Uh-oh! Don't say, DON'T SAY IT!... STi post!

[danc]

How many of you (1) think starting a petition to be sent to SOA for them to bring over the WRX STi is a good idea, and (2) how many of you would bother to sign it? petitiononline.com seems to make it pretty easy. Just curious of the interest. I mean, SOA has NOT actually said they are bringing it, so it seems valid. And both the UK and Australia have been promised it this year (well, Australia by Christmas, not sure about the UK). Sure, they drive on the wrong, err, left side of the road and all, like the Japanese spec., but... anyway. Trying to gauge interest. The new age Impreza was only released there like what, 6 months or so before ours? And >they've< gotten some word on the STi. Comments?

Eh, couple more hours to go.

[OldWRXr]

The Aussies & Brits have always had the STi in the older versions, so I see no reason they won't get it in the newer version of the Impreza.
The WRX as is meets all of the crash standards, and emissions for the US. Having 50 more horses under the hood shouldn't have any effect on the STi making it here as well. So, sit around and wait for it, `cause it's only a matter of time. The only thing is: how many will actually be sold to the public? Sometimes cars such as these are in limited quanities and are only sold for racing. No one really knows. A petition may be effective, but individual e-mail's, phone calls, and letters may be a better way to go... If *we* all got together and picked a date to e-mail, or send letters individually it would make a better statement as to how important the subject is to us.

[Mazoku]

IMHO, online petitions are for the most part a joke. They're a dime a dozen now, and I don't sign any petitions anymore because it annoys me how people start up petitions at the drop of a hat for just about anything.

A year or so ago before they were so common I used to sign them if it was something I really believed in. I think the problem is now that with all these automatic petition websites, starting a petition is so easy to do that their effect on the company you're petitioning to has been greatly reduced.

I agree with OldWRXr...everyone sending personalized emails to Subaru would have a much much greater effect.

[rubadub]

Is anyone gonna set a date, or should we all just pick a day?

[Buttsy]

Adding 50 more horses to the US version would be a big deal, they had a hard enough time getting the 227 HP 2.0L to pass emissions (read: tumble generator valve and no AVCS) and still be affordable; if they want to sell the STI at a profit, they're gonna have to get smart about emission controls or make it less of a performer. I don't see how they can bring it over, at 280 or so horses, and have it be priced and equipped to sell to the US market legally.

[Zahnster]

I think the lack of AVCS is a money thing. It should actually improve emissions.

[hp12c]

It is also possible that we will get some kind of special factory tuned version instead of the full on STI - such as what they are doing in UK with the UK300.

It's just hard for me to imagine that Subaru will bring over the STI in any large quantity. They are only expecting to sell 12,000 WRX wagons and sedans the first year. As of now, it seems that sales have been good in some areas but so-so in other locations. My friends in CT and Jersey said that there are quite a few WRX's just sitting on the lot. Even here in San Francisco Bay Area, surplus is starting to accumulate. I got mine for $700 over invoice and I know others who have purchased it for less.

Frankly, I have no experience with economics and marketing as applied to autos - but my background is in finance. (tho it's a still a stretch to apply any of that knowledge to this topic...so here it goes...)

It is common sense for Subaru to consider the current state of the US economy. There are a lot of people getting laid off across the board here in the US. Yet auto sales have increased from the last quarter...(which seems contradictory.) The only thing for certain is that our immediate economic future is clouded. Compound that to the fact that it's difficult to market the STI. (let's be honest, we all would donate our vital organs to own the STI, but would the normal Joe car buyer be able to appreciate it for what it's worth? There are enough people even here on the I-Club board who complained about the lack of a sunroof and leather in the WRX. In addition, there's not much awareness of the WRC as a sport here in the US. (I believe that fans of WRC in other parts of the world was what made the STI's and 22b's possible.) I don't care what anyone says, the STI if ever offered here will not be priced at 30K; if nothing else...simply because of support for parts and services. Let's say that it's offered starting at 35K with 40+K being fully loaded. To me that's still a bargin - because I am an auto enthusiast, but what about the general public? Again, in a year's time, there will be less auto purchases since this is pretty much the peak.

But in the end, I hope I am wrong. I would love to see that STI on the street and would also love the opportunity to own one as well.

[kevinsUBARU]

If they put enough bricks in the trunk, the weight will classify it as a light truck (Read: SUV)....thats a sure fire way to get around emissions

[JJTheSubeDriver]

The best thing that is going to induce SOA to bring the car here is sales of the WRX, and they seem to be strong. Also, Suabru wants to be first to the punch with an even higher performance model, they don't want to get beat out by Mitsu or ANYBODY ELSE- so I'm betting on it that:

1) They will bring it.
2) It will be 30-35K.
3) It will be americanized (READ: Slightly to moderately detuned from JDM Spec)
4) I want one sooo bad.

So bad in fact, I already put in an order for one yesterday. Now that will really convince them to bring it (orders). If it doesn't come or I decide I don't want it then I will by a WRX, have an APS 280Hp kit put on, and flywheel, clutch, suspension. Add all of this up and guess what- you're treading into 30-35K territory already, but I want a warranty still AND a 6spd.

JJ

[danc]

JJTheSubeDriver:

"Add all of this up and guess what- you're treading into 30-35K territory already, but I want a warranty still AND a 6spd."


EXACTLY! You CAN do lots of things to the WRX, but then you have warranty concerns, and still do not have a six speed. Why oh why can't they just bring it NOW?! Heck, I expect it to be americanized, but it'll still have the six-speed and be at least 260hp, with a warranty!

So it sounds like there's little to no interest in a petition. Anybody know a good email address of a big-wig at SOA? We could all dump a bunch of "bring us the Sti!" emails on them at once. I'm very skeptical of emailing the standard way (i.e. "Contact Us" from the subaru website) cause they may or may not even pass emails on.

Seriously, anybody know a good person to write? Like, say, a V.P. or something?

[nqwan]

buttsy, subaru did not have a hard time gettin our wrx to pass emissions. it only has 3 cats on there to be classified as a low emissions vehicle. i'm pretty certain that if subaru wants to bring the sti here, they can. its just a matter of whether or not it'll be profitable. subaru said it themselves, they'd consider it depending on the sales of the wrx.

also, i dont think any petition will change be the reason why the sti will come here if it does. if you want the sti to come here, i'd say the best thing to do is to go buy a wrx. subaru will see that demand for the impreza is up, then they'll bring the sti here. i mean, if the rs didnt sell at all, then the wrx would never have came here cause subaru would think theres no market for that kind of car here. its kinda the same thing with the wrx, subaru is not only tryin to make a profit on it, i think they're also testing the market here. get ppl into rallying, have them buy the wrx. then after they learn about the sti and start to want more, then get them the sti. weee more money for subaru. if everybody ignored the wrx cause they wanted a sti, i doubt the sti would ever get here. about the sti being americanized, i'm not so certain it will if it does get here. it all depends on who subaru wants to compete with. if i were subaru, i would let the current wrx sell for another year or two. if people want more, add more options like sunroof and things like that. if they want power, then bring the avcs and up the power to match the jdm spec. i think that alone will help boost wrx sales so they can ride out the wrx out a little longer and make more money.

[go go go]

I think Subaru is ready to bring their STi if they want to. If Porsche can bring 911 turbo, I don't see a reason why Subaru can not.
What's not ready is US market.
Remember what happened to RX7, Supra, and 240SX. We used to have good cars here. This performance market is so small. People still go buy pickup trucks in this country.
I bet Suabru is making more money with Outbacks rather than WRX.
I want to see STi here in US but I wonder if it worth for Subaru to bring it here.

[kevinsUBARU]

I think in the last fiscal quarter, Outbacks with automatic trannys accounted for 80% of Subarus sales

[ANZAC_1915]

If Subaru brings it in, it will be a "halo effect" car (e.g. Prowler) not to make a ton of money from.

The way to convince them to buy it is (seriously) go buy a WRX. The WRX demand will tell them how much the US wants it.

Detuning is due to one thing: gas octane. Nothing to do with emissions, you can make clean, fast cars.

I'm pretty sure it will come here, given the amount of work to get it type approved here, I'd say the price is going to be fairly steep $35k minimum (just my guess) and numbers will be as high as they can sustain sales for.

If I had to guess a number, I'd say 600 (1 per dealer). That would make the most logical sense.... any more than that and they risk getting stuck with a bunch of really expensive Imprezas.

Also, a lot of people "think" they want one, but when it comes down to it I'm not sure most of the people that own 2.5RS's or WRXs are likely to buy them given that a) a WRX with a MBC or turbo upgrade is just as fast, b) a WRX is a much better bang/buck proposition.

This is why I laugh whenever someone posts "I'm not buying a WRX, I'm waiting for the STi". (particularly if you're <25... how many people under 25 can afford to buy a car like that AND insure it?)

Anyway, Subaru will probably attract E36 M3 owners who can't afford the new M3.

Glenn

[geremy]

Why do ppl always want a six speed? If your at the track it's great. If your on the street the 5 speed is always better. Taller gearing means less shifting which for 99% of people means faster. Sure 1 in 100 ppl maybe able to shift in .08 seconds, but I bet that most of the guys screaming for the 6 speed are not that one, and will end up with a car that may feel faster but is driven slower.

[MX5_555]

Just one small correction. The STi has never officially been sold in the UK. THe Aussie did get a "in the end de-tuned" STI. In the UK Prodrive sold the 22B and the P1 through Subaru. The 22B was "re-spec-ed" to comply to Euro regulations (emmisions, lighting and such). All the Sti's in the UK are grey imports.
Mainland Europe never got to see these either.

Only Mitsubishi bothered to introduce their car (the EVO).

Nico van Steen
MY99 Impreza turbo
MY00 Mitsubishi Lancer EVO VI RS2

[ANZAC_1915]

Yep, they had big octane problems with the Aussie STis and a big consumer backlash (how would you feel about melted pistons?).

Also, the prices on the Aussie STi were insane, I think list was AUD$50k but then every dealer added on AUD$20k.

They imported 437 I think.

Glenn

PS the reason to have the 6 speed is it is MUCH stronger than the 5sp. New casing design, stronger gears, etc.

[danc]

My opinion:
I do think there is a bit of a psychological difference, at least for me, between $30k and $35k. I would be more than happy to buy a STi at $30k. $35k and I'm starting to think about it a lot more. But it's still an excellent value, so I would still get it. I do agree that no matter how good of a value it would be, $35k is going to exclude a lot of the target market. But I do think there's easily one person per dealer out there with the desire and money to buy one. I think they will find that's the case when they finally release it.

[JJTheSubeDriver]

I'm also willing to bet that only certain dealers will get them, and not all. Probably like the top 5-10 percent of dealers (30-60 total). I've heard these production numbers thrown around: 300, 1700, 40, 1000. Out of those 1000 and 300 are the most believeable to me. Why would SOA only make 40 for the US market, and why would they make more than 10% of total WRX's STi's?

On the other hand- Rallyguy2k's recent post about upcoming subaru models has seemed to disappear into thin air!!?? He was the one talking 40 Impreza STi's and Legacy Turbo and on and on.... Maybe the mods know something that we don't...

JJ

[MX5_555]

Unless Subaru will sponsor my guess is that prices will be fairly high. To give you an indication what is expected here:

normal WRX costs: US$ 28,600
STI is expected at: US$ 43,000
EVO7 is expected at US$ 47,500

(for comparison: a new BMW M3 costs you US$65,000 overhere).

In the UK a price of aroud UKP30,000 is expected for both the STi and the EVO7.

Taxes and such make the car more expensive overhere, but these figures might give you an indication what to expect.

Nico van Steen
MY99 Impreza turbo
MY00 Mitsubishi Lancer EVO VI RS2

[Dori Dori]

The only thing that I like 'much' better on the STi is the interior. I could easly make the WRX faster and handle better, but the blue sued leather seats in the front and back, the aluminum accents, and everything else that makes that interior so nice would be very expensive and hard to do.

I'll just enjoy my WRX, and if the STi comes; I'll try my hardest to get the interior from the first wrecked one.

[Adrian128]

The octane problems we had here were only for the Ver 5 STIs, and there were only a small percentage that had problems, but they were quite publicized. This problem was rectified when the Ver. 6 STIs were delivered, but don't ask me how.

They were retailed for $60K AUD, but a lot of very astute "investors" paid up front for theirs, and sold them right away for a profit. Some were selling theirs for $80 K with not even 100 kms on the clock.
The new STI will not be a limited edition, but will be a regular model, but with very few available.

[Jon [in CT]]

Adrian128 wrote:

The new STI will not be a limited edition, but will be a regular model, but with very few available.

So, limited ¬= very few available? Can anyone out there translate Oz English to US English and explain what he means?

[Adrian128]

I should have explained it further.. by limited edition I meant that only a certain number was available, like the previous STIs.. we only got 399 ver 5 and 400 ver 6, that's it.. no more.. but with the new ones.. it will be a trickle.. my dealer said the STIs would be like the B4 when it gets sold.. about 2 to 4 cars a month will be available.. from his dealership, so it is a regular model, but there won't be as many units available, so it's pretty much by order.

[Siper2]

Well I'm already "on the list" at my dealer, and yes I hope it comes. But it's a couple years away as is, probably, and I have some things in mind for my RS, first. Not to mention that I'm one of the Audi S4 vs. STi folk who will be deciding which to purchase, when the time comes. The new S4 should be released, or at least expected, by about the same time. Maybe within a year or so, but so what...

The WRX got here because people bought the 2.5RS. So you guys are right, the STi will probably only make it if the WRX sells well enough. Too much up in the air, right now. But I doubt the STi would exceed the $35k mark. No way it'll hit $40k, if you ask me.

-S2-