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Old 08-05-2005, 03:30 PM   #1
Beeker
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Default what to do with WI when going with a FMIC?

What do you guys do with the water injection when you switch to a TURBOXS FMIC? I'm just wondering if it is needed if you have a front mount? I was planning on rerouting mine when i get the front mount but i was just trying to find out what most other people do. Because i was looking at the TURBOXS fmic and didn't see anything about relocating or reusing the WI for it.


anyone info would help.

thanks kyle

I searched the title was too long or vague to get any results.
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Old 08-05-2005, 04:09 PM   #2
SilverSurfer04STi
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I'm sure you could customize it with some longer hose and creativity to spray on your FMIC.

My FMIC seems to have no overheating issues so I don't use my IC water sprayer anymore. I use my trunk container that used to be for the IC sprayer for my windshield washer fluid now. My stock washer fluid container has been replaced with the SMC methanol injection container...
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Old 08-05-2005, 04:23 PM   #3
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I was going to ask the same question and then I saw this

Also, don't the two counteract each other as far as performance? I know some people add water injection just for some more protection against detonation, they don't tune for power with it. On my WRX I still had the factory TMIC, so I added W/I and pulled some fuel out and got a nice gain. Now with a FMIC on my STi, wouldn't the cooler air coming in from the FMIC need more fuel to burn it? If I added the FMIC on top of the W/I and then still pulled some fuel, I'd probably be pretty close to the edge of VERY lean. Does this make any sense at all?
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Old 08-05-2005, 04:29 PM   #4
nwdriftking
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I think you may be confused on the difference between WI (water injection) and a water sprayer. WI is a small jet of water sprayed directly into the intake to help keep AFRs down while the water sprayer is used to prevent heat soak on top mount intercoolers. I think my WI jet is tapped just before the throttle body. There's no need really for a water sprayer on a FMIC,. Though I do have the NX N-tercooler, that seems to be kind of useless.

...I could be totally wrong though
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Old 08-05-2005, 04:59 PM   #5
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Ok, I was talking about how he plumbed a W/I nozzle into his FMIC pipes. I guess maybe he was talking about the I/C sprayer...

Anyways, anybody got an answer for my other question about fueling, W/I, and a FMIC?
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Old 08-05-2005, 05:48 PM   #6
SilverSurfer04STi
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I have methanol injection, not water injection.

I use my container in the trunk for my wiper fluid. I just have to use my IC water sprayer button when I want to spray the wiper fluid on my wind shield. I simply switched the hose for the IC sprayer container to spray into the jets on the hood which spray wiper fluid. Funny, it actually has a better spray pattern using this method... Quite a simple change really. If I had alot of initiative, I could rewire the stuff so the wiper fluid sprayed my windshield (while being stored in the trunk) when I push the wiper fluid button, but I'm lazy and afraid it will just be a huge pain the ass...

nwdriftking is right, you are confusing IC spray with WI or meth injection spray. My methanol is stored in a container that looks exactly like the stock wiper fluid container and is located where that container used to be. There is a stainless steel line that runs from this container to a tapped hole in my IC piping about an inch before the throttle body. Methanol starts to spray at 18psi and increases as boost increases and it's actually mixed in the AF mixture - so it's like I'm running very high octane race gas at 18+ psi. There are no buttons for this. It turns on automically once I hit 18psi...

nwdriftking is also right about the need for an IC sprayer on a FMIC. Not much heat soak up there since it is in front of the radiator and in the open air - even in stand still traffic you won't be getting heat soak. It certainly won't hurt anything, but it's probably also not helping much either as long as your FMIC is big/efficient enough - and if your IC isn't efficient enough, you should have got a better/bigger one in the first place - spraying isn't going to help enough in that scenario. Basically, you don't need a sprayer on your FMIC unless you happen to be driving through the pits of hell.

Last edited by SilverSurfer04STi; 08-05-2005 at 11:02 PM.
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Old 08-06-2005, 09:42 AM   #7
titsataki
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Ever thought of using the rear water tank for the methanol injection?
Isn't a certain risk of keep methanol near a very hot engine?

Nick


Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverSurfer04STi
I have methanol injection, not water injection.

I use my container in the trunk for my wiper fluid. I just have to use my IC water sprayer button when I want to spray the wiper fluid on my wind shield. I simply switched the hose for the IC sprayer container to spray into the jets on the hood which spray wiper fluid. Funny, it actually has a better spray pattern using this method... Quite a simple change really. If I had alot of initiative, I could rewire the stuff so the wiper fluid sprayed my windshield (while being stored in the trunk) when I push the wiper fluid button, but I'm lazy and afraid it will just be a huge pain the ass...

nwdriftking is right, you are confusing IC spray with WI or meth injection spray. My methanol is stored in a container that looks exactly like the stock wiper fluid container and is located where that container used to be. There is a stainless steel line that runs from this container to a tapped hole in my IC piping about an inch before the throttle body. Methanol starts to spray at 18psi and increases as boost increases and it's actually mixed in the AF mixture - so it's like I'm running very high octane race gas at 18+ psi. There are no buttons for this. It turns on automically once I hit 18psi...

nwdriftking is also right about the need for an IC sprayer on a FMIC. Not much heat soak up there since it is in front of the radiator and in the open air - even in stand still traffic you won't be getting heat soak. It certainly won't hurt anything, but it's probably also not helping much either as long as your FMIC is big/efficient enough - and if your IC isn't efficient enough, you should have got a better/bigger one in the first place - spraying isn't going to help enough in that scenario. Basically, you don't need a sprayer on your FMIC unless you happen to be driving through the pits of hell.
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Old 08-06-2005, 10:41 AM   #8
living4surf
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i just set up an smc alcohol injection kit on my turboxs frount mount it was very simple if anyone would like pics PM me.
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Old 08-07-2005, 08:29 AM   #9
PeteDucati
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Quote:
Originally Posted by titsataki
Ever thought of using the rear water tank for the methanol injection?
Isn't a certain risk of keep methanol near a very hot engine?

Nick
Probably the same risk as keeping washer fluid under your hood. Washer fluid is mostly alcohol.
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Old 08-07-2005, 09:24 AM   #10
chucktoo
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Default Kitchen Chemistry

Try some kitchen chemistry to convince yourself of flammability.

Methanol burn without a visible flame just heat it is hard to tell if you have a fire.

100% methanol ignites easilly
50% can be ignited but takes work
33% I could not get to burn

I used pyrex cups and a long nose grill lighter - please someone else try it.

Here is a table of water and methanol mixes.

http://www.ashchem.com/adc/chemicals...=3&is_header=N

Windshiled Washer fluid is rated to -20F so I assume it is aboot 33% methanol

Methanol \ Water Mixtures

Methanol Conc.
Wt. % (Vol.%) Freezing Point,F(C) Flash Point, (TCC) F (C)
0 (0) 32 (0) No Flash
10 (13) 20 (-7) 130 (54)
20 (24) 0 (-18) 110 (43)
30 (35) -15 (-26) 95 (35)
40 (46) -40 (-40) 85 (29)
50 (56) -65 (-54) 75 (24)
60 (66) -95 (-71) 70 (21)
70 (75) -215 (<-73) 60 (16)
80 (83) -225 (<-73) 55 (13)
90 (92) -230 (<-73) 55 (13)
100 (100) -145 (<-73) 55 (13)


I concluded 50% is what I want to run just slight on the flamible side.

Last edited by chucktoo; 08-07-2005 at 09:36 AM.
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Old 08-07-2005, 11:53 AM   #11
SilverSurfer04STi
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Yes, methanol is more flammable than wiper fluid. Originally, I wanted to relocate my meth to the trunk. I discussed it with SMC (the maker of the kit) prior to the install. They recommended that I not due this due to the fact that the location in the hood is better protected in the event of a collision. Not sure if that is the case, but it seemed to make sense. They have sold many, many kits for WRXs/STis and Grand Nationals. Call them to discuss it.

Either way, the meth is in a sealed container (exactly like the stock wiper kit container) and my underhood temps don't get as high as they could b/c I've taken many precautions to keep heat down. Even if the temps do get too high, theoretically, the methonal should not be capable of igniting b/c the container is sealed and there shouldn't be enough oxygen. If you want to be sure you can test it using some more kitchen chemistry. Buy a kit and put the methanol container with methanol in your oven at 250F and see how long it takes to start on fire.
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Old 08-07-2005, 12:11 PM   #12
chucktoo
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Default Treat 100% methanol like gas

Just don't spring a leak anywhere with 100% methanol.

100% methanol should be treated just the same way you would gas. Vented tanks - rollover protection - appropriate lines, fittings, pumps , valves , ect. If you treat it like gas I agree you will have no major problems.

Last edited by chucktoo; 08-07-2005 at 12:16 PM.
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