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Old 07-08-2004, 02:46 PM   #1
jawbrkr
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Default Suspension differences between wagons and sedans and my03, and my04.

I know of a couple of things, but if anybody knows anything else please let me know.

Shocks/Springs my04/my03
The shocks are different on the my04 and my03, the my04 has a bigger lip to hold the spring in better, and it has a different tophat in the rear. The shock difference is so minimal, that 04 springs will work on 03, but with the according tophat. With 04 springs on 03 shocks, there is an extra lip on the shock, which you can use a grinded/modded washer to fit over it and close the lip.

Front endlinks are different on wagons and sedans
The sedans have a built in spherical bearing front endlink while the wagon uses the typical rubber bushing.

Shocks, springs are different on wagons and sedans
It will work, but the sedan shocks are shorter and have camber problems with wagons, you need another set of camber bolts to get more negative camber. Springrates are obviously different, they are about 10lbs stiffer on the wagon.

swaybars are thicker on the sedan
Do I need to explain more?

My biggest question, if anybody knows, will sti aluminium control arms fit on a wagon, and are they're anything different with the rear lateral links and trailing arm links between the 02/03 and wagon and sedans?

Anybody has anymore to add to this, about the differences please do, I'm curious to know the differences.
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Old 07-08-2004, 07:43 PM   #2
Mark Avery
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Default Re: Suspension differences between wagons and sedans and my03, and my04.

>Springrates are obviously different, they are about 10lbs stiffer on the wagon.

The fronts are the same 163 lb/in. The rears are different:
Sedan - 119mt/129at
Wagon - 132mt/144at

>swaybars are thicker on the sedan
The fronts are the same 20mm. The rears are different:
Sedan - 20mm
Wagon - 17mm

>will sti aluminium control arms fit on a wagon
No, at least not the ones readily available here. There was, I believe, a GC8 aluminum control arm that will fit, but they're hard to find.
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Old 07-09-2004, 12:23 AM   #3
Arnie
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Just to add a few more details...

Shocks/Springs my04/my03
there's actually a big difference in the shock valving between the 02/03's and 04's. The 04's are much more firm in their initial travel. The piston shape at the threaded portion is different between the 02/03 and 04. The 02/03 have a bit of a shoulder after the threaded part compared to the 04 which simply have a long threaded portion.


Shocks, springs are different on wagons and sedans
The struts on a wagon and sedan are actually the same physical length. The difference is the bottom portion or the bracket where the two 19mm cleavis bolts go. The sedan bracket is a bit longer (or wider, depending on how you look at it) than the wagon strut. When the sedan strut is bolted onto a wagon hub, it rotates the upper bolt hole of the hub farther outward (because of the shorter control arm), thus giving you less negative camber. Its pretty hard to explain without seing it in action. A 2nd camber bolt in the lower postion helps get some of that camber back.

swaybars are thicker on the sedan

sedan had a 20mm rear bar for 02 and part of 03 I believe, they then went down to 17mm as well. baaaah.

As Mark inferred, the Sedan alu control arms are different in dimension to the wagon. They will, however technically fit. You'll need a sedan front sway bar and the sedan struts/springs as well. You'll then have the wider sedan front track. a few here have done it and are happy with the results. The old GC8 alu control arms will fit without any modification other than getting all the proper parts. They are available new but are very pricey compared to the sedan alu control arms. I think about 950 compared to 350 for the pair.

The trailing arms are the same on the sedan and wagon for all the years. The lateral links are different. The sedan have longer arms, about 1 cm wider, if I recall.
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Old 07-09-2004, 01:23 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally posted by Arnie
As Mark inferred, the Sedan alu control arms are different in dimension to the wagon. They will, however technically fit. You'll need a sedan front sway bar and the sedan struts/springs as well.
You'll want sedan front endlinks too. Are the sedan and wagon front halfshafts the same length? I think that the wagon ones have enough give to work but I don't know if this will cause premature wear.
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Old 07-09-2004, 01:30 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally posted by Arnie
swaybars are thicker on the sedan

sedan had a 20mm rear bar for 02 and part of 03 I believe, they then went down to 17mm as well. baaaah.

This is true, I believe they made the switch in 04. Also the STis apparently were switching around a bit too. I think they started with 20mm, and now are down to 19?

I thought for the 04's and up, the struts were the new inverted struts.
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Old 07-09-2004, 01:31 PM   #6
jawbrkr
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driggity: it's funny how things go back and forth between clubwrx and nasioc.
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Old 07-09-2004, 01:32 PM   #7
nocturn
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Assuming that half shafts are equal, would using sedan control arms with wagon struts give you too much negative camber? opposite to sedan struts with wagon control arms?
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Old 07-09-2004, 01:50 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by nocturn
Assuming that half shafts are equal, would using sedan control arms with wagon struts give you too much negative camber? opposite to sedan struts with wagon control arms?
That would depend on your definition of too much. I'm sure that I'd be happy with it but there are plenty of people that think once you go past -1 degrees of camber in front your tires will wear out in no time at all.

Quote:
Originally posted by jawbrkr
driggity: it's funny how things go back and forth between clubwrx and nasioc.
indeed
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Old 07-09-2004, 02:15 PM   #9
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The wagon half shafts are shorter, I hear, but there seems to be enough play to make it work. Driggity is right, you'll need the endlinks as well, I just didn't want to get into too much detail here.

yes, going the opposite in using the wagon struts would theoretically give you more negative camber. I would assume about as much as you would lose with the sedan stuff. So maybe an additional .5-.75 degrees? Interesing idea but since the performance wagon struts are so rare, its easier just to use camber plates or and additional camber bolt.

the 04's (WRX's) use the normal, non-inverted piston.
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Old 07-12-2004, 07:46 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally posted by driggity
You'll want sedan front endlinks too. Are the sedan and wagon front halfshafts the same length? I think that the wagon ones have enough give to work but I don't know if this will cause premature wear.
I had an issue with sedan alu control arms in my MY04 wagon.
Due to an accident,i had to replace my front wagon control arms.
The local dealer (in Greece) by accident sold me the sedan‘s control arms.
When i saw the difference with the stock control arms i asked him and he told me i could use them if i wanted to,but i had to replace the front sway and links with sedan’s.
So i did.
At this moment i changed also my struts/springs with H&R coilovers (since there are not suitable for wagons i had camber issue also).
After 2 months i ended have a destroyed driver‘s half shaft and Front Axle Hub destroyed also.
I changed them on warranty.

I didn‘t find out if this problem occured due to suspension or due to the control arms.

So since i have some stuff in my garage + prodrive springs just arrived

Would it be possible to use the sedan alu contol arms +sedan‘s front sway with sedan‘s front links+prodrive springs +KYB AGX struts with sedan‘s top mounts?

Has anyone similar setup?
My concern is about the half shafts.


P.S (sorry for english....)
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Old 07-12-2004, 11:47 AM   #11
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andreas_a: I don't know, I know it has been done and it works, but I don't konw how long becaues of the half shafts. I'm in the same situation, because I have this great deal for aluminium control arms, and I don't know if I should do it or not. If you find anything out, please let me know.
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Old 07-12-2004, 01:20 PM   #12
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Hi Andreas - the wagon and sedan half shaft assemblies have different part numbers so there definitely is a difference. One guy who did this mod also switched to the sedan axles and has had no problems. Till now, most of us have thought that the inherent play in the CV joint would be enough to compensate for the difference. if your situation is an example, then apparently there would be a problem. I think your best solution is to have the dealer replace the axle assemblies with sedan versions or go back to a wagon control arm, etc.

If you decide to use the KYB AGX solution, then get the WRX sedan version (actually they don't have an application yet for the wagon). Also make sure that you get the version for your year. There is a difference in the strut piston between the 02/03 (your 01/02?) and the 04 struts. Some people have had problems with the rear struts knocking because the rear hat from an 04 would not seat properly on the 02/003 strut.
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Old 08-02-2005, 12:45 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jawbrkr
Shocks, springs are different on wagons and sedans
It will work, but the sedan shocks are shorter and have camber problems with wagons, you need another set of camber bolts to get more negative camber. Springrates are obviously different, they are about 10lbs stiffer on the wagon.
So will 02-03 wagon springs fit on an 02-03 sedan struts? Besides shock travel, as I'll be getting Koni inserts.

Silly question, I know, but it is what I'm planning at the moment.

Tom
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Old 08-02-2005, 09:43 PM   #14
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As mentioned above the struts are the same length- it's the mounting "ears" htat are different- sedan's are wider.

If you put Koni inserts in a wagon strut- your golden If you put Koni inserts in a sedan strut- you'll suffer a ~ .7 degree camber "penalty"
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Old 08-03-2005, 09:33 AM   #15
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OK, how about USDM Sti struts, will they fit '04+ wagons? I guess they are firmer damped? less travel? shorter length? firmer springs but what rate? And if so, does installing camber bolts to rectify the camber changes be enough?
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Old 08-03-2005, 07:28 PM   #16
Mark Avery
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SlideWRX
So will 02-03 wagon springs fit on an 02-03 sedan struts?
Yes. The front springs are the same. Wagon rear springs are a little stiffer (119 v. 132), and a little longer.
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Old 08-03-2005, 07:41 PM   #17
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here is a question I've been searching around for a long time... is a washer (0310120000) part of Sedan strut assembly? or it goes only with a wagon?

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