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Old 08-22-2004, 04:38 PM   #1
LinuxGuy
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Default Crap, car won't start :(

Car has 70K. Wont start up. The starter cranks, but it sounds like the engine is spinning way too freely. Anything else I should check?

I Can't figure it out, ill just shoot it to the mechanic next week, if the repair is too much I may just sell as-is.

This Sucks.
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Last edited by LinuxGuy; 08-22-2004 at 05:05 PM.
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Old 08-22-2004, 04:52 PM   #2
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Any other clues? Like, how did it drive before you tried to start it?

If the starter is cranking the flywheel and the car doesn't start, could be a ignition problem or a fuel problem. More likely ignition, unless there's 0 fuel getting to the engine because it would at least sputter. When you crank it, the crank pulley turns right?
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Old 08-22-2004, 05:09 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeusExMachina
Any other clues? Like, how did it drive before you tried to start it?

If the starter is cranking the flywheel and the car doesn't start, could be a ignition problem or a fuel problem. More likely ignition, unless there's 0 fuel getting to the engine because it would at least sputter. When you crank it, the crank pulley turns right?
Car ran like a swiss watch before it happened.

I recalled when finding clues that all of the accessory belts turned. I'm really thinking its something internal and expensive I wont have time to fix on my own.

The only thing is this morning I had to replace one of my Morette lenses, which I did. I started the car up breifly, ran it for about 10 seconds and shut it off. I really dont beat on the car, its a highway baby.
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Old 08-22-2004, 05:20 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LinuxGuy
I'm really thinking its something internal and expensive I wont have time to fix on my own.
That doesn't sound likely, especially if you haven't been beating on it. Based on your description of the engine "spinning way too freely", it sounds like the starter may not be engaging the flywheel.
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Old 08-22-2004, 05:32 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowphun
That doesn't sound likely, especially if you haven't been beating on it. Based on your description of the engine "spinning way too freely", it sounds like the starter may not be engaging the flywheel.
That also ran through my head, Maybe the spur teeth on the flywheel/starter stripped out. But ill just shoot it to the mechanic next week to get the final verdict.
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Old 08-22-2004, 05:43 PM   #6
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Has any work been done in that area? Has the tranny ever been removed to replace the clutch? I've seen starters work themselves loose just enough to prevent the teeth from meshing.
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Old 08-22-2004, 05:52 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowphun
Has any work been done in that area? Has the tranny ever been removed to replace the clutch? I've seen starters work themselves loose just enough to prevent the teeth from meshing.
I had the clutch replaced under warranty for clutch shudder. But that was over 50,000 miles ago. (August 2002)
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Old 08-22-2004, 10:38 PM   #8
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Grab the starter with your hand and try to shake it. You may have to remove the intercooler to do that.

When you cranked it, the accessory belts moved so something expensive and internal doesn't sound likely.

Sounds like something ignition related.

Starter could also be dead, but if it moved the engine then that wouldn't be the case.

Try removing the spark plug for cylinder #1 (driver's side front) and placing it on the block. Crank the engine (or have a friend) and see if it sparks. That should narrow down the problem.
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Old 08-22-2004, 10:53 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeusExMachina
Grab the starter with your hand and try to shake it. You may have to remove the intercooler to do that.

When you cranked it, the accessory belts moved so something expensive and internal doesn't sound likely.

Sounds like something ignition related.

Starter could also be dead, but if it moved the engine then that wouldn't be the case.

Try removing the spark plug for cylinder #1 (driver's side front) and placing it on the block. Crank the engine (or have a friend) and see if it sparks. That should narrow down the problem.
Ill take a look at it tommrow when I get home from work. Thanks for the advice
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Old 08-23-2004, 10:05 AM   #10
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Maybe a dumb question, but have you checked/replaced the timing belt? Not sure what the schedule is for a WRX but your probably overdue.

Just a thought,
C
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Old 08-23-2004, 10:59 AM   #11
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Also, check all your fuses. It's a longshot but maybe an ignition fuse blew or something and it's causing the ignition to not fire. Like I said, it's a longshot!
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Old 08-23-2004, 11:04 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AngryBlueRS
Maybe a dumb question, but have you checked/replaced the timing belt? Not sure what the schedule is for a WRX but your probably overdue.

Just a thought,
C

And we have a winner, at least thats what my thought would be. Im sweating on mine right now with 60,040 on the clock. Hopefully, if it is his timing belt, it didnt break when the car was running and bend a valve.
-Ob
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Old 08-23-2004, 11:22 AM   #13
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Not likely. The tbelt is good for 105k miles. Any car that meets CA requirements since MY93 or MY94 has had to exceed 100k miles on the belt.

http://www.subaru.com/owners/care/sc...sp?pageID=2002
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Old 08-23-2004, 11:30 AM   #14
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Timing belts can go early. Just hapened to my brothers A4 and it borked the engine when it went. Definitely worth looking into. It should last to 105K, but there is no garentee.

btw - not all cars are to CA specs. My RS needs the timing belt changed every 60K.
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Old 08-23-2004, 11:44 AM   #15
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What year is your RS? Even our 98 2.5 Legacy was scheduled for 105k. Yes belts can fail, not sure if there's any warranty on the belt past the 60k miles drivetrain?

My 93 Miata manual tells me to change it at 60k, unless I live in CA then it's good for 105k. But it's the same belt.
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Old 08-23-2004, 11:53 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowphun
Not likely. The tbelt is good for 105k miles. Any car that meets CA requirements since MY93 or MY94 has had to exceed 100k miles on the belt.

http://www.subaru.com/owners/care/sc...sp?pageID=2002

Thanks for the link. I was shopping for prices on a timing belt, but I guess I can hold off for a bit.
-Ob
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Old 08-23-2004, 11:59 AM   #17
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My RS is a 98. The belts could last as long as a SOHC (99-01), but maybe they want you to change it because a belt failure on a DOHC does much more damage? I waited till ~75K to do mine.

Yeah, warrenty coverage is non existent. My brother talked to everyone he could at Audi and they wouldn't help him at all, even though the belt gave way at least 20K before it should have. Didn't matter because the powertrain warretny was up. Who knows, maybe SOA would be more understanding.

The maita thing (I'm sure it applies to almost every other car manufacturer too) is probably some kind of scheme to get more work for the service people

TMK
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Old 08-23-2004, 11:59 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Those Meddling Kids
btw - not all cars are to CA specs. My RS needs the timing belt changed every 60K.
I have a MY01 RS and the owner's manual specs the "camshaft belts" at every 30K. Two different dealers have told me the replacement increment is more like 60K as you stated.

I have *no idea* what the increment is for a WRX but if its 60K as well, and there is 70K on the ODO, its certainly worth at least checking out.

Chris
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Old 08-23-2004, 12:09 PM   #19
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Check the link, it's all spelled out by model year (and if it's a CA car or not). 30k, 60k, 90k are inspection points for the belt, change is due at 105k, even for your MY01. This is the manufactuers recommened change, if it makes you uncomfortable then change it early but it isn't a cheap job on the ej25. Ours looked as good as new at 103k when it came off earlier this year.
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Old 08-23-2004, 12:10 PM   #20
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1. The older 98 RS and the 2.2L Imprezas require a timing belt at 60K. My 2001 Impreza L is a 60K timing belt in the actual book, but looking online at Paul's link and at www.mysubaru.com it is not required at 60K. Interesting.

2. If the engine spins freely, then the starter is working, because the motor and drive belts are moving.

My guess is you have almost no cylinder compression, so the engine will spin very easy. No compression could be a bunch of reason:
1. No fuel/air mixture in the cylinder - fuel problem
2. If the timing belt broke (not likely) or jumped a tooth (could happen) your intake/exhaust values could be open at the wrong time, which would make the car have less cylinder pressure. But, if you had spark and fuel I'd think the car would run and/or backfire sputter at least.

My guess is you have no spark. Do you have fuel. Do you smell fuel?

Did you disconnect a ground somewhere when you replaced the morrette bulb? Check all your connections.

Paul G.

Last edited by paultg; 08-23-2004 at 12:18 PM.
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Old 08-23-2004, 12:18 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Those Meddling Kids
Timing belts can go early. Just hapened to my brothers A4 and it borked the engine when it went. Definitely worth looking into. It should last to 105K, but there is no garentee.

btw - not all cars are to CA specs. My RS needs the timing belt changed every 60K.
As does mine. Thats what the manual sez, anyway.

Not looking foward to doing mine (I'm at 55k now) this winter. I imagine the DOHCs are a real pain.
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Old 08-23-2004, 12:22 PM   #22
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Get a buddy to help hold onto the cam sprockets. It shouldn't be too bad.
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Old 08-23-2004, 12:30 PM   #23
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Probably what I'll end up doing. Still not thinking it'll exactly be fun.
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Old 08-23-2004, 01:28 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by americanyouth
Not looking foward to doing mine (I'm at 55k now) this winter. I imagine the DOHCs are a real pain.
There's a very detailed pdf of the procedure floating around, I can send it to you if you can't find it. I've done normal sohc t belts before without drama, but the procedure for the DOHC ej25 looked nasty. The belt tensioners need reseting or replacing, along with a couple of rollers. It is definitely an interference engine as well.

Paul
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Old 08-23-2004, 02:21 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowphun
My 93 Miata manual tells me to change it at 60k, unless I live in CA then it's good for 105k. But it's the same belt.
One of the main things that will effect the life span of the timing belt besides the design is the cam grind. The more agressive the cam the shorter the life of the belt if you use the same spec belt.

TMS
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