Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Monday May 4, 2015
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Home Registration is free! Visit the NASIOC Store NASIOC Rules Search Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Calendar Archive NASIOC Upgrade Garage Logout
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC Technical > Factory 2.0L Turbo Powertrain (EJ Series Factory 2.0L Turbo)

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 08-05-2005, 12:06 AM   #1
ebeck
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 35585
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Scottsdale AZ.
Vehicle:
RIP I'll always be
The Ver8 Magistrate

Default Ideas on top end with this header design

Love the Fujitsobo products. I have the PowerGetter. Love it. I am obsessing about headers. This design looks great tying the 1-2 and 3-3 cylinders together. I bet it is efficient and helps spool. Question is what about top end? Lots of info pn 4-1 or 4-2-1 design but not much on this x-over TwinScroll type of design. Any ideas on this design with respect to power band shift?



-----------------------------------------------------------

Real similar to the OEM Twin Scroll design
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.

Last edited by ebeck; 08-05-2005 at 12:50 AM.
ebeck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2005, 12:08 AM   #2
scooterforever
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 55011
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: New England
Vehicle:
2002

Default

I think there was a long article that dyno tested about 7 different headers, and this one made the analysis. I ran across it when I was obsessing over equal length headers. Let me see if I can dig it up and post the link.
-- scooter

Edit:

Found it. The Fujitsubo's were pretty much tied for the best top end power, eyeballing this graph here (stage 4 HP/torque comparison): http://www.speedstylesound.com/headers/S4Overallb.jpg

The article as a whole is here: http://www.speedstylesound.com/headers/

Edit Again:

Of course, what we can't know from this article is how the cars were retuned, etc. from header to header.

Last edited by scooterforever; 08-05-2005 at 12:16 AM.
scooterforever is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2005, 12:14 AM   #3
scooterforever
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 55011
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: New England
Vehicle:
2002

Default

If I am reading the above stage 4 HP/torque graph correctly (could be mistaken, it's a cluttered graph) the Fujitsubo was equaled in top end power only by the GT Spec Gen III equal length header. I researched the GT Spec Gen III in my quest, and learned that it had been discontinued pending redesign. There is at least one sample out there; RiftsWRX IIRC is running the Gen III.
scooterforever is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2005, 12:35 AM   #4
ebeck
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 35585
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Scottsdale AZ.
Vehicle:
RIP I'll always be
The Ver8 Magistrate

Default

That article is questionable. I mean that in the sense that no actual tuning was domne with them just slapped on and reset ECU. Hardly what happens in my world at least.

Plus those are the other Fuji design headers. They have 2. Most of the EQ length headers use lots and lots and lots of pipe. Solving a problem by adding complexity(pipe) is usually not a good idea. These Fuji's have almost no piping and eq length. Plus the x-over is a brilliant idea in terms of timing turbo pulses to the turbo. So it would seem.

Last edited by ebeck; 08-05-2005 at 03:02 PM.
ebeck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2005, 03:02 PM   #5
ebeck
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 35585
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Scottsdale AZ.
Vehicle:
RIP I'll always be
The Ver8 Magistrate

Default

Need more info....
ebeck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2005, 03:48 PM   #6
Unabomber
Big Ron
Moderator
 
Member#: 18062
Join Date: Apr 2002
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: I can save you a ton of cash
Vehicle:
on car parts so PM
me b4 j00 buy

Default

The user SaabTuner (Adrian) is a big fan of those headers. What's good enough for him is good enough for me. I vote you save money and get some Borlas like Big Ron though.
Unabomber is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2005, 04:12 PM   #7
ebeck
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 35585
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Scottsdale AZ.
Vehicle:
RIP I'll always be
The Ver8 Magistrate

Default

The Borlas are fine but the design is not the best. Not Borla specific rather, but rather the 4-1 or 4-2-1 design. The EQ len with real short pipes, like the JDM Ver8 Twinscroll is optimal.

The super, extra, long pipe EQ len version, with the ,massive tubing bundle everybody makes contains too much pipe for me.

I suspect entire powerband benifits with these., but not sure.
ebeck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2005, 05:11 PM   #8
J-Rex2004
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 68490
Join Date: Aug 2004
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: Spring
Vehicle:
'04 tippin' on
fo'fo jackstands.

Default

I wonder how much difference, if any, the piping length is on the over the conventional EQ Length headers, since the have to go all the way to the middle of the engine to come all the way back over. The twin scroll headers don't go over as far as the fujisobo's do. It would be nice if someone could do some measuring for comparison purposes. Other than that, they are sweet looking headers.
J-Rex2004 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2005, 07:13 PM   #9
petawabit
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 18978
Join Date: May 2002
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: orange county, CA
Vehicle:
96 brighton
05 AP2 ,09 GE8

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by J-Rex2004
I wonder how much difference, if any, the piping length is on the over the conventional EQ Length headers, since the have to go all the way to the middle of the engine to come all the way back over. The twin scroll headers don't go over as far as the fujisobo's do. It would be nice if someone could do some measuring for comparison purposes. Other than that, they are sweet looking headers.
The twinscroll headers have short piping and don't have to extend as far as the fujitsubo's because of the oilpan. I think these would make power throughout the whole powerband. when putting the twinscroll on the car, I immediately noticed how much smoother the motor idles and revs. In another thread awhile ago, there was someone who recorded a video of it and he too noticed an immediate difference in the smootherness of the motor.
petawabit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2005, 07:33 PM   #10
Redline8k
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 2968
Join Date: Nov 2000
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Elgin,Illinois
Vehicle:
Beat it to fit,
Paint it to match!

Default

I was one of the ones involved with the header test in question and I own the fuji header that you have pictured. I love it. Its fit and finish are top quality. If ultimate flow if what your after you should look into the Cusco I remember them having the largest primary piping.
I cant really comment on the "top end" with the header because I did the ver 7 swap and all other mods at the same time. But my car does make good power close to 400 on pump 93. the power is very linear all the way to 8K
as for my mods check...http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=779849
if you have any questions just ask.
-nick
Redline8k is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2005, 11:34 PM   #11
ebeck
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 35585
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Scottsdale AZ.
Vehicle:
RIP I'll always be
The Ver8 Magistrate

Default

Can I see your plot to comapre to mine? The power curve will help me see clearer relative to mine which is kind of similar.
ebeck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-06-2005, 08:29 AM   #12
NavyBlueSubaru
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 22127
Join Date: Jul 2002
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Oviedo, FL
Vehicle:
2013 BMW 335i Sedan
Estoril Blue

Default

Notice in the boost charts for the stg IV, the boost levels with the stock header are less than the other headers, they claim due to issues with the boost controller. Thus, in the graph, you see the hp/tq figures for the stock header are expectedly lower. However, higher up in the rpms, the boost for the stock header approaches what the boost was for the other headers runs, and wa-la, the hp/tq also approach what the other headers produce. Perhaps if they had the ability to tune the boost to ensure it was equal in all runs, the difference in hp/tq would have been very small and practically irrelevant.

I had the GP-Moto 4-2-1 headers and after switching back to stock, I have not noticed any power loss, while I have noticed quicker spool up and better overall drivability/response.

Jeff
NavyBlueSubaru is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Whats up with this fan design? subari87 Off-Topic 12 06-19-2008 04:08 PM
Effect of P&P stock header on VF34 WRX with aftermarket header? txl146 Factory 2.0L Turbo Powertrain (EJ Series Factory 2.0L Turbo) 25 05-19-2006 07:11 AM
Anyone have an idea on how to do this? CarbineReloaded Car Audio, Video & Security 7 05-17-2006 02:45 PM
what gains should i get with this header? blackie Factory 2.0L Turbo Powertrain (EJ Series Factory 2.0L Turbo) 24 09-10-2003 11:43 PM
Running lean on top end ('98 vs. '99)? Force[FED] Legacy Forum 3 01-29-2001 01:00 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:30 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2015 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2014, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.