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Old 03-28-2005, 10:39 AM   #1
elohdaeh78
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Default up-pipe on an 05 wrx

I was wondering if anyone just put an up-pipe on an 05 wrx. With the new ECU on the 05's does the up-pipe still give you the gains that it gave on the 02 and 03s. Just looking for someone that has done it, since i hear alot of bad things about the ecu in the 05s and how they take poorly to mods.
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Old 03-28-2005, 10:48 AM   #2
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Two things:
- A pre-turbo cat is not your friend.
- Engine management is your friend.
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Old 03-28-2005, 10:50 AM   #3
elohdaeh78
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Yeah im going to get a cobb accessport eventually but right now i have an up-pipe laying around so i want to put that in and i was wondering if it even makes a difference in the 05 or does it just mess up the ECU.
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Old 03-28-2005, 11:03 AM   #4
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Where did you hear that the 05's don't take to ECU mods??? They absolutely do.
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Old 03-28-2005, 11:09 AM   #5
elohdaeh78
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I read a bunch of stuff on the 05 and i assume the 04s ECU's on various msg boards. I know they changed the ECU since the 02, 03s and i heard or read that they seem to have more problems then the 02 03s did. I mean the 05 ecu still takes to mods, but they seem to be a little quirkier then the 02 , 03s. Thats what i read and was told, but thats why im asking.
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Old 03-28-2005, 11:13 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcowger
Where did you hear that the 05's don't take to ECU mods??? They absolutely do.
I don't think his question is if the '05's take to ecu mods or not, but whether the stock ecu takes well to engine mods such as an uppipe, etc.
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Old 03-28-2005, 11:15 AM   #7
elohdaeh78
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Yeah what he ^ said
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Old 03-28-2005, 12:49 PM   #8
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I'm curious about installing an uppipe only on a 2005 WRX as well. I posted a similar question a while back - I was worried about the 2nd & 3rd catalytic converters becoming over-burdened by the lack of the uppipe cat. I didn't want to throw a cat inefficiency CEL by installing only the uppipe. Replies indicated that there is a slight chance of getting the inefficiency CEL.
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Old 03-28-2005, 03:00 PM   #9
elohdaeh78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jac04
I'm curious about installing an uppipe only on a 2005 WRX as well. I posted a similar question a while back - I was worried about the 2nd & 3rd catalytic converters becoming over-burdened by the lack of the uppipe cat. I didn't want to throw a cat inefficiency CEL by installing only the uppipe. Replies indicated that there is a slight chance of getting the inefficiency CEL.
Thanks for the first reply to my question
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Old 03-28-2005, 03:21 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elohdaeh78
I was wondering if anyone just put an up-pipe on an 05 wrx. With the new ECU on the 05's does the up-pipe still give you the gains that it gave on the 02 and 03s. Just looking for someone that has done it, since i hear alot of bad things about the ecu in the 05s and how they take poorly to mods.

I think part of the problem is the "I hear alot of bad things" and the "how they take poorly to mods" comments. What bad things are you hearing? In what way are they supposed to take poorly to the mods?

As far as I know, I haven't heard or read anything saying that an ECU in an '05 won't take any particular mod. I'm pretty sure that doing a mod like an uppipe would require an ECU reset so that the ECU can "learn"...but that's the same as '02-'03.

Maybe if you were more specific, you'd get more responses...
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Old 03-28-2005, 08:26 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdmiralWRX
I think part of the problem is the "I hear alot of bad things" and the "how they take poorly to mods" comments. What bad things are you hearing? In what way are they supposed to take poorly to the mods?

As far as I know, I haven't heard or read anything saying that an ECU in an '05 won't take any particular mod. I'm pretty sure that doing a mod like an uppipe would require an ECU reset so that the ECU can "learn"...but that's the same as '02-'03.

Maybe if you were more specific, you'd get more responses...
If my first post was not specific to you then you have a reading issue. If you have nothing to add to this post dont' waste my time. I hate when people complain about the way people write their posts. I have gotten 9 responses and only 1 actually was a response to my question. I asked simply if anyone with an 05 wrx had put in an up-pipe and if it gave them any problems. Simple question, simple answer, don't respond to my post if you have nothing to add thank you.
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Old 03-29-2005, 12:06 AM   #12
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I have a 05 with an up pipe but I did not want to risk the cell and got an accessport. With the accessport it worked and is still working flawlessly at stage 2 with a turboback ext also. 04 ecu are almost the same as 05's 04 are quirky to upgrades also without engine managment. In my opinion it is not worth it to put in an uppipe with out some sort of engine magment because the stock magnagement is so skewed and retarded in the firstplace in 04-05s most cars ping stock already...
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Old 03-29-2005, 08:18 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vzezera
I have a 05 with an up pipe but I did not want to risk the cell and got an accessport. With the accessport it worked and is still working flawlessly at stage 2 with a turboback ext also. 04 ecu are almost the same as 05's 04 are quirky to upgrades also without engine managment. In my opinion it is not worth it to put in an uppipe with out some sort of engine magment because the stock magnagement is so skewed and retarded in the firstplace in 04-05s most cars ping stock already...
Thank you for your response that was very informative, i appreciate it
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Old 03-29-2005, 03:53 PM   #14
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What I've been reading is there is a problem with the fuel mapping, a delay going from open loop to closed loop, and adding mods like an uppipe or turboback may amplify the problem without EM to correct it.
Again just what I have read about the 04-05 ecu, but it's enough to make me hesitate in buying an uppipe or exhaust without being able to purchase EM at the same time.

Thanks
Dave
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Old 03-29-2005, 04:00 PM   #15
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Its not a large enough problem to make an UP not work....more of an annoyance.
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Old 03-29-2005, 04:53 PM   #16
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I just installed a Turboxs TBE with an uppipe everything is fine....Car is running good the only thing is that when I really press on the car I hear a buzzing noise like a rattle, but then again I am not sure. Boost levels are fine and the car feels stronger.

ECUTEK this weekend

Last edited by WRX787; 03-29-2005 at 05:14 PM.
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Old 03-29-2005, 04:54 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcowger
Its not a large enough problem to make an UP not work....more of an annoyance.
However, an up pipe will acerbate the problem. The OL/CL delay is on the 04 and 05. The 05 also has the vin number, so a reflash is not "reversible."
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Old 03-29-2005, 07:47 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bofh
The 05 also has the vin number, so a reflash is not "reversible."
According to the map revision notes on Cobb's web site:
"New Base Mapping based on MY05 program code including VIN reporting."
It appears that the VIN number issue has been resolved.
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Old 03-30-2005, 10:10 AM   #19
elohdaeh78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bofh
However, an up pipe will acerbate the problem. The OL/CL delay is on the 04 and 05. The 05 also has the vin number, so a reflash is not "reversible."
could you explain that in a dumbed down way so i can understand
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Old 03-30-2005, 11:07 AM   #20
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OL/CL delay = Open loop fueling to closed loop fueling delay. Under load, the ECU switches from 'get good gas mileage mode (closed loop)' to 'he wants power, lets give him power (open loop)' mode. There is a delay in this switchover for the 04/05 ECUs. Its a noticeable hesitation when you are cruising along at 3000 RPM in 2nd and then romp on the gas. It feels like the car is thinking about it, then deciding to go faster.

As for the VIN number part - ignore it, its fixed in the latest version of the AP.
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Old 03-30-2005, 01:07 PM   #21
elohdaeh78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcowger
OL/CL delay = Open loop fueling to closed loop fueling delay. Under load, the ECU switches from 'get good gas mileage mode (closed loop)' to 'he wants power, lets give him power (open loop)' mode. There is a delay in this switchover for the 04/05 ECUs. Its a noticeable hesitation when you are cruising along at 3000 RPM in 2nd and then romp on the gas. It feels like the car is thinking about it, then deciding to go faster.

As for the VIN number part - ignore it, its fixed in the latest version of the AP.
So an up-pipe is going to make that hesitation even worse?
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Old 03-30-2005, 01:16 PM   #22
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Supposedly, but it didn't happen with me. It may be due to the fct that the aftermarket UP makes for quicker and earlier spool, so it hides the effect somewhat.
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Old 03-30-2005, 01:29 PM   #23
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So far I just have a perrin Uppipe and Helix Downpipe with the Stock catback. Fully Catless and my car runs fine. Still saving up for the Ap but should have it within the next 2 months.
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Old 04-19-2005, 12:13 AM   #24
WRXFan007
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Default 04' WRX with Upipe Installed... No Cat CEL.

Quote:
Originally Posted by elohdaeh78
I was wondering if anyone just put an up-pipe on an 05 wrx. With the new ECU on the 05's does the up-pipe still give you the gains that it gave on the 02 and 03s. Just looking for someone that has done it, since i hear alot of bad things about the ecu in the 05s and how they take poorly to mods.
OK, so I have a '04 WRX, but just had a GodSpeed Uppipe (this has the EGT Bung), installed Friday and so far am not experiencing an Exhaust related CEL, which is good, since they advertise 'no CEL'. Yes, there's a noticeable performance improvement, and a slight sound difference, since the first cat is gone. I think this my help in answering your question.

Now for the rest of the story for those who may or may not care

Unfortunately I believe I'm getting an unrelated CEL - P1088 Which is referring to the Tumble Generator Valve. Specifically: "Tumble generator valve #1 (RH) position sensor circuit low input". In my case I beleive the mechanic hit the sensor with a wrench or something, and caused it to not read properly. Most likely just the risk of working under the hood in tight quarters.

I've got to take the car back in to let them work on it, but am wondering if the right side TGV sensor needs replacing (it's a bit banged up visibly). My delima is that they'll have to take the Turbo, IC, Downpipe, and Uppipe loose/off to fix it, and If rotating the sensor 45 or 90 degrees doesn't fix it, I'm gonna have to wait for the part to arrive from Subaru, since I assume my small dealer won't stock it!

And anyone care to comment on whether the Subaru dealers are likely
A: To notice my new Upipe, and
B: Void my warranty just for having a Cat Free Upipe installed?

Thx for your comments.
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Old 04-19-2005, 12:36 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elohdaeh78
So an up-pipe is going to make that hesitation even worse?
The up-pipe because it will create quicker spool up times, the engine will still be in the closed loop EM mode and thus cannot adequately supply the correct amount of fuel. This results in very bad things. There have been some reports of 2004's having detonation issues from the factory. The first thing one should do with an '04 or '05 for power is to get EM. Run a Cobb Stage 1, this should give more gains than an uppipe alone.

-Jason
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