Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Tuesday December 23, 2014
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Home Registration is free! Visit the NASIOC Store NASIOC Rules Search Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Calendar Archive NASIOC Upgrade Garage Logout
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC Technical > Built Motor Discussion

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 11-25-2004, 02:23 PM   #1
gpatmac
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 18446
Join Date: May 2002
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Stratford, CT
Vehicle:
2002 WRX wagon
psm

Default Talk me out of swapping pistons on my own.

Needless to say, I've never done it before.

I want to put in some CP's and stainless or chromoly rings.

I'll have a machine shop score my cylinder walls...or could I effectively do that myself as well?
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
gpatmac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2004, 02:28 PM   #2
atc5
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 69264
Join Date: Aug 2004
Chapter/Region: BAIC
Location: San Mateo, CA
Vehicle:
05 LGT
White

Default

time, manuals, the RIGHT tools and someone that has done this more than 10 times by your side will be a winning combination to doing it right.

that said, if you have an engine stand and everything else above, then go for it!

if you're missing one of these things, don't bother
atc5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2004, 03:16 PM   #3
DarthChicken
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 9073
Join Date: Aug 2001
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Hillsboro, OR.
Vehicle:
2006 ariel atom
wrb/bbs gold frame

Default

If you can find somebody thats done it before, it makes life easier.... You just need the right tools, and the knowledge involved. Ring compressor.... a 14mm allen wrench for the wristpin plugs... an impact screwdriver to take off the rear cover on the block.... a way of pulling the existing wristpins out (you take the clips off, but then you STILL generally gotta either tap them out with a long screwdriver or have some way of pulling them out).... beyond that, if you've pulled your heads off before, you can do this.

Make sure when you get the pistons to have the bores measured (have a shop hone the bores and measure them for you at the same time) and measure the pistons. Take your time, double check your work, and you'll be fine.

If you're doing this, you might want to consider your clutch and anything else that you might be interested in doing, ie cams etc... this is your golden opportunity to rebuild it just the way you want to, and you might as well get it all done at once.
DarthChicken is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2004, 04:18 PM   #4
pio!pio!
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 4190
Join Date: Feb 2001
Chapter/Region: BAIC
Location: San Jose, CA
Vehicle:
2008 Impreza WRX STi
Aspen White

Default

you don't need a clean room to do this in?
pio!pio! is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2004, 04:27 PM   #5
DarthChicken
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 9073
Join Date: Aug 2001
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Hillsboro, OR.
Vehicle:
2006 ariel atom
wrb/bbs gold frame

Default

Well, I swept my garage... does that count?

(no, just keep everything clean, wipe everything off before you put it together and use lots of assembly lube)
DarthChicken is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2004, 04:59 PM   #6
gpatmac
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 18446
Join Date: May 2002
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Stratford, CT
Vehicle:
2002 WRX wagon
psm

Default

Thanks. I'll more than likely be doing this over the course of a month or months due to demands from my job.

You'll most likely see a whole lot of 'dumb question' posts coming from me.

Thanks for the input.
gpatmac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2004, 05:02 PM   #7
MJU1983
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 14364
Join Date: Jan 2002
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Saint Louis, MO
Vehicle:
2003 WRX, '06 Armada
05 Vette & 05 STi (sold)

Default

I know how to do it...
MJU1983 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2004, 05:17 PM   #8
gpatmac
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 18446
Join Date: May 2002
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Stratford, CT
Vehicle:
2002 WRX wagon
psm

Default

Hey yeah. And you're in Saint Louie, aren't you.
gpatmac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2004, 12:49 PM   #9
gpatmac
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 18446
Join Date: May 2002
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Stratford, CT
Vehicle:
2002 WRX wagon
psm

Default

I'm headed out to price hoists now.
gpatmac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2004, 05:46 PM   #10
Pavlo
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 23015
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Wellingborough, UK
Vehicle:
95-> GC8
Black, blue and blue

Default

Engine out first!

Not sure if there are any extra plumbing things that need removing on the latest cars, but on a classic shape it goes something like this:


Get the car somewhere where you can get the engine hoist on, preferably flat ground.

Remove your bonnet stay completely, and you should find it fits on the small tab on the passenger side suspension tower, and goes to a second slot on the bonnet, and holds the bonnet vertically, you don't need to remove the bonnet!

Remove battery, washer bottle, airbox, TMIC, MAF etc.
Undo hoses to inlet manifold
Drain oil
Drain coolant
Undo heater matrix hoses from engine.
Undo earth connections to block (if any)
unplug engine loom from multiplugs (near battery)
Undo any remaining electrical connections (ie those I don't remember or gauges etc)
Remove downpipe, or at least undo and leave loose in place.
Unplug fans
Remove coolant radiator.
Loosen PS hoses from engine/manifold
Remove PS pump and put to one side still plumbed in (this may be different with remote res cars)
Remove Aircon pump entirely, tie back on a cushion of some sort, be careful not to kink hoses.
Put in 4th gear, and use breaker bar to loosen crank pulley nut (this step is optional, can be useful to do it now).
Remove pitch stop mount
Remove starter and either tie back or remove leads.
Undo clutch fork pivot access plug on side of g/box
Remove clutch fork pivto bt threading in a longish m6 bolt (it should pull out, if it doesn't use a long bolt with spacers/washers to jack it out against the box)
Pull clutch fork up and out of release bearing (don't worrk too much)
Loosen all block bolts and remove, 14mm ratch ring spanner is ideal here, also be ready with 3/8 drive 14mm socket and U/J for the bottom ones which can be easier from under car.
Remove nuts holding engine mounts into subframe.

At this point put car on floor and back in neutral. Attach your hoist to the inlet manifold using rope (1/2" poly rope is fine) or a strop. Pick up on each side of the manifold roughly half way to get a reasonable balance.

You may find there is already a gap between box and block, in which case the next bit should be easy.

Pull up the engine with the hoist a little, basically enough to get the engine mount studs clear of the subframe. With luck you should be able to just pull the engine off the box, often it needs some rocking, and make sure you haven't pinched the heater coolant hoses between the pitch stop mount and bulkhead. If things are really stuck, then get out a cro-bar and start to prise the beast apart, althouh if you had the EN257 only a year ago I don't forsee any probs. Once partially apart, you should be able to slide the block all the way off the input shaft, keeping the engine as low as possible whilst still being able to move it.

Once clear of the box, up and out and into the garage to be transfered to a stand.

Before you get it on the stand, now may be a good time to remove the clutch cover and flyheel, with impact/air tools this is easy. However, if you have nether, then I would suggeset NOT loosening the crank pulley bolt while the engine is in the car. You can then use a 22mm socket to hole the crank while you loosen the clutch cover bolts. Once the cover is off, you can fix the crank position using a small length of plate with 2 holts between one of the holes on the block and a temporary bolt in flywheel. loosen the crank nut then the flywheel bolts.

With the flywheel off, get the engine on the stand ready for the actual job of swapping pistons. I or someone else can cover that later!

paul

(I may well have missed something, it's been at least a month since I took an engine out )
Pavlo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2004, 05:48 PM   #11
Pavlo
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 23015
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Wellingborough, UK
Vehicle:
95-> GC8
Black, blue and blue

Default

doh!

I just re read the thread title, you want talking out of it! Well, I made it sound easy so far! Oops!
Pavlo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2004, 05:56 PM   #12
ANZAC_1915
Moderator
 
Member#: 456
Join Date: Oct 1999
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Redmond, WA, USA
Vehicle:
2008 Forester XT
Steel Gray Metallic

Default

The important thing is to measure your deck height clearances before you remove the old pistons if you're getting the block decked or to measure the new ones once there. Sometimes pistons need machining.

Most people don't do this when they put pistons in but most engine builders will.

Are the rings pre-gapped?

You also need to check piston->bore clearance dry with a feeler gauge, and ring end gap in bore, regardless.

And in terms of scoring the bore, you mean "glaze busting". You can either buy or rent the drill attachment to do it, but don't go overboard. You don't usually need to do this unless the block has a lot of miles on it.

The first rule of engine building is to assume everything is wrong, and you should measure everything to make sure it is right.
ANZAC_1915 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2004, 06:09 PM   #13
gpatmac
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 18446
Join Date: May 2002
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Stratford, CT
Vehicle:
2002 WRX wagon
psm

Default

I was being facetious. I'm a little bit intimidated, but once I make up my mind, it's getting done. Damn, dude. I need to fly you up here to Indiana. Thanks.

Now, I'm not too worried about pulling the engine, but I just got off the phone with Quirt Crawford and he makes the task of pulling out the wrist pins sound like a bear (unless I've got Subaru tool #xxx.)

Anyhow, where I'm at right now. I am going to try and rent a hoist tomorrow. I have drained the oil (although I just changed it) and the coolant. The battery, WW fluid tank, and coolant overflow are all off. I'm buying CP pistons that are designed for lower compression from Crawford and most likely STi rings.

I'm also researching the cost:benefit of o-ringing the cylinders. Glenn, I'd love to fill in some of the gap of the water jackets, but imagine that that would be awfully expensive. When you say that pistons need machining, do you mean deburred and such or or do you mean rechecking claimed specs and then machining any inconsistencies?

Thanks and thanks.
gpatmac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2004, 06:32 PM   #14
ANZAC_1915
Moderator
 
Member#: 456
Join Date: Oct 1999
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Redmond, WA, USA
Vehicle:
2008 Forester XT
Steel Gray Metallic

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by gpatmac
Glenn, I'd love to fill in some of the gap of the water jackets, but imagine that that would be awfully expensive. When you say that pistons need machining, do you mean deburred and such or or do you mean rechecking claimed specs and then machining any inconsistencies?
Dunno what you mean about the water jacket.

Typically the ring manufacturer will either say the rings are pre-gapped or supply gap measurement (failing that rely on shop manual). You measure in the gap of the ring with a feeler gauge while it is sitting in the cylinder bore. Pretty easy to do. Some rings require special gappers to avoid chipping the finish, most likely if you buy high end rings they are pre-gapped for the specific bore size.

Some pistons (and this depends on the piston and motor) will need their deck height machined (height from center of pin to top of piston). Some pistons are designed this way, so you can pick your own compression ratio, but even ones that are an "OE" like fit sometimes will sit proud of the block (if it has been decked before). Again, go by what comes with the pistons and rings, or by default check the shop manual.

Pretty much anyone can install a set of pistons in an engine correctly, but the fit/measurements etc can be critical.

On my last engine (non Subaru) I had all of the machining/fitting done at a shop and did the assembly myself.

Glenn
ANZAC_1915 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2004, 06:45 PM   #15
gpatmac
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 18446
Join Date: May 2002
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Stratford, CT
Vehicle:
2002 WRX wagon
psm

Default

I was referring to the area where the red arrows are. I'm I makin' stuff up.



Yeah, I am leaning towards having the machining & such done by a local machine shop and I'll be damned if I pay some install shop $70/hr for something I can frack up myself.
gpatmac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2004, 06:50 PM   #16
DarthChicken
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 9073
Join Date: Aug 2001
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Hillsboro, OR.
Vehicle:
2006 ariel atom
wrb/bbs gold frame

Default

You can take the wrist pins out without the special tool... you just need a long screwdriver. Instead of pulling the wristpins out, you push them through the backside. Just make sure you're tapping on the wristpin and not the spring retainers when you do that

Get STi rings - they are pregapped for the STi bores. Of course, put them in the bore and double check that out anyway, but it should be just fine.
DarthChicken is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2004, 06:51 PM   #17
adamrmr
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 4338
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: santa fe, nm
Vehicle:
STi T3/To4e 433WTQ
tuned by Clark

Default

new pistons and no Sleeves ?? should be it when you have the motor off
adamrmr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2004, 10:00 PM   #18
gpatmac
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 18446
Join Date: May 2002
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Stratford, CT
Vehicle:
2002 WRX wagon
psm

Default


&



I'm going to research sleeving, but I'm anticipating that that will be too too expensive.

edit: And I'm most likely going with the STi rings, but it seems as though most of the 257 problems I read about on here are stock ring-related.

Know any chromoly or stainless (are those the same thing) rings that folks have had luck with wrt exacting tolerances and strength?

Last edited by gpatmac; 11-26-2004 at 10:11 PM.
gpatmac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2004, 10:30 PM   #19
hotrod
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 14141
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: 13.239@102.85 @ 5800 ft on 13T
Vehicle:
2002 Impreza WRX

Default

As mentioned above, assume everything is wrong and double check every spec and measurement. Even if your piston rings are "pre-gapped" double check them. Most any "How to rebuild your Ford/Chevy/Dodge engine" book at the book store will give you detailed instructions on the basic processes. You simply push the ring down in the bore and position it so it is square with the cylinder, and measure the end gap with a feeler gauge. A too tight ring end gap will be a fatal error, as the ring ends will butt up solid at high engine temps and sieze in the bore, sometimes ripping the top of the piston off, always doing bad things to the ring, piston, and bore surface.

If your replacing pistons, --- are the new pistons the same weight as the old? If they are different weights, you either need to, trim the new pistons to weigh the same as the old pistons they replace, or have the engine rebalanced. That would involve taking the pistons, ring sets, connecting rods and crankshaft to an engine shop so they can get all the weights and do the balance job.

My preference would be to do the balance if you can. I've heard subaru does not always balance the cranks to the precision high performance demands. I had my Chrysler hemi, precision balanced when I built it years ago, and it was such a sweet running engine. You couldn't believe how much smoother it ran. It may not make a lot of additional power, but it will make a big difference in how smoothly the engine runs and rev's and is not all that expensive other than the time involved to get the work done. It might also improve the reliability of knock detection.

If you do choose to do the balance work, have the rods blue printed for length as well, that will give you uniform deck height and compression ratio from cylinder to cylinder.

Larry
hotrod is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-26-2004, 11:01 PM   #20
gpatmac
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 18446
Join Date: May 2002
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Stratford, CT
Vehicle:
2002 WRX wagon
psm

Default

Larry, I'm reading at:


The book says that there are 3 types of ring compressors. It doesn't look like any of them will break the bank. It says I should also get a ring expander as well.



These are the pistons I'm getting. Quirt says that they are designed for lower compression, although I'm getting way in over my head when it comes to measuring combustion chamber cc's, quench area, and piston dome (I had to pay my wife to type those big words for me.) Anyhow, I believe that these are direct replacement, although obviously not OEM. I'm anticipating that they will be spec'd the same, except for the dome. I'll make sure and weigh them, though.

Additionally, when I spoke with Quirt, he says it's impossible to know which heads that I have without measuring them. Doesn't that take wax to fill in the top of the cc? He says that mine would most likely be 49 or 51cc's with 51 being most beneficial.

It's becoming apparent that compression ratio is a much harder concept for me than I thought. Higher = the need for higher octane, but more potential for power. Lower, obviously opposite. I don't know which head gasket I need to shop for.

To be honest, there are many factors which all play an important part in figuring which compression ratio is best for me, and to be honest, all I know is what I want from my car.

For example, are these the same deciding factors which determine where you might want your max torque vs max hp? (ie. building torque at mid rpm at the sacrifice of hp at top end?) I know I'm rambling, but the brain just doesn't want to accept all of the information I'm throwing at it right now.

Anyhow, this is an awesome thread. I'm going to print it out, highlight key points and take them to the local machine shop. I know that this ain't a cheap hobby, but I'm guessing that balancing my crank, checking deck warpage...

I plan on using the stock rods, crank and bearing. By blueprinting, I don't understand what you mean. I'm Only anticipating buying the pistons and rings, new ARP head studs, and new HG (although which, I don't know yet), and those named tools, among others.

Thanks for the response.
gpatmac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2004, 03:02 AM   #21
hotrod
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 14141
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: 13.239@102.85 @ 5800 ft on 13T
Vehicle:
2002 Impreza WRX

Default

cc'ing the heads is pretty simple in theory. Just takes a bit of time, and attention to detail.

1. clean head and place it on a surface so it is completely stable and the gasket surface (facing up) is level both left to right and front to back has a very slight tilt (this helps get air out of the chamber later).

2. install a junk spark plug of the same type as you intend to use in the spark plug hole.
3. smear some vaseline or light grease on the valve seats and drop good valves in each valve guide and push them down so they squeeze the grease out. (this creates a liquid tight seal) carefully wipe off any excess.

4 smear some vaseline or light grease on the gasket surface of the head and put a flat piece of plastic ( usually a 1/4 inch thick piece of plexiglass with a small hole drilled in it). This forms a flat top to the combustion chamber. Position the hole in the plexiglass on the high side of the chamber so the air bubbles will migrate toward the fill hole.

5. slowly dribble ATF (its red color makes it easy to see) into the combustion chamber through the hole from a container. If you don't have a burrett like the big boys do, Just use a long slender piece of large dia plastic tubing. Fill it with more fluid than you expect the combustion chamber to hold. (in this case maybe 100 cc off fluid).

Mark the fluid level in the tube with masking tape. (measure at the bottom of the menescus -- the surface of the fluid will be curved use the bottom of the curve as your reference point ).

Dribble the fluid into the combustion chamber until it is full and has no air bubbles, without spilling any. Mark the new fluid level. Now use a graduated container to determine how much fluid it takes to refill your tube to the same starting level.

A good place to get a graduated container is at a photography store that sells home developing supplies. Also in a University town you should be able to buy a "graduate" (lab glassware not a student) where students pickup supplies for chemistry class.
Medical supply places, and veternary offices may also have graduated large plastic syringes without needles that they use for some medical proceedures.


=============

blue print is a generic term used in performance engine building meaning you match similar dimensions of parts to a common length, size etc.

In the case of connecting rods, you can have a quality engine rebuild shop "blue print your rods for length" so the center to center distance between the big and small end are all identical. On engine assembly you can have dimension tolerance stack up errors give you significant variation in the true compression ratio cylinder to cylinder.

Suppose one crank shaft throw is indexed a degree or two off its proper position or the swing on that crank throw if 3 - 4 thousands of an inch longer than the rest. If that cylinder happens to get the longest rod and the tallest piston as well as the smallest combustion chamber. It might move the top of the piston 10 - 15 thousandts of an inch higher than the shortest combination in the engine. That cylinder will have a slightly higher compression ratio than the others and more prone to detonation.

By selective assembly you can cancel out dimension variation, by putting a short piston on the long con-rod etc.

This sort of attention to detail is how folks like Quirt get 1000 hp out of an engine and keep it together.

Larry
hotrod is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2004, 02:50 PM   #22
Pavlo
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 23015
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Wellingborough, UK
Vehicle:
95-> GC8
Black, blue and blue

Default

That is all goo stuff, but I would just go ahead and do a dummy build. You will probably find you have perfectly acceptable deck heights, and that all pistons are even. 3-4 though out on the stroke isn't going to make a massive difference to combustion, the effects will be less than we already have with differing flows between cylinders.

If you do CC the heads then I could advise 2 holes close to each other as the surface tension of the oil means that it's often difficult to get oil in and air out at the same time. I use a syringe to measure the fluid, although a burette is the correct tool.

You should probably be aiming for a thicker gasket anyway, as you have the WRX heads, and even if they are 49 or 51cc, they are still miles away from the Sti heads. You can use a 1.6mm (uncompressed) gasket which is sold for the N/A EJ25, it's genuine subaru and 4 layer steel construction. This is what I currently, and also a number of others with EJ257 blocks and EJ20 heads here in the UK.

Paul
Pavlo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2004, 03:25 PM   #23
dwx
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 8343
Join Date: Jul 2001
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Atlanta, GA
Vehicle:
2005 2012 Jeep
2013 DGM BRZ

Default

Pulling the pistons is very easy. Putting it all back together generally is a little harder, but still easy. Quirt has CP make those pistons to be drop-in replacements for the EJ257 with the standard rods and crank, and he can supply rings as well, which I believe are just stock EJ257 piston rings. The rings aren't the problems persay on the EJ257, it's the ring landings. They have a tendency to chip off the piston. I've seen pictures of 10 failures at this point, including my own, and they are all the exact same thing in the exact same place.
dwx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2004, 05:00 PM   #24
gpatmac
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 18446
Join Date: May 2002
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Stratford, CT
Vehicle:
2002 WRX wagon
psm

Default

Nah, Paul. I have what I believe to be v7 STi heads and cams sitting on my bench which will go on as I do this.

Thanks, DWX. I have been thinking that the machining (or those things I'm not capable of doing) will be to o-ring the cylinders and MAYBE a few other things, based on time and money.
gpatmac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-27-2004, 05:47 PM   #25
Pavlo
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 23015
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Wellingborough, UK
Vehicle:
95-> GC8
Black, blue and blue

Default

oh, nice combo!

I would avoid trying to o-ring the block unless you can use a proper o-ring and coopers ring etc. The latest gaskets from Cometic also seem to be doing okay in oher engines I have heard of. Usual combo in UK is EJ20 heads (so that covers yours too) with the thicker EJ25 gasket, which appears to be the same construction as EJ257 with extra (4th) layer.

I wouldn't push the final CR over 8.5 if you want to run mostly on pump fuel, it's a useful increase over the factory CR though.

I'll get round to writing a piston swap thing, although I have some technical manual pages too (well the whole thing but it's big).

Paul
Pavlo is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
OT: Talk me out of talking people out of cars -=C=- Off-Topic 8 03-25-2009 11:27 AM
OT: Talk me out of/into a 240SX w/swap wrxfactor Off-Topic 54 07-19-2007 07:05 PM
Somone talk me out of trading my WRX in on a WS6 Drink Off-Topic 101 03-28-2007 11:42 PM
Talk Me Out Of It--wrx Gc8 Harness Swap JDMSUBAROO Subaru Conversions 4 02-07-2006 08:28 PM
Talk me out of painting my car Aspen White racepimp South East Region Forum 18 09-20-2005 01:07 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:06 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2014 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2014, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.