that he CAN do it if he wants.
And if you'd read the rest of my post, you'd realize you just repeated what I said.

Quote:

Somebody needed to clarify for him his options. People who posted earlier said that it can not be done. I simply said that it can.
He doesn't need his options clarified, he needs to do a ton more reading on how an engine works before he starts asking questions that have been answered innumerable times.

Quote:

so correct me if i'm wrong. According to your post, engine managment should be gotten before a downpipe or even a catback.....WHY??? mods such as those are not great enough to necessitate the use of engine managment. It would help to utilize the power potential of the parts, but it isnt a do or die mod.
Everything between the MAF and the last O2 sensor is a system. That system is regulated by the computer. If you alter the system, you have to alter the control or you're asking for trouble. If you want to effectively modify these cars, the first thing you get is some kind of management. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.
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Old 05-22-2004, 09:57 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by ascott
And if you'd read the rest of my post, you'd realize you just repeated what I said.



He doesn't need his options clarified, he needs to do a ton more reading on how an engine works before he starts asking questions that have been answered innumerable times.



Everything between the MAF and the last O2 sensor is a system. That system is regulated by the computer. If you alter the system, you have to alter the control or you're asking for trouble. If you want to effectively modify these cars, the first thing you get is some kind of management. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.
Well man you want to be like that about it. I know plenty about how a engine works and how the computer mannages it. Subarus act a little different than the car I was modifying (815rwhp Supra) now granted it was a fully built motor and AEM ECU with a monster turbo. I stock supra you can put a larger turbo on run the stock MAF and stock ECU with a SAFC and put out a little under 500rwhp. Now a engine is bassicly a air pump right, so the maf measures what is going in O2's measure what is comeing out. So by that measure the if you were to go with a larger turbo (like a supra) the maf would sense the extra air and richen the A/F. Now subarus will not do this to the extent a Supra will, and I know this, I was more asking how far it will compensate. No need to be a ass

Chris
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