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Old 07-31-2005, 01:04 PM   #1
Ru fan
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Default Need some help with a 2000 RSK

A buddy of mine is prepping a JDM 2000 Legacy RSK for a tarmac rally. I don't really know a lot about the chassis so if you could help me out with a few questions.

1.) I heard that the BH/BE style legacy could run a 235/245-size tire without too much issue. Is this true, and if so, what width rim, and what offset is ideal.

2.) Does anybody have any experience with Stop Techís on this chassis? The carís owner is looking into installing both front and rear brakes. I am guessing the WRX fitments would bolt right up, and not have many bias issues.

3.) Suspension on this car is multi-link in the rear correct? Who makes coilovers for these cars? Looking for something like a set of Tein RAís or Zeals. Unsure of the spring rates as of yet. If anybody has experience with this chassis in motorsports use, could you please direct me that way.

4.) Twin Turbo. From what I understand there is very little in the way of upgrades on these motors. I think the aim is for 350hp at the crank. I understand that there are few people in the US that have experience with these motors, so if you have any links that may be of interest please share.

Any sources to information on these cars, or vendors who have experience with these cars is greatly appreciated.

Seth E.
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Old 07-31-2005, 02:34 PM   #2
PHATsuby
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to stock is a project too

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here is my thread that will probably answer all your first two questions. http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=787474

I am running Tein HA's on my car 8k front and rear for a BH5

you could upgrade turbos for some more power or up the boost pressure, you need something to control the boost though, which i think requires a unit from HKS?

do a little searching and you will find more info, also talk to shirokuma or anotherB4, they will know what you need i think.

Ben
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Old 08-01-2005, 12:13 AM   #3
anotherB4
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Hi Seth.

I have a BE5B (you need tell us the applied model, years do not have any menaing here). I run hill climbs as well as track days, I'll try to help.

1. 225/45-17 rubbed in the rear of every car I've seen - even with ET53 rims. Roll them to clear those. Now, a small 235 may fit, but we were using Hi-end Potenzas, and their casings are known to be big. With coil overs, I guess that would be possible with the right off set wheel - careful research and some trial and error may be required.

2. I run a combo of JDM 4 pots (not the Brembos) and std rears. With great rotors, pads, SS lines, and good fluid I have never had any issues, but a full upgrade should help. Because I find the std bias of the system to be too forward for me, I run a higher coefficient pad in the rear to balance out braking to my tastes. I hesitate to say "you should do XXXX" because braking "feel" is a very personal thing.

3. Not touched Teins or Zeal. I just don't need them. But if you are going in that direction, you'll want to be very careful with the body. There are some felx/weak points that are in need of tweaking to get the best out of everything.

4. There is not much headroom in those turbos. I've taken mine to 350, but it isn't pretty, and I wouldn't wanna run with it up there for long. There is also only one tuned car that I have used that actually minimises the VoD - that is mine. Every other "name brand" twin turbo I've driven magnifies it The key is excellent component upgrades and having a first rate tuner of course (and I am lucky to have both). I also monitor most of the stuff that can kill a Scooby motor quickly: intake temps, knock, and boost. For heavy duty racing, obviously you'll want oil temp and pressure. I also have a sprayer for the IC.

My mod list has been put up here, and on LegacyGT.com I think. You can spend a lot more and get less, and I am sure you could spend less and get more too My aims are life and fun, so needs/aims may not always overlap, but my car is plenty quick for my day-to-day needs. Good luck with your project.

HTH
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Old 08-01-2005, 12:02 PM   #4
Huffer
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If you want an excellent link on the RSKs and GTBs (twinturbos), check out DIYMS.org

I think if you search on Google for DIYMS you should find a BBS in New Zealand, which is largely run by GTB and RSK owners. They have some excellent info, and a number of them are personal friends of mine (I used to live there).

The RSK is not your usual rally beast.. the chassis is heavy, and parts are expensive.
The RSK isn't as prone to blowing up as the GTB, possibly perhaps because it is considered more sedate than the monsterish wagon.
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Old 08-01-2005, 12:48 PM   #5
tora
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We have set up HEAPS of Rally cars (but mostly imprezas, WRX's).
For Tarmac I would recommend the following:
1. Depends who you talk to but I have had 235's on my BH with NO rubbing. I would try a 225/45 just to be safe though, and put it on a 17x8 with 48 offset. You could make it to a 245 on a BE/BH but not sure on the JDM if there are any issues.
2. Stop Techs are a great brake set-up...you could also try the Brembo's, FHI 4-pots etc etc. Willwood has good race components but I would choose AP Racing myself.
3. There are heaps of Japanese made coilovers for this car but for a Tarmac rally I would go with these:
ECS-SUB-LEG-GT-50A-NT Legacy B4 and GT (2001-2005) $3875.00
We use them on ALL our rally cars and they are brilliant!
4. You could easily get 350hp at the crank with just catless pipes and some good engine management.
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Old 08-01-2005, 06:04 PM   #6
Ru fan
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anotherB4 and others,
Thanks for the information and please keep it coming! The car is either a BH5/BE5 (which ever is the sedan) B4 RSK. I would call it the third generation of the Legacy with the current version being the fourth. That is all I know. If you need more than that, I am gonna have to ask my buddy.

Turbo-
Who makes the various turbo upgrades for this motor? Has anybody tried to port/clip the standard units? What kind of turbo's are they anyway? I would think that mid-range response and top end power would be key for a good tarmac rally car so anything to reduce the mid-range lag would be ideal.

Exhaust-
Who makes exhaust components for this car? I saw that JIC makes an exhaust, and syms makes headers and down pipes. Any others, and which do you prefer and why? Anything to keep in mind when selecting an exhust for the twin turbo setups?

Engine management-
Who makes engine management for this car? Which do you use and why?

Intercooler-
How is the stock unit? Who makes aftermarket units for this car?

Suspension-
What kind of spring rates are you using for motorsports use? I am thinking of 10k front and 8k rear. What swaybar options are available for this chassis?

Brakes-
I think would be wise to upsize the brakes just to be on the safe side. Does anybody know if the Stoptech front/rear set keeps the stock hand brake?

Thanks for all the great help.

Seth E.
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Old 08-01-2005, 07:08 PM   #7
Huffer
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Just a quick warning. There are a number of horror stories regarding GTB owners who have removed the primary cat and overspooled the primary, only to blow up their engines.

If you want some great advice on this particular generation of Legacy, head on over to www.clubsub.org.nz

A few people have had good, and dyno-proven results in reducing the VoD by enhancing their electrical grounds, and by removing air intake resonators.
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Old 08-02-2005, 06:41 AM   #8
EJ20TT
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Im surprised anyone is going to turn a BE5 into a rally car. Just seems to have so many built in disadvantages. To much weight, poor power delivery and lack of easy upgrades are real disadvantages.

There is a reason why the majors don't use the B4 Twin Turbo as a competition car.

Turbos - will depend on what model - from i think vf27/28 for be5a,b,c - be5d vf32/33

Intercooler - AVO make a bigger aftermarket IC

ECU - again AVO and if its a BE5D - MRT have an ECUtek solution

Suspension the B4 has a multilink rear so most WRX stuff is not really applicible.
All the usual suspects do sways for the BE5 - Cusco/Whiteline for example

Tyres - I know Yoko 225/45/17 will fit

Engine - i really wonder if the block is strong enough for lots of hard driving.
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Old 08-03-2005, 09:14 AM   #9
anotherB4
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Smile

For tarmac the Legacy can be surprisingly effective. Much more effective than the "I drive the fastest AWD car" crowd would like to admit. Hansen and self already split the WRX STI and Evo field in our (in those days) lightly tuned cars. With some of our recent tweaks, we should be a lot more competitive (indeed Paul was top ten in his last outing).

However, if it is going to be a full time race model there are a couple of things I'd do. With AVO tweaks (ECU, IC & exhaust), the twin turbo can be made to go hard very indeed - 0-62 is a 5 second ball game (or less if aggressive). Boost from the low 2000s, huge midrange. Things that could be an issue in competition though, are many (mostly to do with complex TT system). Here are some things I would have to give serious thought:

a. I'd go to a single turbo set-up. It'll save weight and be easier to TS if something does go wrong.

b. Go to Autronic engine management to get away from the chronically unreliable MAF of the std system (which is weak enough that going to a pod intake can result in a new engine...).

c. Then there is the gearbox - IMHO I'd just go find a wrecked STI's box and shove it in for the sake of reliability.

Other than the obvious cage and extinguishers, I would invest in OEM D rev "side performance bars" which will quite down the rear end quite a bit (stabilises toe changes esp. well). A rear bulkhead plate would be my next stop to get the stiffeness up. Lower stiffeners up front (NOT Cusco), engine and tranny oil coolers, PS fluid cooler, upgraded fuel pump (thankfully the Leggy tanks don't suffer fuel surge issues if you have to stay w/the std one), and armouring of the floor pan/tank area would be my next suggestions. The floor rails can be vulnerable if the car is very low, too.

<phew> HTH, and that some of the ideas are useful. If you are way ahead of me, forgive the basic nature of some of the suggestions... Good luck

Last edited by anotherB4; 08-03-2005 at 09:44 AM.
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