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Old 05-24-2005, 12:38 PM   #51
bofh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by calvinc
time-zones make instant answer/replies quite difficult - you're just gonna have to bear with me... :-)
It's only 7 hours. But is does mean I can avoid morning drive time radio in the US by streaming 5fm's afternoon show.

As to the cable thing, some USB to serial converters are optoisolated. This could help... However, getting the right tools is always a good plan.
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Old 05-24-2005, 02:44 PM   #52
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I tried to make sense of the obd-2.com website to see what cable you are referring to, but started to get a headache. That site is a nightmare. Let me try and explain the RS-232 to ISO-9141 interface issue:

------------
* RS-232 from your PC signals with +/- 12V (although the voltages seem to get smaller and smaller these days as chipmakers cut corners and nobody seems to care about RS-232 much anymore).
* RS-232 uses "full duplex" where there is a seperate wire for each of the two parties to talk on.

* ISO-9141 from you car uses the +12V supply from you car and signals betwen +12 and 0 V.
* ISO-9141 is "half duplex" where all parties communicate on one wire by taking turns talking and connecting to the wire electrically in a way that if you are not talking, others can talk (open collector signalling in this case).
-------------

You need some small amount of simple electronics to interface between these two systems - they are not electrically equivalent. There are ways you can do it without optocouplers, but optos are just as easy to do and provide some extra margin of safety against damage to the ECU or PC if there are problems.

I chose to make a USB based serial interface to elimate the problems that some laptops have with low RS-232 signaling voltages and to allow the interface to operate at obscure/arbitrary baud rates that most PC UARTs don't support. Many newer laptops don't have serial ports anymore either.
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Old 05-24-2005, 05:51 PM   #53
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Does this software work if you have a UTEC installed. I have a Delta Dash cable set-up and a UTEC on my car and the program does not work. I have tried everything.

Thanks
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Old 05-24-2005, 06:43 PM   #54
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obd-2 web site is a mess but most of the obd-2 protocol was written by that guy ...
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Old 05-24-2005, 09:45 PM   #55
colby
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaxx
obd-2 web site is a mess but most of the obd-2 protocol was written by that guy ...
now it all makes perfect sense...
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Old 05-24-2005, 10:19 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colby
now it all makes perfect sense...
hahaha and here I thought I might get flamed for my original complaint. I'm gonna write that guy and offer him some free web authoring!
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Old 05-25-2005, 12:13 AM   #57
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I have a question.
With the two versions of the cable, wrx or generic, will the wrx one with the powered pin that allows reflashing be safe to use on a car other then a subaru, understading that it will not be able to flash it? Or do we have to buy both cables?

Thanks!
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Old 05-25-2005, 12:26 AM   #58
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Depends on what that pin connects to in the other car. If there's nothing there, you are probably okay. OBD standard only specifies a few pins, the rest are left for manufacturer use.

What kind of car?
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Old 05-25-2005, 03:00 AM   #59
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Quote:
streaming 5fm's afternoon show
5fm rocks - garreth cliff sux!

a guy called adrian mailed me this link:
h*t*t*p*:*/*/*p*r*j*.*p*e*r*q*u*i*n*.*c*o*m*/*o*b*d*i*i*/
(remove all the * in the link - nasioc says i cant post an url until i've made 10 posts)

seems like it would work fine, supports the right protocol and pin 15 isnt neccessary for diagnostics - i'm not an electronics guru. this schematic will not work for reflashes though! get the wrx one from tactrix if you intend to reflash.

calvin.
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Old 05-25-2005, 10:17 AM   #60
x99percent
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpturbo
Does this software work if you have a UTEC installed. I have a Delta Dash cable set-up and a UTEC on my car and the program does not work. I have tried everything.

Thanks
Many people use DeltaDash on UTEC-equipped cars without issues. I have never been aware of a problem.
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Old 05-25-2005, 10:51 AM   #61
crazymikie
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I have used Deltadash with a UTEC and some of the readings are incorrect. The UTEC fudges signals to change the behaviour of the car (inherent to a piggyback), so the DeltaDash will read the altered signals from the UTEC. On top of this, I believe there is a 3PSI offset for boost readings for some reason.


Mike
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Old 05-25-2005, 11:02 AM   #62
x99percent
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crazymikie
I have used Deltadash with a UTEC and some of the readings are incorrect. The UTEC fudges signals to change the behaviour of the car (inherent to a piggyback), so the DeltaDash will read the altered signals from the UTEC. On top of this, I believe there is a 3PSI offset for boost readings for some reason.
I agree.

It's not that they are "incorrect"... DD is reporting *exactly* what the ECU is seeing (UTEC-modified MAF and MAP signals).

- The UTEC tweaks the MAP sensor signal going to the ECU to avoid hitting fuel cut.
- The MAF value that the ECU sees is tweaked by the UTEC's fuel map and OLF injector settings.
- Ignition timing values logged from the ECU are obviously not being used if you are using a UTEC ignition map... regardless, the knock correction and IAM values read from the ECU can be used as an indication of how "happy" the ECU is with the UTEC tune.

However, I don't think this the problem cpturbo is experiencing.
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Old 05-25-2005, 12:15 PM   #63
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Delta dash and UTEC installed work fine together. It's the"Free Subaru Logger" that will not work with the Delta dash cable and a UTEC installed. At least I think that is the reason. I will not unplug my UTEC to find out. I will, however, connect my delta dash cable to a friends car and try the Free logger.

Thanks for the help
CP
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Old 05-25-2005, 12:26 PM   #64
CMJ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpturbo
Delta dash and UTEC installed work fine together. It's the"Free Subaru Logger" that will not work with the Delta dash cable and a UTEC installed. At least I think that is the reason. I will not unplug my UTEC to find out. I will, however, connect my delta dash cable to a friends car and try the Free logger.

Thanks for the help
CP
The Delta Dash cable does work, I use it.
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Old 05-25-2005, 04:08 PM   #65
chewbakarox
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guru's, please educate an engine management n00b: can this tool be used to tell if my cobb AP is having any ill effects on my engine (knocking/detonation)? i checked out the screenshots of the software, and it shows multiple A/F readings that you can monitor......can i somehow use these to determine how safely my engine is running?

TIA.
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Old 05-25-2005, 05:19 PM   #66
cpturbo
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To answer the previous posters question. Yes, as long as the software can report on Knock correction and the IAM; however, it could mean that you have a tank of bad gas.

Now for my question.

To the people using the Delta Dash cable. Do you also have a UTEC installed? Thanks

CP
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Old 05-25-2005, 08:55 PM   #67
chewbakarox
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpturbo
To answer the previous posters question. Yes, as long as the software can report on Knock correction and the IAM; however, it could mean that you have a tank of bad gas.

Now for my question.

To the people using the Delta Dash cable. Do you also have a UTEC installed? Thanks

CP
what is IAM? and does anyone know if the software track knock correction? TIA.
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Old 05-25-2005, 09:06 PM   #68
willguidry
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The software does report the knock sensor timing.

One question for all though. Have ANY of you figured out how to have this fecker actually LOG your data?

Cause, I tried everything, and it won't write anything to the .csv file I tell it save it to.
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Old 05-25-2005, 09:31 PM   #69
CMJ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willguidry
The software does report the knock sensor timing.

One question for all though. Have ANY of you figured out how to have this fecker actually LOG your data?

Cause, I tried everything, and it won't write anything to the .csv file I tell it save it to.
Pay more attention

You will not be able to save you log files until the next revision is released.
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Old 05-26-2005, 04:48 AM   #70
calvinc
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Quote:
Delta dash and UTEC installed work fine together. It's the"Free Subaru Logger" that will not work with the Delta dash cable and a UTEC installed.
state the facts please. until someone on this forum has tried both and actually says "i tried it and deltadash works but tari dl1 didnt", this means nothing.

deltadash and tari dl1 use exactly the same communications protocol. i dont see how its possible for 1 to work and not the other.

somebody please try them both on a UTEC and put this to rest. if the tari software doesnt work i'd like to know.

regards,
calvin.
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Old 05-26-2005, 08:25 AM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by calvinc
state the facts please. until someone on this forum has tried both and actually says "i tried it and deltadash works but tari dl1 didnt", this means nothing.

deltadash and tari dl1 use exactly the same communications protocol. i dont see how its possible for 1 to work and not the other.

somebody please try them both on a UTEC and put this to rest. if the tari software doesnt work i'd like to know.

regards,
calvin.
I have a UTEC and tari dl1 works perfectly. I do not have Delta Dash however.
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Old 05-26-2005, 09:35 AM   #72
willguidry
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CMJ
Pay more attention

You will not be able to save you log files until the next revision is released.
Huh...I'm sorry...It's my mistake. I thought when someone puts a feature into the feature notes, it means it's a functional piece of a software package.

*taken from http://www.tari.co.za/products.htm*


Features

Features currently available:
- view saved log files
- view live data


So yeah..... logging isn't too hard to enable in any application. It's like the first thing you learn when coding. If someone could write an application like this, they could have easily included logging like they advertised.

TPIWWL (This Program is Worthless without Logging)
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Old 05-26-2005, 10:01 AM   #73
crazymikie
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No offense, but I think the fact that someone is doing this for _free_ would warrant a little more support from the community. The author didn't even post the link up here.

Also, I believe the release notes were reffering to the ability to open saved log files from other apps. I'm not sure.
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Old 05-26-2005, 10:11 AM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crazymikie
No offense, but I think the fact that someone is doing this for _free_ would warrant a little more support from the community. The author didn't even post the link up here.

Also, I believe the release notes were reffering to the ability to open saved log files from other apps. I'm not sure.
Oh, well... it's rather misleading then. It wouldn't even allow you to copy and paste the data from the LIVE monitor. Which, you can select it, so that means code was put in to disable COPY....which leads me to believe he is going to try and make some money off this.

WHICH, as a member of OPENECU and opensource in general is a no-no.

/shrug

I like the app, but not gonna pay money just to have a log feature. I'll just stick with printscreens.

Thanks anyhoo.
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Old 05-26-2005, 10:40 AM   #75
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That program isn't open source is it? Either way, you know what they say about looking a gift horse in the mouth. If you want a freebie program, the source is posted on openecu that makes a simple linux based SSP logger. It's pretty raw, but you can change what it logs in the source without a degree in c programming. It runs in cygwin on a windows machine, just compile and go.
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