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Old 08-22-2008, 04:32 PM   #601
engineerx
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For the MAF/BOV location look at post #577 above, you can see the location of the BOV before the MAF. Just make sure you have proper
clearances if your battery is there (mine is in the trunk), and you will have to extend the MAF wire harness.

For the Alternator you're gonna have to grind off the casing to allow the AC belt to clear when you lower the ALT. Look at the pic below so
you can get an idea.

I used a milling machine and cover/blocked as much of the ALT to prevent shavings from going in - taped the inside shut with painters tape
thru the vent holes on the case. You can also use a dremel with a good carbide bit but that will take longer. Blow it with compressed air
afterward to blow out any debris.

I also trimmed a little of the top, but only because I didn't rotate the throttle body. I wanted to keep the TB unflipped. I just don't like how
the butterfly valve opens and "aims" to one side, sort of like the vent flaps on the dash. Probably doesnot matter at all anyway.
Nobody has problems with the TB flipped.

To get the smaller Power Steering/ALT belt on, the easiest way is to run it thru the crank & ALT pulleys and get as much of the belt as you can
on the PS pulley. Force it in by hand as much as you can. Then use a long ratchet & 22 or 20mm (i forget) socket to turn the crank while pushing
the belt onto the pulley until it catches completely. If you ever fixed your bike chain after it came off the derrailleur and crank, you'll know what I
mean. Easier if someone helps you, but it can be done just by yourself.

The belt I used is # 4050340 or equivalent to 5PK865 "Gatorbelt, Goodyear" I believe. You can source it at your local autoparts.

hope that helps.
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Old 08-22-2008, 04:37 PM   #602
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^thanks for that. at least i know i can move the maf if i choose to now. maybe when i pull my motor out and a whole bunch of other crap i am doing soon.
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Old 08-22-2008, 05:58 PM   #603
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damn, I didnt have to cut my alt that much to keep a/c/ I hope yours holds up.
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Old 08-23-2008, 01:14 AM   #604
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Your set up is probably different than mine. I didn't have to trim my hood since I lower the ALT quite alot
3000 + miles so far no problems!
If you analyze where the case was grounded off there's not much "structural" material there. The 4 "ribs" in front are what provide the strenght. I only ground off about half of 1. It should hold up or it would've failed by now.
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Old 08-23-2008, 01:21 AM   #605
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my alternator is to the lowest point, i cut my hood, and im still hitting lol. its just the way the pipe is routed i guess. *sigh* oh well.

btw, engineerx, that site you ordered your silicone hoses from, they are out of stock of 2.0-2.5 90 degree hoses i did order a 2.5 one though but for the piping when it gets routed through the fender.
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Old 08-23-2008, 02:56 AM   #606
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ah ! - too bad. You can setup your account to let you know when they're in stock - their system is pretty good. They emailed me once when the hose I ordered came back in stock. Also their expected dates of restocking are pretty accurate. There are other places where you can get them from , but not as inexpensive as that one. Try Atpturbo.com - I believe they carry those too.
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Old 08-23-2008, 05:18 AM   #607
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Engineerx... thanks for the feedback man. Your setup looks great.

I'll be running uprated motor mounts too so hopefully that should help.

Anybody thought about making a tensioner that moves the belt away from the ALT so that you dont have to grind it to fit?
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Old 08-23-2008, 11:20 AM   #608
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Quote:
Originally Posted by engineerx View Post
Your set up is probably different than mine. I didn't have to trim my hood since I lower the ALT quite alot
3000 + miles so far no problems!
If you analyze where the case was grounded off there's not much "structural" material there. The 4 "ribs" in front are what provide the strenght. I only ground off about half of 1. It should hold up or it would've failed by now.
Yeah I used 2.75 inch i/c piping so I had to trim the hood brace.
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Old 08-23-2008, 08:18 PM   #609
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Engineerx... what size piping did you use so it doesnt foul the hood?
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Old 08-23-2008, 08:58 PM   #610
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Quote:
Originally Posted by engineerx View Post
ah ! - too bad. You can setup your account to let you know when they're in stock - their system is pretty good. They emailed me once when the hose I ordered came back in stock. Also their expected dates of restocking are pretty accurate. There are other places where you can get them from , but not as inexpensive as that one. Try Atpturbo.com - I believe they carry those too.
yeah thats where i ordered my crap previously. the expected date for the hoses were no more than 60 days it said, but im not waiting that long

atp turbo, they are 30 bucks to their 20. oh well lol.
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Old 08-23-2008, 10:51 PM   #611
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frayz View Post
Engineerx... what size piping did you use so it doesnt foul the hood?
fullrace has a reversed kit now, they use a 45 degree hose from the tb then their piping goes between the alt and a/c. It looks to be 2.5 maybe 2.25. They wont sell it by itself though you have to get the whole fmic. I know you dont want to do that with your aps fmic, after all the trimming on your prodrive bumper.

edit Im pretty sure its 2.5, but on our bugeyes I think we have less room at the front of our hoods than 04+ This is crookids car




[/
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Old 08-24-2008, 05:56 AM   #612
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Cheers Scby Rex

Might look into that one. Do they move the TB at all or is that bolted up in the stock location?
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Old 08-24-2008, 12:25 PM   #613
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frayz View Post
Cheers Scby Rex

Might look into that one. Do they move the TB at all or is that bolted up in the stock location?
its bolted up to stock location on the intake manifold. the great fittment is due to the 45 degree elbow coming off the tb.



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Old 08-24-2008, 03:13 PM   #614
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Quote:
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They wont sell it by itself though you have to get the whole fmic.[/
Weak!!
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Old 08-24-2008, 03:18 PM   #615
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^yeah but it can be replicated now that their kit is out. They do turn the fbw tb 90 degrees it looks like. Your still cable tb right frays?
btw here is a good place to order couplers and t bolt clamps, great customer service and shipping www.pegasusautoracing.com
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Old 08-24-2008, 03:57 PM   #616
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Yeah man im still cable.

Out of interest, apart from it looking like a cleaner install, does anyone have any hard data to show what kind of improvement the reversed manifold actually makes?
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Old 08-24-2008, 04:43 PM   #617
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Quote:
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Yeah man im still cable.

Out of interest, apart from it looking like a cleaner install, does anyone have any hard data to show what kind of improvement the reversed manifold actually makes?
performance wise, none really. id do it just for looks.



eric



Quote:
Originally Posted by Inn-Tune View Post
Over the years I've enjoyed testing new ideas on my own Subarus, many of which transferred to customer vehicles after thorough testing and abuse. The non intercooled setup was one I tested extensively over a period of a few years.



I'm curious if anyone else on here has played with this. I've gone to 33 psi safely and 39.5 psi (Kaboom) this way to test it's viability on one of my stock engines and had some fun in the process. All testing was on my own cars of course using the stock engine from my 93 Legacy Sport Sedan. It had 200k miles on it, but they're known for being pretty tough bone stock. It was never touched down to the leaky original valve cover gaskets, original head gaskets etc.





At first I was simply using the VF11 at double stock boost with no intercooler for a while. Then I ran 23 psi on the vf39 (~6 months), 26-30 psi on an FP Green (~3 months), and 33 psi on a GT35R (~2 months) all with no intercooler. This was daily use with lots of abusive testing. I was ready to go to let the all original bone stock 15 year old legacy engine die when I pumped almost 40 psi through it to find the breaking point. It likely would have survived for a while at 33 psi on the GT35R. I ran an autoX at 33 psi on the 35R with tires a smoking last spring. This is for anyone who thinks I'm exaggerating when I say the tires were actually smoking. This is a third gear rolling burnout. The person who took the picture is off two years on the image date.







The VF39 and FP Green were on 93 octane pump gas with meth injection and the GT35R was on pump/108 ron UNleaded mix with meth injection. When I cranked the boost controller from 33 to 40 psi I put some C12 in the tank, but knew full well that wasn't enough octane for it to be safe. Intercooler or not that was a death sentence.





Here's a shot of the last iteration of this project with the GT35R. At this point I had moved the legacy engine into an Impreza chassis. It could be prettied up, but the car was bone stock 3 days before running this event. The engine and everything else were in a Legacy chassis, but a few days after the GT35R went on it the chassis was so twisted the doors barely closed and it squeeked and creaked like mad.





As you can see the charge pipe was all of a foot long instead of the 12 foot mess associated with a standard route FMIC. Once I swapped the deceased legacy engine for an 04 STi engine I did some testing without an intercooler again. After I finished breaking the engine in I put a good front mount kit on (Ultimate Racing) with no other changes.



Testing showed what I had suspected all along. There is little difference in spoolup between no intercooler and a good front mount setup. Transient boost response is different, but nowhere near what you'd expect. It's much like the difference between a ball bearing and journal bearing turbo. They only spool up about 150 rpm different if you mash the gas from a low RPM, but on shifts you notice a difference while waiting to re-spool. Flat foot shifting remedies this while you retain the cooling advantage an intercooler provides. All that said I did enjoy the simplicity and sneakyness of the no intercooler setup. The car looked stock except for the exhaust and wheels.





After seeing what it's like to completely remove the intercooler and piping from the equation I've determined that reversing the intake manifold to cut FMIC piping from ~12 feet down to ~8 feet is a waste of effort with minimal gains to be had.



-Mike
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Old 08-24-2008, 04:59 PM   #618
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scby rex looks looks nice and clean
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Old 08-24-2008, 05:51 PM   #619
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thank you sir.


I also somewhat agree with the spool doesnt change. But I like the look and the mindset that the plumbing is as short as I can make it.
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Old 08-24-2008, 06:12 PM   #620
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built this for one of our shop sponsored cars, yes spool time is nil, full boost around 3000 on a green
400whp @ 19psi on 93
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Old 08-24-2008, 06:42 PM   #621
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anymore pics of that?
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Old 08-24-2008, 11:33 PM   #622
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frayz View Post
Engineerx... what size piping did you use so it doesnt foul the hood?
I used 2.5" , combined with lowering the ALT as much as possible and curving the pipe the way I did got me the necessary clearance to avoid modifying the hood.

That Full Race kit looks pretty good !
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Old 08-25-2008, 01:51 AM   #623
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Quote:
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built this for one of our shop sponsored cars, yes spool time is nil, full boost around 3000 on a green
400whp @ 19psi on 93
that turbo appears to be rotated...



eric
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Old 08-25-2008, 10:55 AM   #624
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that turbo appears to be rotated...



eric
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Old 08-25-2008, 10:57 AM   #625
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Quote:
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anymore pics of that?
ask and ye shall recieve
the entire build was done at www.area1320.com


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