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Old 01-08-2005, 10:19 PM   #1
bunot
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Default Switching back from OLF to CLF

ok. finally got my car back. the car is tuned with utec revision 4.2c with OLF. but since it's an auto, i have to retune it for CLF. how do i turn off OLF? is it just on the parameters? changing value from 1 to 0? is that all that's involved? do i have to rescale injectors (my injectors are UR 785s)?

i realize i would need to retune the car...is there anything else i should expect?
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Last edited by bunot; 01-08-2005 at 10:33 PM.
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Old 01-08-2005, 10:29 PM   #2
hippy
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That's not how it works. I mean yes, you want to switch utecs olf mode off, but just cause you're not using utecs olf mode that doesn't mean your using closed loop fueling. Also, injector scaling is part of utecs olf mode, so when you turn the utecs olf mode off, you will need to adjust the fueling via the fuel map instead of scaling the injectors(since ya can't scale em with utecs olf mode off). Here's a link to a bunch of info on wrx and utec fueling.

peace
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Old 01-08-2005, 10:43 PM   #3
bunot
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so...if injector scaling won't work once i have turned off OLF mode....what values do i put under injector scaling? or it won't matter at all, since the utec will not recognize any value input.
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Old 01-08-2005, 11:15 PM   #4
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Injector scaling is a "feature" of OLF - that's why it's in the Open Loop Parameters

If you turn off OLF, you need to completely retune your fuel map. It will be very very bad to drive it with your existing map.

Do you have a wideband O2 sensor? If not, you should definitely just take the car back to get retuned under CLF mode.
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Old 01-08-2005, 11:15 PM   #5
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Won't matter
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Old 01-08-2005, 11:29 PM   #6
bunot
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yes i do have the tuna.

i have an old CLF map tuned when i had an older revision 3.XX (whatever it was). will plugging the fuel values from this map work once i have turned off OLF (assuming no other mods have changed)?
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Old 01-08-2005, 11:33 PM   #7
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It should work. It would also be good to make sure all the parameters are the same and what not.

peace
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Old 01-09-2005, 01:04 AM   #8
bunot
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hmmm...ok, switched the fuel map back to CLF numbers...and turned off OLF in parameters. car idles fine, seems to run fine.

except when i go WOT. car seems to hit a wall. feels like fuel cut. no knock detected at all. looked at the map again, maybe i missed something, but no. everything is as tuned previously.

i'm guessing it might be something in the parameters that i may have missed that's causing what i am assuming as fuel cut at around 4K rpms @ WOT.

any suggestions?
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Old 01-09-2005, 09:49 AM   #9
serendipity
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bunot
hmmm...ok, switched the fuel map back to CLF numbers...and turned off OLF in parameters. car idles fine, seems to run fine.

except when i go WOT. car seems to hit a wall. feels like fuel cut. no knock detected at all. looked at the map again, maybe i missed something, but no. everything is as tuned previously.

i'm guessing it might be something in the parameters that i may have missed that's causing what i am assuming as fuel cut at around 4K rpms @ WOT.

any suggestions?
It's more likely misfires, caused by the car running exceptionally rich. Did you double check the parameters that were used when you were tuned for CLF? Are you able to see your fuel trims with an OBDII scanner? Maybe the 0% column is so lean the car has high fuel trims, causing it to run really rich in the UTEC CLF areas.

Also, keep in mind the 25% (default) threshold for switching to OLF no longer applies - it falls back to the 60% (default) value in the Tuner Parameters screen. (Not that this sounds like it's related to your particular problem...)
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Old 01-09-2005, 12:53 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by serendipity
It's more likely misfires, caused by the car running exceptionally rich. Did you double check the parameters that were used when you were tuned for CLF? Are you able to see your fuel trims with an OBDII scanner? Maybe the 0% column is so lean the car has high fuel trims, causing it to run really rich in the UTEC CLF areas.

Also, keep in mind the 25% (default) threshold for switching to OLF no longer applies - it falls back to the 60% (default) value in the Tuner Parameters screen. (Not that this sounds like it's related to your particular problem...)

it might possibly be running too rich. my AFRs are 9.99:1 right now @ around 5500-6000rpms. i hope this is the culprit, but then i've run 9.8:1 before in OLF while tuning the car and my plugs never misfired. i'll try to get it down to 10.XX:1 and see where that takes me. (fingers crossed)
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Old 01-09-2005, 09:07 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bunot
it might possibly be running too rich. my AFRs are 9.99:1 right now @ around 5500-6000rpms. i hope this is the culprit, but then i've run 9.8:1 before in OLF while tuning the car and my plugs never misfired. i'll try to get it down to 10.XX:1 and see where that takes me. (fingers crossed)
Why on earth are you running so rich?
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Old 01-09-2005, 10:02 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by serendipity
Why on earth are you running so rich?
probably because i'm running a different turbo since i switched from OLF to CLF. but that's beside the point.
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Old 01-10-2005, 10:19 AM   #13
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bunot... before you start tuning your fuel map, make sure your fuel trims are within spec. ie close to zero. otherwise you're shooting yourself in the foot.

ken
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Old 01-10-2005, 10:42 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ride5000
bunot... before you start tuning your fuel map, make sure your fuel trims are within spec. ie close to zero. otherwise you're shooting yourself in the foot.

ken

good call.....i'll source a scanner this afternoon and let you know what i find out.....
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Old 01-10-2005, 11:33 AM   #15
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Yeh, it's kinda questionable what will happen when the temp changes with your mods. I would say that it would be a good idea to put the trims to 0 on an average day(not hot or cold) so that when the temp changes it won't throw the fuel trims way off, but ya never know what will happen to the a/f ratio at boost when the weather changes. It would probably be good to get them to 0 on a cold day, a hot day and a medium day(3 different maps) and test what happens to the a/f ratioat boost when the weather changes to the opposite and in between. Ie, maybe if ya set the trims to 0 on a cold day and the weather gets warmer, the a/f ratio might lean out too much. If ya set the a/f ratio on a warm day and the weather gets colder, the a/f ratio might not get rich enough for the added air. Ya never know what will happen, but after testing you will most likely be able to figure out which way is the best/safest for your setup. Course this is all just my opinion, and I'm no expert.

peace
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Old 01-10-2005, 01:19 PM   #16
bunot
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woo-hoo!! it's a monday...finally called TXS and they said it's most likely the fuel cut switch on the utec. will check later.
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Old 01-10-2005, 03:53 PM   #17
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well, it wasn't the fuel cut switch.....back to the "it's too rich" theory. will update findings later.
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Old 01-10-2005, 04:51 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bunot
well, it wasn't the fuel cut switch.....back to the "it's too rich" theory. will update findings later.
Usually, that "wall" that you mentioned is too much fuel and/or too little timing. What turbo did you have before with that tuned CLF map and which one is on there now? Sounds like the spool time may be dramtically different. Personally, I would just start over with a new map since you've got the tools.
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Old 01-10-2005, 05:20 PM   #19
bunot
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmarcel
Usually, that "wall" that you mentioned is too much fuel and/or too little timing. What turbo did you have before with that tuned CLF map and which one is on there now? Sounds like the spool time may be dramtically different. Personally, I would just start over with a new map since you've got the tools.

yeah, i'm leaning towards the "too rich" theory. just took a deeper look at the logs, i was running 9.5/9.6:1.....way too much fuel.

after i get out of work, i'll run a few more logs with a much much leaner map.
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Old 01-10-2005, 06:59 PM   #20
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weee..i think running too rich was the culprit. leaned it out some and has improved the car so by so much!! there are still some flat spots and plenty of tuning hours left to go.....but i feel confident that the mystery is solved.

thanks to those who helped me out.
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