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Old 01-08-2005, 12:35 AM   #1
pottymouth
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Default Cobb Stage 1 and high EGT's

I just flashed Cobb Stage 1 91 octane and took the car out for a drive. I saw the EGT's spike to over 1725F WOT in third at about 5500 RPM's. Cruise on the highway is fine at about +-1400F, just WOT it is getting scary hot. I would get on it again and it seemed to level off at about 1650F.

I have an omori electrical gauge tapped on the drivers side manifold into the casting bung.

Anyone else see these crazy high temps? Is there anything I can do?
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Old 01-08-2005, 09:17 AM   #2
crazymikie
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Do you by any chance have a way to datalog (DeltaDash) to see what's going onduring the period of high EGTs?


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Old 01-08-2005, 11:08 AM   #3
pottymouth
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I wish I did, I may have to find a way. I audibly heard some pinging the first time I saw the high EGT's, so I know what happened there. Hopefully it is a learning thing with my CPU. Another interesting note is that we have always had 93 octane gas here but all the stations have switched over to 91. I hope it is a winter thing, but not a great development.

I may look at getting some Tulene added to this tank of gas and see if that helps cool things down.

Thanks for the replies.
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Old 01-08-2005, 11:20 AM   #4
crazymikie
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I'd offer to help you log some data, but AR is a long way from MA

If you manage to get some logs, I'd be interested to see what's going on. I have some Stg1 logs from an '05 wrx from a friend- I haven't had a chance to look through them, but I'll see what kind of EGTs he was getting.

Good luck!


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Old 01-08-2005, 11:48 AM   #5
pottymouth
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That would be very helpful, thank you.

I am going to do some more driving today, and get a friend to watch the EGT gauge, maybe I was seeing things.
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Old 01-08-2005, 07:44 PM   #6
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what can you use to log info from a AP?
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Old 01-09-2005, 12:18 AM   #7
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You can't log info with the AccessPort. I think the only thing it can do is read boost and display it.

The best tool that I have found is the DeltaDash by Ecutek. It lets you log any number of parameters. There may be some less-featured packages available, however, nothing as of now.

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Old 01-09-2005, 12:42 AM   #8
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I really think I got a horrible batch of gas, at least I hope. I am taking it very easy on the car now. I saw about 1700 before I got off of it in third today.

I know I could search this but I am lazy, if I heard the pinging, how much damage did I do to the engine? Should I worry about this or just keep listening to make sure I don't hear it?

Thanks for the help.
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Old 01-09-2005, 12:19 PM   #9
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Are you running the 91 octane map?? make sure you're not running the 93 map on 91 octane, that would make you run lean and have high EGT's like what you're describing. You may even want to look into the cali map, which is a detuned 91 oc map to help det. 1700 is unacceptable. I'm at stage 2.5 and i've NEVER seen 1600 WOT. I can't get it above 1550 WOT. Get off the gas when You hit around 1600, consistent temps above that number WILL cause severe damage to your engine.
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Old 01-09-2005, 12:30 PM   #10
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I am on the Cali map, I have tried everything. Bellieve me I am off the gas at 1600.

This is just a little scary, how many people out there don't have an EGT gauge and run these temps and don't even know it. Hopefully it is a bad tank of gas, if not then I am back to square 1 and very dissapointed. If other people aren't seeing these high EGT's what other causes could it be besides the accessport?

Thanks for answering all my newbie questions.
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Old 01-09-2005, 12:47 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pottymouth
This is just a little scary, how many people out there don't have an EGT gauge and run these temps and don't even know it.
You bring up a really good point. Just because it's off-the-shelf management doesn't mean you shouldn't monitor the health of the car.

I have to catch a flight soon, however, I checked the logs and the highest temp my friend saw running stage 1 was 1553 measured in the uppipe. Still seems higher than you. I'm not sure if that's with the 91 octane map or the 91 octane CA map.

If you'd like I'll check to see what conditions that temp came on at.


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Old 01-09-2005, 01:14 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crazymikie
the highest temp my friend saw running stage 1 was 1553 measured in the uppipe.
I believe those sort of temps equate to well over 1600 at the manifold near the block.. I am not so sure that is since the accepted max is around 1600F
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Old 01-09-2005, 10:20 PM   #13
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I found the problem. I did some more research on Cobb's site as well.

It seems that you have to have the base map at whatever stage you are on and then use the real time maps. I know this is probably common sense to most people, but I flashed the stock map as base and put the 91 octane Stage 1 map as the real time map.

I read on Cobb's site from trey that especially in the 2004's you have to have the base map at the stage you are at, because the real-time map can't adjust for all the parameters the base map can. This wasn't mentioned in the instruction manual anywhere I could see it.

I changed up the base map to California Stage 1 91 octane and set the real time map to normal Stage 1 91 octane and the highest EGT I have seen is right at 1500 wide open in third gear. No knock and nice and cool, cooler than stock in fact. I think this solved my problem.

Just thought I would close the loop here, thanks for all the replies.

2004 OWNERS MAKE SURE YOUR BASE MAP IS SET TO THE STAGE YOU ARE RUNNING WHEN USING THE ACCESSPORT.
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Old 01-09-2005, 10:32 PM   #14
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good stuff pottymouth..Let me make sure I have this right..

For Example: I buy the AP and I flash my ECU to Stage 1 base map and I make no other changes. Then I decide to buy a DP and flash a real-time stage 2 map while my base map remains stage 1. This is why Im getting very high EGT temps..In order for me to avoid these temps I need to reflash my ecu with a stage 2 base map and do nothing else.

Thanks for your info..I dont want to screw anything up when I go to stage 2.
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Old 01-10-2005, 09:38 AM   #15
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Well, if you have stage 1 base, stage 2 mods, and stage 2 real time, you won't be running high EGT's, you'll have most of stage 1 as your mapping so you'll be mostly running stage 1 parameters, which are more conservative then stage 2's. Do you see how that's the opposite of what potty mouth was doing? He was running a more agressive map as base (91 octane), and a conversative as real time (cali 91). . .doesn't make any sense to do something like that.


Glad to see you got it figured out pottmouth. This is very simple people, use the correct BASE map for your stage AND octane!!

Last edited by hondaeater69; 01-10-2005 at 10:34 AM.
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Old 01-10-2005, 11:18 AM   #16
crazymikie
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The makes sense I suppose- the infamous CL/OL delay is probably somewhere deep in the ECU and can't be modified by using a realtime map alone.

Good detective work


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Old 01-10-2005, 11:24 AM   #17
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I had my base map set at stock and ran Stage 1 91 as my realtime map and never saw or heard any problems but I don't have an EGT gauge. I guess I got lucky because I drove like this for 6 months and even tracked the car several times and never had any problems other than some pinging on mild throttle before letting the engine warm up.

Now I have gone Stage 2. I have my base map as Stage 1 91 and my realtime map set at Stage 2 91. Seems to work fine. I really have got to get some gauges though because this has me somewhat worried.
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Old 01-10-2005, 09:08 PM   #18
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I can get my stage 2 Cobb to hold 1600-1625 when I'm pushing it. It does worry me that it will sit there until I lift off. I still haven't figured out how worried I should be though, if at all. BTW, this is on an STi.
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Old 01-10-2005, 09:41 PM   #19
pottymouth
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Hondeater, I have the 91 octane as the base map and I am running the same real time map until they get 93 back here again. but yes it is simple now

WRX I think the main problem is with the base (stock) map and stage 1 or 2, I wouldn't think you would have as big of a problem if you had stage 1 base and running stage 2 realtime, but better be safe then sorry.
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Old 01-11-2005, 01:31 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pottymouth
It seems that you have to have the base map at whatever stage you are on and then use the real time maps. I know this is probably common sense to most people, but I flashed the stock map as base and put the 91 octane Stage 1 map as the real time map.

2004 OWNERS MAKE SURE YOUR BASE MAP IS SET TO THE STAGE YOU ARE RUNNING WHEN USING THE ACCESSPORT.
Worth repeating one more time.
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Old 01-11-2005, 11:42 AM   #21
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Before using the AP maps, you should read the map notes on the website.

"Base Map vs Real Time Map Differences -
The base mapping contains some additional logic for improved performance and is
HIGHLY recommended to be used if you plan on operating at a Stage1 level."
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Old 01-11-2005, 02:58 PM   #22
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I am running the Stage 1 91 octane base map and the stage 1 93 octane realtime map. Do you think this can cause any problems? I have had absolutely no problems doing this and the car is running great. Oh, and i use either 93 or 94 octane ALL of the time.
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Old 01-11-2005, 03:51 PM   #23
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I think mixing the octane between the base and realtime maps should be fine from what I've seen.

The thread does bring up something that bugs me- maybe if the documentation that comes with the AP were clearer, people wouldn't have these problems and questions.
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Old 01-11-2005, 04:40 PM   #24
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The problem is that you have people that THINK they know what they are doing. Potty mouth says "It seems that you have to have the base map at whatever stage you are on and then use the real time maps. I know this is probably common sense to most people, but I flashed the stock map as base and put the 91 octane Stage 1 map as the real time map."

Common sense to the use the same base and real time for what stage you're on!?!?!? Stop thinking people, you're endangering the welfare of your car! If you don't understand CALL COBB AND ASK THEM, THAT'S WHY GOD INVENTED THE PHONE.
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Old 01-11-2005, 05:01 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hondaeater69
THAT'S WHY GOD INVENTED THE PHONE.
God didn't invent the phone... Darwin did
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