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Old 01-19-2005, 02:39 AM   #1
Kevin Thomas
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Default Techworks Header vs Borla

Guys, look what I just read at RS25.com--->

"--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I have a story for you guys...

We have a customer that built an n/a car.(AWDSub) He bought TechWorks cylinder heads: Stage2 SOHC cams, Ti valve spring/retainers, Stage1 port/polish, 5 angle valve job w/ new valves.
After the new heads, the car had awesome torque. The seat of the pants feel was great. Matt was satisfied.
He went to the drag races and found he had improved by only .2 sec! The car felt strong, but the 1/4 mile time said no improvement.
We swapped out the Borla header for a TechWorks header. No other mods. 1/4 mile times went from 15.2 to 14 flat!!!
The TechWorks header is equal length. That is the main difference. Keith from TechWorks described the Borla 'Blub' sound as "the sound of slow"!! The VW sound is great for low end, but the flow at the top end is terrible. Ever heard a Porsche make the VW 'blub' noise??? NO!!
Bottom line: Borla makes 6.5lb ft of torque@ the wheels(we dyno tested), and 2whp.on an otherwise stock car. The TechWorks header makes top end power(as yet not officially dyno tested on a stock car by RalliTEK Subaru). We found 22whp by changing the header (no re-tuning) on Matt's modded RS.

Borla - sounds cool, makes low end torque, hold back power on the top end

TechWorks(TWE) - smooth equal length sound, lots of power gain mid/top end.

-Sean

RalliTEK Subaru Performance Inc.
www.RalliTEK.com / www.rallitek.net"

From here: Borla vs Techworks Header
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Old 01-19-2005, 03:47 AM   #2
quest
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yea, ive never seen the point of borla headers...sure they sound great, but your money is much better spent on a set of ELs from Brullen, Cobb, or TWE.
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Old 01-19-2005, 10:36 AM   #3
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does the TWE still maintain that Boxer Rumble?
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Old 01-19-2005, 10:42 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Caplin 2.5
does the TWE still maintain that Boxer Rumble?
"TechWorks(TWE) - smooth equal length sound, lots of power gain mid/top end."
nope
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Old 01-19-2005, 10:57 AM   #5
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Am i seeing the price right, that its more than double the borla price?
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Old 01-19-2005, 11:01 AM   #6
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yes it is.
however considering the HP/$ ratio, EL headers win everytime.
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Old 01-19-2005, 11:34 AM   #7
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I'd switch over to EL headers in a second if I could find a set that actually fits with my 4EAT :/

Does anyone know of any makes of EL headers that do?
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Old 01-19-2005, 11:45 AM   #8
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Yes you do loose some of the rumble. But not too much really when compared to the stock y-pipe. The Borla's I've have more rumble than the y-pipe.

I have two issues with my now removed TWE SS header. Both of which I would have avoided if I had seen them mounted before I bought them.

1. It hangs low. Actually one loop hangs low. If you drive on gravel roads like I do (driving to the lake to go camping). Either find someone to make you a protective plate (reducing clearense even more) or see if one of the other Equal length designs have better clearense. Maybe TWE will update the design for more stock like clearence. Subaru's do have a rally heritage after all.

2. The pipes run really close to the steering couple boots (might be the wrong term) Well the heat from the header melted one boot. I'd like to see more heat retention (sheilds?) so the Cats light faster and to protect the under body more.



However the power in crease was very noticeable. Don't know if worth $1000cdn (they are only steel with a coating) ..... but the power is increased.

Anyway I have a dented pair of TWE SS headers (no pictures) with a small hole if anyone is interested. I hit dip and rock combo while driving (30- 40 km/h) on a gravel road.

SHawnrs
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Old 01-19-2005, 11:48 AM   #9
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Can somone enlighten me on what exactly equal length headers are, compared to regular ones?
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Old 01-19-2005, 11:55 AM   #10
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ShawnRS: are they completely trashed?
how bad / where is the hole?
where are you located?
you can PM me if you want.
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Old 01-19-2005, 12:23 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrBoy01
I'd switch over to EL headers in a second if I could find a set that actually fits with my 4EAT :/

Does anyone know of any makes of EL headers that do?
I'm taking my 4EAT in to Rallitek this Friday to take measurements so TWE can make a CAD design change so they can manufacturer equal length headers for us.
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Old 01-19-2005, 12:58 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrBoy01
I'd switch over to EL headers in a second if I could find a set that actually fits with my 4EAT :/

Does anyone know of any makes of EL headers that do?
I have the Cobb EL headers on my 02 RS 4EAT and they fit fine. Are they not supposed to fit?
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Old 01-19-2005, 01:46 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drowner
Can somone enlighten me on what exactly equal length headers are, compared to regular ones?
yeah. each primary tube coming from each exhaust port on the motor is the same length. this is quite a trick with a boxer motor, since the exhaust travels under the pass. side of the car, and you have a pair of ports on each side of the engine bay. since they are equal length, and since the cylinders fire in turn, the exhaust gas pulses reach the collector (where they merge) in turn, creating less backpressure and increasing exhaust gas velocity. TWE even goes one step better, and uses a merge collector, which allows for a greater increase in flow and less restriction. viola. equal length explained.
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Old 01-19-2005, 02:05 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Thomas
We swapped out the Borla header for a TechWorks header. No other mods. 1/4 mile times went from 15.2 to 14 flat!!!...

We found 22whp by changing the header (no re-tuning) on Matt's modded RS.
so 30 hp is worth over 1 seconde in the quarter mile?
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Old 01-19-2005, 02:08 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mr. m
so 30 hp is worth over 1 seconde in the quarter mile?

I know runing 5psi on my Outback Sport took me from a 17.5 1/4 mile average to a 15.8-15.9 average. However, it's much harder in the range you are talking about so.....

Yeah, I was saying the same thing as you to myself as well. Hrrmmmm!
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Old 01-19-2005, 02:16 PM   #16
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Screw the sound. Equal length is always better than not, except for people that think a boxer engine should sound like a Harley, which it shouldn't.

Are you saying that TWE headers lose THAT much torque compared to the Borla?
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Old 01-19-2005, 02:56 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deuce.five
Screw the sound. Equal length is always better than not, except for people that think a boxer engine should sound like a Harley, which it shouldn't.

Are you saying that TWE headers lose THAT much torque compared to the Borla?
Do you mean that the TWE header 'gain' that much torque?
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Old 01-19-2005, 03:00 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Thomas
Do you mean that the TWE header 'gain' that much torque?
I think he means down low, I was gonna get a set of the Borlas, but I guess after reading this TWE it is.
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Old 01-19-2005, 03:09 PM   #19
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I missed where it said some torque was lost.

I never found that myself. Over all everything is smoother, throughout the rev band. Low and high ends. Without being able ot give #'s all I can say is that the EL headers to provide more umph.

I could still drive up STEEP logging roads (2000- 2500rpm 1st or 2nd)) fully loaded with people and camping gear without any issue.

It is a worth while mod its just pricey for out come. With the new OBD ii emissions issues and how unfriendly my car is to excepting bolt on Mods I'll be saving my money for either and engine swap or a whole new STI.

The RS is a quick reliable AWD car. It is and never be an asphalt killer.
Now with some handling improvements...

Shawnrs
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Old 01-19-2005, 04:15 PM   #20
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I got some Borla headers on my 05 rs but im not too happy with them. Ive had them for about 1000 miles now, it feels like it didn't gain much power but the low end torque did pick up. I just like the rumble it gives even though i have the stock exhaust.
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Old 01-19-2005, 04:28 PM   #21
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Does anyone have any sound files of any equal lenght headers? I'd love to hear the difference. I wish I could hear the difference in real life though (I'm running borlas)
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Old 01-19-2005, 04:53 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShawnRS
I missed where it said some torque was lost.
im with deuce.five. im assuming the twe loses torque(down low) also since the statement makes no mention of what the twe does to the bottom end but does mention the top end while both low and top end are mentioned in regards to the borla.
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Old 01-19-2005, 04:59 PM   #23
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Sean from Rallitek said that the TWE's will be fairly close to a stock system down low, maybe a little loss even. But up top where to drag at, the power is increased across the whole band from 4000-6000 rpms. I think that I am going to go with TWE here soon.
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Old 01-19-2005, 06:20 PM   #24
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shawn rs - your headers are coated but you are still melting stuff? thats no good...
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Old 01-19-2005, 06:31 PM   #25
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I don't know. Cheap headers with great sound and improved bottom end fit my everyday driving better than high rpm track screamers that cost a big wad
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