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Old 04-19-2005, 10:02 PM   #1
scooterforever
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Default Can you run a "blank" UTEC map over an EcuTek reflash, in which the reflash controls?

I know this can be done with an Xede, but I am wondering whether it is also possible with a Utec. While I have an Ecutek reflash that I am very happy with, I would love real-time map switching. Specifically, I want to toggle between 93 octane and 100 octane maps.

I know that you can run a UTEC over an Ecutek reflash. What I am wondering is whether you can load a "zero value" UTEC map that will essentially allow the underlying reflash to perform its work unhindered. The second map would be dyno tuned for 100 octane (or WI, etc.)

Is this possible? Or would I need to have a custom tune on the base UTEC map as well?
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Old 04-19-2005, 10:06 PM   #2
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Yes. We do this all the time. If you put the Utec in 0 position you will be running the ECU's perams. Then have dyno tuned maps for diff octanes in the other map positions.

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Old 04-19-2005, 10:24 PM   #3
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....and why I want a flash to go with my UTEC
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Old 04-19-2005, 10:27 PM   #4
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Thanks, guys!
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Old 04-20-2005, 10:47 AM   #5
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As long as the injector scaling in the UTEC match appropriately otherwise you will still be modifying the MAF voltage even if you aren't touching boost, fuel, or timing.
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Old 04-20-2005, 11:57 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cdvma
As long as the injector scaling in the UTEC match appropriately otherwise you will still be modifying the MAF voltage even if you aren't touching boost, fuel, or timing.
Even if the injector scaling is set to match in the UTEC, I would think that you would want to turn off the UTEC's OLF. Otherwise, the UTEC is controlling the fueling with its own background fuel map once the TPS crossover is reached.

Last edited by x99percent; 04-20-2005 at 12:35 PM.
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Old 04-20-2005, 01:40 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by x99percent
Even if the injector scaling is set to match in the UTEC, I would think that you would want to turn off the UTEC's OLF. Otherwise, the UTEC is controlling the fueling with its own background fuel map once the TPS crossover is reached.
Not on Map0

TMS
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Old 04-20-2005, 01:45 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMadScientist
Not on Map0
Good catch.

Also, the UTEC is *always* messing with the MAP signal to the ECU (thanks to the UTEC's hardware FCD), so I would think that would thoroughly confuse any ECU-based boost level tweaking.
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Old 04-20-2005, 05:05 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by x99percent
Good catch.

Also, the UTEC is *always* messing with the MAP signal to the ECU (thanks to the UTEC's hardware FCD), so I would think that would thoroughly confuse any ECU-based boost level tweaking.
I'm pretty sure its just a voltage clamp so the UTEC wont do anything until it hits your FCD value.
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Old 04-20-2005, 05:21 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cdvma
I'm pretty sure its just a voltage clamp so the UTEC wont do anything until it hits your FCD value.
As FullThrottleSpeed found out with the SM3 the utec does "load" the map sensor some.


TMS
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Old 04-20-2005, 05:47 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMadScientist
As FullThrottleSpeed found out with the SM3 the utec does "load" the map sensor some.
Yep. For example, if you're at 17psi, the UTEC will report ~12psi to the factory ECU.
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Old 04-20-2005, 06:48 PM   #12
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wait, so utec map 0 is not truly stock? x99, that sort of 'correction' would seem to suggest _serious_ lean potential, with a 50% difference in actual air vs reported air, ie map 0 being totally unsafe?
or am I misreading this?
thanks,
greg
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Old 04-20-2005, 08:20 PM   #13
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Of course MAP only matters for boost control. Remember the ECU is MAF load based.

You can turn off OLF in the UTEC and use the classic MAF modification to modify the ECU's open loop fueling. Tweaks as such. It's a little more complex for the timing...
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Old 04-20-2005, 11:04 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gregsachs
wait, so utec map 0 is not truly stock? x99, that sort of 'correction' would seem to suggest _serious_ lean potential, with a 50% difference in actual air vs reported air, ie map 0 being totally unsafe?
or am I misreading this?
thanks,
greg
You aren't misreading. However, as Mick said, MAP only matters for boost control (and fuel cut). The ECU uses MAF, not MAP, for all fuel and timing.
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Old 04-21-2005, 09:08 AM   #15
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so if i'm figuring this correctly, a map 0 utec will end up running higher boost than a true stock vehicle, due to the ecu boost control and the level being misreported? ie even in map 0 you'll get some performance enhancements?
thanks,
greg
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Old 04-21-2005, 10:47 AM   #16
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Does the addition of the abc valve affect en ecutek base maps handling of boost? So the net of the above discussion is you may loose the ECUs abiltity to pull boost under rare circumstances.
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Old 04-22-2005, 11:26 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by x99percent
Yep. For example, if you're at 17psi, the UTEC will report ~12psi to the factory ECU.
Very interesting. I never bothered to use DeltaDash to log anything since I got the UTEC...so I guess its a voltage divider of some sort. Weird.
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Old 04-28-2005, 12:58 PM   #18
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Ok, I just installed the utec over my ecutek. It's not hitting target boost, it's like .1 bar behind. So it's not 100% pass through, and I'm a little bummed. I'm hitting 1.4 bar without utec, and 1.2-3 with utec. I have the FCD switch in the correct position. For those that run it this way, what is your experience with boost passing through.

Last edited by mnavarro; 04-28-2005 at 01:09 PM.
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Old 04-28-2005, 01:27 PM   #19
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I called PDX tuning and they suggested that I put the FCD switch in the default position, this will prevent (to a less extent) playing with the map signal, because it uses the Boost Cut in the underlying flash.
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Old 04-28-2005, 01:33 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mnavarro
I called PDX tuning and they suggested that I put the FCD switch in the default position, this will prevent (to a less extent) playing with the map signal, because it uses the Boost Cut in the underlying flash.
this is true. otherwise, if your stock ecu is controlling boost, you might see wacky results...and different boost cuts.
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Old 04-28-2005, 04:33 PM   #21
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Well, I didn't see any change. I called turbo xs, and they said I have to modify the boost settings in map 1, to be reflected in map 0, everything else is completely pass through with the exception of boost.
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Old 04-28-2005, 05:32 PM   #22
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with the FCD switch on, it only reports up to 15psi back to the stock ecu...

so if your stock ecu is controlling boost, it will try to keep going up to Xpsi, but "cant" because its limited...so it might go nuts.
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Old 04-28-2005, 06:02 PM   #23
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haha, I think I'm going nuts, too. Ok well I did what this guy said, modified map of map 1 and did a roll around the block, man couldn't hit 1.4 bar for the life of me. I logged it and it said ecu. I'm beginning to think that there's no way to get boost to pass through. Am I supposed to modify map 1 for the boost changes to reflect in map 0? It looks like I will have to retune the ecutek to work underneath the utec, which would suck, or run map 1, with everything set to ecu, and modify the boost manually.
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Old 04-28-2005, 10:06 PM   #24
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Well, I think I've played with it enough for now. I did make a map 1 which everything was controlled by ecu. For the injector flow, and stock injector size, what should they be set to? I have perrin moddified. I set them to 816/816 respectively. Idle was a little off. I got this terrible hesitation, but it might be because I was going from ecu boost to a low closed loop boost control number . I think I will have my tuner mess with this and for now I will drive map 0.
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Old 04-28-2005, 10:27 PM   #25
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Is the boost map really passed through from map 1 to 0? Thats news to me. I always thought I was getting higher boost than stock because of the ABC. The way I set my utecs boost ramp is similar to the stock ecus, so its quite possible, but I swear its lower in stock mode.
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