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Old 06-20-2005, 11:55 AM   #1
Carisma
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Default Pros and cons of twin-scroll turbo!

I was looking at turbo the other day and I saw two(2) twin-scroll turbos for sale. One by PE and the other was a VF37. I was wondering what were the pros and cons of these turbos. Also the engine that the turbo would go on would either be a V7 EJ207 or a a Axis Motorsports 2.2L EJ20. Either way, the car is going to used for autocross and daily driver so response is what I am looking for.

Geran
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Last edited by Carisma; 06-20-2005 at 11:09 PM.
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Old 06-20-2005, 11:09 PM   #2
Carisma
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bumpity
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Old 06-20-2005, 11:40 PM   #3
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better low end but limited top end
( limited turbo selection, few aftermarket parts)
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Old 06-21-2005, 12:13 AM   #4
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Many, many replies to this topic if you do a search.

Interestingly enough my last dyno tune showed a healthy increase in top end compared to a similarly equiped STi with the stock VF39. Bottom was better too, but the increase past 5500 was more substantial.

The PE and ZeroSports twinscrolls feature a larger turbine than the standard VF37 or VF36.
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Old 06-21-2005, 12:38 AM   #5
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upside: spool and power
downside: availability and price
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Old 06-21-2005, 01:38 AM   #6
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Quote:
better low end but limited top end
Nope. Better low end, better top end, better efficiency. Down side is price and limited sizes. No downsides if the VF37 is what you want.
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Old 06-21-2005, 05:42 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronf
better low end but limited top end
( limited turbo selection, few aftermarket parts)
I should put it " limited top end possibilities because of limited turbo selections ".
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Old 06-21-2005, 10:07 AM   #8
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by the time you go w/ a twin scroll imo you'd be better off just throwing in a 2.5. run any turbo you want, or keep what youve got and have a ton of torque and mid range power.
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Old 06-21-2005, 12:05 PM   #9
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Have you driven one? If not, don't make a decision based on dyno plots.
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Old 06-21-2005, 01:52 PM   #10
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driven what???
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Old 06-21-2005, 02:12 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pux888
driven what???
My point was directed to the original poster not you.
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Old 06-21-2005, 02:17 PM   #12
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lol oh, still what??? 2.5 or twin. im a big advocate of the 2.5 swap, cost is very similar to a full twinscroll setup.
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Old 06-21-2005, 02:23 PM   #13
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http://www.xanga.com/home.aspx?user=deathinacan66

just got finished with my downpipe on my ej25 w/VF37. took a perrin 3 in downpipe, cut off the flange, welded on the stock jdm downpipe flange... filled in the gaps with welds. clocked at 0-60mph at 4.0sec, possibly faster. if you do this swap, make sure you get your clutch ready... the turbo spools so fast, and so aggresively, it takes an exedy stage 2 or 3 to keep the power to the wheels... oh, and forget about awd, with this much torque at the low end, its hella hard keeping the wheels from spinning.

i'll try and get some video's to you, send me your email and i'll mail some to ya. lata bro.

kory
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Old 06-21-2005, 03:12 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pux888
lol oh, still what??? 2.5 or twin. im a big advocate of the 2.5 swap, cost is very similar to a full twinscroll setup.
Twin scroll.
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Old 06-21-2005, 06:53 PM   #15
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No I haven't driven one yet. I am mainly looking for something wither good response since it would be used for autocross sometimes. I know the 2.5 swap has some good torque and everything but it is very pricey. Also I am looking for around 300-350whp and 290-300ft-lbs. of torque. Just let me know. If I did go Twin-scroll I would go with the PE1825 over the VF37 just because it can get a better top-end and still have some low-end grunt.
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Old 06-21-2005, 07:05 PM   #16
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well your not gonna see 350 whp out of a twin scroll, never.
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Old 06-21-2005, 07:07 PM   #17
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well i shouldnt say never but you get the point, no turbo that i know of that would still be in its effiency range. maybe gt32
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Old 06-21-2005, 11:11 PM   #18
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I am mainly looking for around 300whp, I know 350whp is pushing anything that comes stock on any car.
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Old 06-22-2005, 01:53 PM   #19
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never? come drive in my car. i'll get you the dyno numbers as soon as i get my car tuned.
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Old 06-22-2005, 02:23 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carisma
I am mainly looking for around 300whp, I know 350whp is pushing anything that comes stock on any car.
Of course the dyno makes a big difference, but on the conserative Dyno Dynamics, you should be able to get to 300 whp with the upgraded wheel versions of the twin scroll (Deadbolt modified VF37, PE1825, Zerosports). For reference my peak was 273 whp on Shiv's DD dyno with a standard(ish) VF37.
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Old 06-22-2005, 02:37 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pux888
well your not gonna see 350 whp out of a twin scroll, never.
dug-e-fresh got 320whp iirc on his vf36.A friend of mine with an sti that basically bought my old setup(vf37 with catless exhaust, aps d/r 500 on 91 octane) made around 290 something to the wheels, but made 320wtq. the twinscroll should not be used on a 2.5 as the motor is too much for the turbo unless you get the zerosports or pe turbo. Also, retail on the pe turbo is around 2300-2500, but cheapest I've found is around 1900 so keep that in mind. One can also send their 37 or 36 to deadbolt and add a bigger compressor wheel and basically make it close to a pe1825. I also have a friend with an sti with the zerosports twinscroll that made 320whp on a conservative dyno with a cat and 91 octane so you can NOT say never. experience it for yourself.

I agree with your comment of a 2.5 being a better decision though.

If you want 300whp, then the 37 should be able to achieve that.twinscroll setups are VERY responsive and they just straight up sound sick. very much like a twin turbo 6 cylinder(supra, skylines). Also from my experience, the motor just feels healthier and smooth-revving
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Old 06-22-2005, 03:42 PM   #22
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I have a USDM 2.0L WRX with a VF-37 setup. Dyno plots dont' really explain how fast the power comes on when you floor the turbo from a roll. I made 267 whp on KTR's heart breaker dyno with this setup. For reference a stock STi makes 210-215 whp. The area under my power curve is fat ass hell also.

The Larger compressor wheel (pe turbo, or Deadbolt clone) will slow your spool somewhat.... but even my tuner said the compressor housing was a little small and i could easily see signifigant gains across the board with a larger compressor.

I'm not gonna reccomend you go twinscroll tho....I did it just to be different - if everyone else started doing it they'd all realize how much it rocks and then i wouldn't be the only one around anymore :-P

-J
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Old 06-22-2005, 03:44 PM   #23
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Oh yea.. You lose the subaru rumble... The sound - while not as cool - is very pleasing to the ears. It sounds (at least with my exhaust setup) something like an evo on roids.

-J
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Old 06-22-2005, 03:55 PM   #24
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can some one link to someone that sells the vf37 setup?
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Old 06-22-2005, 04:23 PM   #25
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iaperformance.com can usually get them. Just hitup stephan... he's the best. he'll get you a full setup for somewhere south of 1700... while rallispec wants north of that for just the components (not including the turbo). Stephan also gave me a killer deal on my v8 seats 8)

-J
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