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Old 05-02-2005, 12:18 AM   #1
stimpy
Homicidal Maniac
Moderator
 
Member#: 1612
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Austin, TX
Vehicle:
2008 STI

Default STI V7 Knock Event

I'm having some trouble clearing up what appears to be a knock event around 5500 rpm. My engine is basically stock except for a Scoobysport downpipe, factory cat and midpipe, APS 2.5" backbox, and a Rotary Performance fuel pump. My boost is currently at 9psi while I get my car running properly on 91 octane.

These logs were taken in 2nd gear with a WRX transmission. The problem doesn't show up nearly as readily in a 3rd gear pull, for some reason.

When I first noticed the problem, my timing map was stock for a V7. I progressively decreased timing in the area slightly before the knock event and all through where timing was being retarded. Problem is, retarding timing seems to have no effect on the knock event. What really confuses me is that the engine is really happy prior to 5500 and happy once again post 7000.

Forgive me the duplicate lines, my logging rate is a bit fast.

run 1
Code:
Engine RPM	Ignition Timing	Knock Advance	Relative Boost	Engine Load	LM1-A/F Ratio
5454	36	4.5	9.14	1.63	10.7604
5532	27	4.5	9.43	1.65	10.7457
5532	27	4.5	9.43	1.65	10.8045
5690	26.5	-2.5	9.43	1.68	10.7898
5690	26.5	-2.5	9.43	1.68	10.8192
5863	26	-2.5	9.72	1.69	10.7751
5863	26	-2.5	9.72	1.69	10.7604
5975	26	-2	9.72	1.68	10.6869
5975	26	-2	9.72	1.68	10.7751
6087	26	-2	9.72	1.68	10.7016
6087	26	-2	9.72	1.68	10.6722
6227	28	-2.5	9.57	1.67	10.6869
6227	28	-2.5	9.57	1.67	10.7604
6227	28	-2.5	9.57	1.67	10.7163
6372	27.5	-2.5	9.57	1.7	10.6722
6372	27.5	-2.5	9.57	1.7	10.7604
6619	28	-2.5	9.57	1.64	10.8045
6619	28	-2.5	9.57	1.64	10.7604
6686	28.5	-3	9.72	1.62	10.731
6686	28.5	-3	9.72	1.62	10.7457
6818	28.5	-3.5	9.72	1.58	10.7016
6818	28.5	-3.5	9.72	1.58	10.731
6957	28.5	-4	9.86	1.55	10.7604
6957	28.5	-4	9.86	1.55	10.731
7068	28.5	-4	9.86	1.53	10.731
7068	28.5	-4	9.86	1.53	10.7457
7225	28.5	-3.5	9.86	1.52	10.6869
7225	28.5	-3.5	9.86	1.52	10.7016
7253	28.5	-4	9.86	1.49	10.7751
7253	28.5	-4	9.86	1.49	10.8192
7381	28.5	4.5	9.86	1.48	10.731
7519	37	4.5	9.57	1.43	10.731
7519	37	4.5	9.57	1.43	10.8045
run 2
Code:
Engine RPM	Ignition Timing	Knock Advance	Relative Boost	Engine Load	LM1-A/F Ratio
3271	28	0	-7.69	0.76	14.5236
3271	28	0	-7.69	0.76	14.5383
3271	28	0	-7.69	0.76	14.5089
3810	41.5	4.5	2.47	0.99	14.553
3810	41.5	4.5	2.47	0.99	13.9356
3810	41.5	4.5	2.47	0.99	13.7298
3936	39	4.5	4.79	1.15	13.1859
3936	39	4.5	4.79	1.15	12.9801
3936	39	4.5	4.79	1.15	12.7743
4065	36.5	4.5	6.96	1.28	12.348
4065	36.5	4.5	6.96	1.28	12.5832
4231	34.5	5.5	8.12	1.41	12.0687
4231	34.5	5.5	8.12	1.41	11.6571
4231	34.5	5.5	8.12	1.41	11.8482
4437	34	5.5	8.41	1.45	11.6718
4437	34	5.5	8.41	1.45	11.5101
4626	35	5.5	8.85	1.47	11.3925
4626	35	5.5	8.85	1.47	11.4072
4626	35	5.5	8.85	1.47	11.3631
4848	35.5	5.5	8.99	1.5	11.2014
4848	35.5	5.5	8.99	1.5	11.0691
4848	35.5	5.5	8.99	1.5	10.9221
5012	36	6	8.99	1.53	10.8339
5012	36	6	8.99	1.53	10.8045
5304	35.5	5	9.14	1.56	10.731
5304	35.5	5	9.14	1.56	10.731
5304	35.5	5	9.14	1.56	10.731
5522	35	5.5	9.28	1.57	10.731
5522	35	5.5	9.28	1.57	10.731
5522	35	5.5	9.28	1.57	10.731
5747	26	-3.5	9.43	1.6	10.731
5747	26	-3.5	9.43	1.6	10.731
5859	27	-2	9.57	1.61	10.7604
5859	27	-2	9.57	1.61	0
5859	27	-2	9.57	1.61	10.7898
6127	27	-2	9.43	1.6	10.878
6127	27	-2	9.43	1.6	10.8633
6127	27	-2	9.43	1.6	10.8339
6291	29.5	-2	9.43	1.58	10.9809
6291	29.5	-2	9.43	1.58	11.025
6291	29.5	-2	9.43	1.58	11.0103
6516	29.5	-2.5	9.28	1.57	11.025
6516	29.5	-2.5	9.28	1.57	10.9074
6684	29.5	-3.5	9.43	1.54	10.8633
6684	29.5	-3.5	9.43	1.54	10.8633
6684	29.5	-3.5	9.43	1.54	10.878
6867	29.5	-4	9.43	1.52	10.8339
6867	29.5	-4	9.43	1.52	10.7898
6867	29.5	-4	9.43	1.52	10.6869
7028	29.5	-3.5	9.43	1.48	10.731
7028	29.5	-3.5	9.43	1.48	10.7604
7142	36.5	4.5	9.57	1.45	10.437
7142	36.5	4.5	9.57	1.45	10.6281
7142	36.5	4.5	9.57	1.45	10.6722
7275	36.5	4.5	9.57	1.41	10.8339
7275	36.5	4.5	9.57	1.41	10.8486
7275	36.5	4.5	9.57	1.41	10.8927
7530	37.5	4.5	9.43	1.39	10.9809
7530	37.5	4.5	9.43	1.39	10.9809
run 3
Code:
Engine RPM	Ignition Timing	Knock Advance	Relative Boost	Engine Load	LM1-A/F Ratio
2825	28	0	-8.12	0.68	14.5236
2825	28	0	-8.12	0.68	14.6559
2825	28	0	-8.12	0.68	14.6706
3645	40	1.5	1.31	0.87	13.965
3645	40	1.5	1.31	0.87	14.4648
3645	40	1.5	1.31	0.87	14.2296
3645	40	1.5	1.31	0.87	13.3476
3826	39.5	5	4.21	1.1	12.8919
3826	39.5	5	4.21	1.1	13.3035
3826	39.5	5	4.21	1.1	12.3627
3826	39.5	5	4.21	1.1	12.5244
4010	36.5	5.5	6.96	1.29	12.6567
4010	36.5	5.5	6.96	1.29	12.5538
4010	36.5	5.5	6.96	1.29	12.3627
4249	35.5	6	8.27	1.39	12.4215
4249	35.5	6	8.27	1.39	12.3627
4249	35.5	6	8.27	1.39	12.1716
4249	35.5	6	8.27	1.39	12.0246
4477	34	6.5	8.85	1.46	11.7012
4477	34	6.5	8.85	1.46	11.6277
4477	34	6.5	8.85	1.46	11.5542
4731	35.5	7	8.85	1.45	11.4513
4731	35.5	7	8.85	1.45	11.3631
4731	35.5	7	8.85	1.45	11.2602
4731	35.5	7	8.85	1.45	11.1573
5036	35.5	5.5	8.85	1.48	10.9221
5036	35.5	5.5	8.85	1.48	10.9074
5036	35.5	5.5	8.85	1.48	10.7898
5274	35	5.5	8.99	1.53	10.7604
5274	35	5.5	8.99	1.53	10.7898
5274	35	5.5	8.99	1.53	10.8192
5494	34	5.5	8.99	1.56	10.8486
5494	34	5.5	8.99	1.56	10.8633
5494	34	5.5	8.99	1.56	10.9368
5699	25.5	-3.5	9.28	1.57	10.9368
5699	25.5	-3.5	9.28	1.57	10.9368
5699	25.5	-3.5	9.28	1.57	10.9662
5699	25.5	-3.5	9.28	1.57	10.9515
5933	26.5	-2	9.28	1.57	10.9662
5933	26.5	-2	9.28	1.57	10.9662
5933	26.5	-2	9.28	1.57	11.0544
5933	26.5	-2	9.28	1.57	11.1132
6234	27	-2.5	9.28	1.56	11.1132
6234	27	-2.5	9.28	1.56	11.0838
6234	27	-2.5	9.28	1.56	11.1426
6384	29	-2.5	9.14	1.56	11.0985
6384	29	-2.5	9.14	1.56	11.0103
6384	29	-2.5	9.14	1.56	11.0544
6684	28.5	-3.5	9.14	1.54	10.9662
6684	28.5	-3.5	9.14	1.54	10.9221
6684	28.5	-3.5	9.14	1.54	10.9074
6684	28.5	-3.5	9.14	1.54	10.8927
6950	29	-4	9.28	1.5	10.8633
6950	29	-4	9.28	1.5	11.8041
6950	29	-4	9.28	1.5	14.8764
run 4
Code:
Engine RPM	Ignition Timing	Knock Advance	Relative Boost	Engine Load	LM1-A/F Ratio
2856	37	3.5	0.44	0.82	14.5383
2856	37	3.5	0.44	0.82	14.3031
2856	37	3.5	0.44	0.82	14.406
2904	37	4.5	1.31	0.88	14.5089
2904	37	4.5	1.31	0.88	14.6265
2990	39	6.5	1.6	0.91	14.5677
2990	39	6.5	1.6	0.91	14.5236
2990	39	6.5	1.6	0.91	14.4942
3121	40	6.5	2.18	0.94	14.5089
3121	40	6.5	2.18	0.94	14.4648
3205	40	6.5	2.9	0.96	14.4501
3205	40	6.5	2.9	0.96	14.4942
3340	40	6.5	3.34	0.99	13.9209
3340	40	6.5	3.34	0.99	13.9062
3340	40	6.5	3.34	0.99	13.9356
3443	40	6.5	3.92	1.02	14.0238
3443	40	6.5	3.92	1.02	13.9944
3522	39	6.5	4.35	1.07	13.818
3522	39	6.5	4.35	1.07	13.8327
3672	39	6.5	5.08	1.13	13.8033
3672	39	6.5	5.08	1.13	13.6857
3753	38.5	6.5	5.66	1.18	13.4652
3753	38.5	6.5	5.66	1.18	13.3182
3753	38.5	6.5	5.66	1.18	13.2153
3908	38	6	6.38	1.22	13.1418
3908	38	6	6.38	1.22	12.9654
4014	38	6	7.11	1.25	12.8772
4014	38	6	7.11	1.25	12.6861
4014	38	6	7.11	1.25	12.5097
4194	37.5	6.5	7.54	1.33	12.642
4194	37.5	6.5	7.54	1.33	12.5391
4388	36	7	8.12	1.4	12.4509
4388	36	7	8.12	1.4	12.2745
4388	36	7	8.12	1.4	12.0981
4531	35.5	7	8.56	1.44	11.7306
4531	35.5	7	8.56	1.44	11.6277
4675	36	7.5	8.7	1.44	11.5983
4675	36	7.5	8.7	1.44	11.4807
4823	36	7	8.7	1.45	11.5101
4823	36	7	8.7	1.45	11.2749
5000	33.5	5.5	8.7	1.48	11.1426
5000	33.5	5.5	8.7	1.48	11.0838
5000	33.5	5.5	8.7	1.48	10.9368
5175	33	6	8.7	1.51	10.8486
5175	33	6	8.7	1.51	10.8192
5281	33	5.5	8.85	1.52	10.7898
5281	33	5.5	8.85	1.52	10.8045
5446	32	5.5	8.85	1.53	10.7457
5446	32	5.5	8.85	1.53	10.8339
5592	23	-4	8.99	1.54	10.8633
5592	23	-4	8.99	1.54	10.8486
5592	23	-4	8.99	1.54	10.9074
5804	23.5	-3.5	9.14	1.56	10.9515
5804	23.5	-3.5	9.14	1.56	10.9074
5947	24	-2.5	9.14	1.56	10.9074
5947	24	-2.5	9.14	1.56	10.9074
5947	24	-2.5	9.14	1.56	10.9368
6033	25	-1.5	9.14	1.59	10.8633
6033	25	-1.5	9.14	1.59	10.9074
6142	25	-2	9.14	1.55	10.9809
6142	25	-2	9.14	1.55	10.9809
6142	25	-2	9.14	1.55	11.0397
6382	26.5	-2.5	8.99	1.57	10.9662
6382	26.5	-2.5	8.99	1.57	11.0691
6487	27	-2.5	8.99	1.56	11.0397
6487	27	-2.5	8.99	1.56	10.9956
6556	27.5	-3	9.14	1.53	10.9809
6556	27.5	-3	9.14	1.53	10.9515
6768	27.5	-4	9.14	1.52	10.9074
6768	27.5	-4	9.14	1.52	10.9221
6768	27.5	-4	9.14	1.52	10.8633
6861	27.5	-3.5	9.14	1.5	10.8339
6861	27.5	-3.5	9.14	1.5	10.8045
6861	27.5	-3.5	9.14	1.5	10.7604
7002	35.5	4	9.14	1.45	10.7898
7002	35.5	4	9.14	1.45	10.8045
7239	35.5	4.5	8.99	1.4	10.6575
7239	35.5	4.5	8.99	1.4	10.7898
7352	35.5	4.5	9.14	1.4	10.7898
7352	35.5	4.5	9.14	1.4	10.8192
7455	36	4	9.14	1.37	10.8486
7455	36	4	9.14	1.37	10.8927
7545	36.5	4	9.14	1.36	10.9074
7545	36.5	4	9.14	1.36	10.8927
7545	36.5	4	9.14	1.36	10.8339
7606	36.5	3.5	9.14	1.34	10.8927
7606	36.5	3.5	9.14	1.34	10.9515
7796	36.5	3.5	9.14	1.33	10.8633
7796	36.5	3.5	9.14	1.33	10.878
7796	36.5	3.5	9.14	1.33	10.8927
7845	37	3.5	8.99	1.33	10.878
7845	37	3.5	8.99	1.33	10.8927
7970	37.5	2.5	9.14	1.01	10.7898
7970	37.5	2.5	9.14	1.01	13.1859
-Jon
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Old 05-02-2005, 07:55 AM   #2
crazymikie
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 56321
Join Date: Mar 2004
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Hopkinton, MA
Vehicle:
2006 Honda El Camino
Green

Default

Hi Jon-

Have you by any chance modified the RPM range over which the knock sensor is active? I'm not sure about v7 motors, but I know on the 2.0L USDM motor, the knock sensor is not active in that range because of engine noise. On the STi, it runs higher, though. I'm not sure if that's a function of the processing on the ECU or the engine design, though.

Do you have logs from a 3rd gear pull? I'm curious to know if the loads are similar to those that you see in 3rd gear. THat may help try to narrow things down. It looks like timing is making a relative large jump right before the knock event. Have you tried smoothing that out?

If you dump some torco in there, does the knock persist? That may help narrow things down as well. If you don't see any improvement, it may point to noise that the sensor is interpreting as knock incorrectly.

I'm no expert, so take this FWIW.


Mike
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Old 05-02-2005, 02:37 PM   #3
stimpy
Homicidal Maniac
Moderator
 
Member#: 1612
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Austin, TX
Vehicle:
2008 STI

Default

I haven't modified the knock sensor rpm cutoff.

Here is a 3rd gear pull.

Code:
Engine RPM	Ignition Timing	Knock Advance	Engine Load	LM1-A/F Ratio
2921	41.5	0	0.41	14.6118
2921	41.5	0	0.41	14.5971
2937	41.5	0	0.42	14.5677
2922	41.5	0	0.42	14.5236
2922	41.5	0	0.42	14.5236
2952	41.5	0	0.44	14.5383
2952	41.5	0	0.44	14.5971
2942	41.5	1.5	0.57	14.847
2975	41	3	0.67	14.6853
2975	41	3	0.67	14.2884
2995	39	4	0.8	14.1414
2995	39	4	0.8	14.0826
3003	39	5	0.86	14.847
3031	39	6	0.92	14.6559
3031	39	6	0.92	13.8327
3077	39	7	0.96	13.1859
3077	39	7	0.96	12.7008
3121	39	7	0.98	12.2157
3121	39	7	0.98	12.7155
3148	38.5	7	1.03	12.8478
3148	38.5	7	1.03	12.7596
3220	38	7	1.09	12.8037
3248	37.5	7	1.13	12.6714
3248	37.5	7	1.13	12.6273
3290	36.5	7.5	1.18	12.6567
3290	36.5	7.5	1.18	12.5538
3346	35.5	8	1.23	12.642
3396	35.5	8	1.29	12.642
3396	35.5	8	1.29	12.6714
3470	34	8.5	1.35	12.6567
3470	34	8.5	1.35	12.8331
3501	31.5	7	1.43	12.6567
3547	30.5	6.5	1.47	12.4656
3547	30.5	6.5	1.47	12.1569
3616	25	2	1.5	12.0687
3616	25	2	1.5	12.054
3687	25.5	2	1.52	12.0099
3723	26	2	1.51	11.9364
3723	26	2	1.51	11.8923
3805	28	3	1.5	11.9364
3867	28.5	3	1.51	11.8923
3867	28.5	3	1.51	11.907
3945	29	3	1.51	11.9364
3945	29	3	1.51	11.8923
3968	29.5	3	1.51	11.8776
4014	30.5	4	1.52	11.8629
4014	30.5	4	1.52	11.8776
4125	30.5	4	1.53	11.8188
4166	29.5	4	1.54	11.8482
4166	29.5	4	1.54	11.6424
4251	30	5	1.55	11.7159
4251	30	5	1.55	11.5542
4317	30	5.5	1.58	11.3925
4393	29.5	5.5	1.57	11.2455
4393	29.5	5.5	1.57	11.2014
4448	31	6.5	1.57	11.3043
4448	31	6.5	1.57	11.2161
4507	32	6	1.56	11.1132
4561	32	7	1.56	11.1426
4561	32	7	1.56	11.1426
4646	33.5	7	1.56	11.0691
4646	33.5	7	1.56	10.9809
4716	34	7	1.56	10.9368
4761	34	7	1.58	10.9662
4761	34	7	1.58	10.8486
4835	35	7	1.58	10.8045
4835	35	7	1.58	10.7898
4917	35.5	6.5	1.59	10.7604
4932	36	6.5	1.59	10.7898
4932	36	6.5	1.59	10.7604
5030	36.5	5.5	1.61	10.6722
5030	36.5	5.5	1.61	10.6428
5126	36.5	5.5	1.63	10.6869
5183	37	5.5	1.63	10.5399
5183	37	5.5	1.63	10.4958
5211	37.5	5.5	1.67	10.4811
5292	37.5	5.5	1.64	10.437
5292	37.5	5.5	1.64	10.5252
5368	38	5	1.63	10.5105
5391	38	5.5	1.64	10.5399
5391	38	5.5	1.64	10.5399
5474	37.5	5.5	1.65	10.5105
5474	37.5	5.5	1.65	10.5546
5555	37.5	5.5	1.65	10.5546
5605	36.5	4.5	1.63	10.5987
5605	36.5	4.5	1.63	10.584
5660	36.5	4.5	1.64	10.5987
5660	36.5	4.5	1.64	10.6428
5678	36.5	5	1.65	10.6575
5804	36	5.5	1.64	10.6575
5804	36	5.5	1.64	10.6428
5832	36	6	1.66	10.6281
5832	36	6	1.66	10.584
5914	35.5	6	1.64	10.5399
5936	35.5	6	1.65	10.5693
5936	35.5	6	1.65	10.584
6058	33.5	4.5	1.64	10.5987
6058	33.5	4.5	1.64	10.5546
6092	33	4	1.64	10.6134
6152	33	4	1.63	10.6134
6152	33	4	1.63	10.6281
6172	31.5	6	1.64	10.6134
6172	31.5	6	1.64	10.6281
6260	38	6	1.62	10.6281
6281	38	6	1.62	10.5987
6281	38	6	1.62	10.7016
6377	38	6	1.62	10.6722
6437	38	6	1.6	10.6869
6437	38	6	1.6	10.6722
6459	38.5	6	1.59	10.7016
6459	38.5	6	1.59	10.8045
6544	38	5.5	1.6	10.731
6578	38	5.5	1.58	10.7163
6578	38	5.5	1.58	10.7604
6607	38	5.5	1.57	10.7457
6607	38	5.5	1.57	10.731
6684	38	5	1.56	10.7604
6744	38	4.5	1.57	10.7751
6744	38	4.5	1.57	10.7604
6775	38	4.5	1.57	10.731
6775	38	4.5	1.57	10.7751
6793	38.5	4.5	1.54	10.731
6861	38	4.5	1.53	10.7898
6861	38	4.5	1.53	10.7604
6918	38.5	4.5	1.53	10.7751
6931	38	4.5	1.51	10.7457
6931	38	4.5	1.51	10.8045
7002	38.5	4.5	1.53	10.8045
7015	38.5	4.5	1.51	10.7016
7015	38.5	4.5	1.51	10.6722
7075	38	4.5	1.49	10.7016
7075	38	4.5	1.49	10.6281
7122	38	4.5	1.47	10.6722
7122	38	4.5	1.47	10.7163
7135	38	4.5	1.48	10.6722
7197	37.5	4.5	1.47	10.6428
7197	37.5	4.5	1.47	10.6281
7225	38	4.5	1.45	10.6281
7309	38	4.5	1.44	10.6869
7309	38	4.5	1.44	10.7163
7295	38	4.5	1.47	10.7016
7295	38	4.5	1.47	10.6722
7360	38	4.5	1.42	10.6869
7360	38	4.5	1.42	10.6575
7389	38	4.5	1.43	10.6281
7396	38	4.5	1.41	10.6281
7396	38	4.5	1.41	10.6722
7484	38	4.5	1.43	10.6575
7470	38	4.5	1.41	10.6869
7470	38	4.5	1.41	10.6575
7500	38	4.5	1.42	10.7457
7500	38	4.5	1.42	10.6722
7530	38	4.5	1.39	10.6428
7614	38.5	4.5	1.38	10.6428
7614	38.5	4.5	1.38	10.7457
7614	38.5	4.5	1.39	10.7751
7614	38.5	4.5	1.39	10.7163
7637	38	4.5	1.38	10.7604
7700	38.5	4.5	1.38	10.7898
7700	38.5	4.5	1.38	10.7604
7747	38.5	4	1.38	10.731
7747	38.5	4	1.38	10.7457
7780	38.5	4	1.37	10.7163
7804	38.5	4	1.37	10.7457
7804	38.5	4	1.37	10.7163
7820	38.5	4	1.37	10.7751
7820	38.5	4	1.37	10.731
7814	38.5	4	1.36	10.7457
7911	39	4	1.37	10.7604
7911	39	4	1.37	10.8045
7902	39	3.5	1.36	10.7457
7902	39	3.5	1.36	10.7457
7936	39	3.5	1.35	10.7457
7936	39	3.5	1.35	10.7457
7944	38.5	3.5	1.34	10.8045
-Jon
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Old 05-02-2005, 11:06 PM   #4
crazymikie
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I'm stumped. It looks like you hit the same rpm/load sites in 2nd and 3rd gears, yet the ECU perceives knock only in 2nd.

Do you get any audible det? Does the ECU perceive knock at part throttle through that RPM range in 2nd (say at 75-80% TPS)?

Mike
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Old 05-02-2005, 11:16 PM   #5
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tranny issue, mebbe.....????
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Old 05-03-2005, 08:27 AM   #6
crazymikie
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Good call- could the tranny be making some noise that the knock sensor is picking up as knock?

I feel like this is an episode of House (Subaru Edition).


Mike
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Old 05-05-2005, 11:13 AM   #7
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I can't hear anything audible, though I can just feel the power being drained when timing is pulled. I've been doing some more logs and it is advancing like crazy in all other gears. This is even after I leaned out the highest load I'm seeing (1.65) to around 11.0:1.

I've been doing mostly partial throttle tuning the past few days and it is +4-8 across the board, even in 2nd gear. It only has something to do with the noise produced at full throttle in 2nd. The load points I've been doing most of the tuning at is 1.0-1.3 and they are all happy to run more advance while doing 12-13:1 AFR.

-Jon
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Old 05-05-2005, 01:02 PM   #8
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....is it just me, or does that sound a bit lean????
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Old 05-05-2005, 01:06 PM   #9
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I've seen ver 7's able to run those A/F's before...
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Old 05-05-2005, 02:02 PM   #10
stimpy
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Which part do you think is lean? The 12-13:1 at 6psi? That is all part throttle and nowhere near full load. The 11.0:1 at 10psi? I thought that was getting close to the correct target, but it is still not full load... Once I reconnect my boost control solonoid and go back up to 18psi, I should be seeing full load at around 2.7 load. My factory fuel maps were set to do 10.2:1 at 10psi and 8.8:1 at 18psi.

I'm very new to this but the car seems to run well with it. I'm welcome to any input .

-Jon
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Old 05-05-2005, 02:19 PM   #11
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8.8:1 seems really rich to me. I could be wrong, but I would think 10:1 would be pretty conservative.

I'm still confused as to why you only get pulled timing in second gear at WOT. Does the ECU do anything that is gear-specific? The reason I ask is for a given RPM/load site, the knock correction should be the same. So at 4500 RPM with a load of 2.0, you should see similar knock correction values in different gears, unless the fine ignition timing is gear specific.

The knock correction should be a combination of coarse ignition timing (IAM/16*KC map) and fine igniton timing (where timing is being pulled if the IAMA is advanced. What is your IAM?

Very confused...

Mike
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Old 05-10-2005, 07:14 PM   #12
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My car runs best around 11.2:1 under full load. Anything below about 10.9 and the car stumbles, thinking it is seeing knock etc.

For starters, my car was running too rich and stumbled in second. Leaning it out from 10.8:1 to 11.0:1 corrected the stumble I was experiencing in 2nd gear, but only somewhat reduced the pulled timing. It made it hader to preceive the pulled timing, at any rate. Changing the plugs completely corrected the problem. I guess the car was just overly sensitive to what was happening under those conditions.

My IAM is usually 12-13 and let me explain why. My knock advance table allows, in some places, up to 25 degrees of knock advance. This is completely absurd, but if that is in the table then the ECU will play around with the idea of hitting it. If one of the cells is higher than the car can run (ie: if I have tuned my timing to ~5 degrees of knock advance when allowable is 10) it is going to run a lower IAM simply because it can't run 100% of the knock advance. Not a bad tune, just an optimistic knock correction table.

We had the car on the dyno over saturday and got the boost tuned properly. We also had what we thought to be a good fuel curve and pulled 265 whp at 11.2:1, but had a MAF calibration problem. As such, we are running the stock low-det fuel map right now. Car stumbles a bit now while running 10.9-11.1:1 AFR. My MAF, even with the stock airbox is clear off the mark in some places. Some spots it reads .5:1 off of the targets, some spots it is over 1 full point off. Feels amazing though.

We will be hopefully finishing the fuel map tonight.

-Jon
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