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Old 09-13-2005, 02:47 PM   #1
tk686
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Default cobb AP stage 2, DP to stock back issue!

ok, im new here! i have 2002 WRX. ive got a cobb downpipe to stock back exhaust, gutted Up pipe, and cobb stage 2 HWG 93oct for a base map. no intake mods except drop in kNN filter. i dont feel big or even medium gains. ive done the actuator arm adj. 2 turns as well. i installed these mods in one day, straight from stock, with the exception of the arm adj mod. ive done a live boost read, and even though i get 15.3 in 4th and 15.7 in 5th, i get low #'s in 1st, 2nd, and 3rd and not much pull. it doesnt feel that much different than stock. does anyone have any suggestions as to what my problem is or what might be going on?
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Old 09-13-2005, 02:56 PM   #2
waktasz
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What 'low numbers' exactly? You will only really reach full boost in 4th and 5th gear. Are you wayyyy lower than the goal boost in lower gears? or just a bit?
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Old 09-13-2005, 03:15 PM   #3
tk686
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i think 3rd was around 14, 2nd even lower, like 11.7, 1st i didnt check. its been a couple days since i checked actually, but 2 weeks since i flashed the ECU. i honestly dont know what my car should feel like after these mods. in all the forums ive read, i get the impression i should feel good power differences and im not. ive not dynoed the car yet. that cost $$$ right? ive been in my buddies 02 wrx with turbo back exhaust and up pipe, no engine management, and his feels faster! so im confused i guess! does my stock cat back cause huge restrictions? should i replace the mid pipe? i bought the car used and the previous owner had installed some sort of axle back exhaust, which i cant identify, but it doesnt have 3 inch piping. thoughts?
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Old 09-13-2005, 03:17 PM   #4
tk686
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also, how do i make sure the stock restrictor pill is still installed in case the last owner removed it?
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Old 09-13-2005, 03:18 PM   #5
Car vs. Driver
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IT could be numerous factors to be honest with you ... try taking it to a dyno, usually about $100 for three pulls and see what kind of #'s you get.

Also may want to check your plugs and do a compression test since you purchased it used, that could also be a factor.
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Old 09-13-2005, 03:25 PM   #6
specialev
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I made a similar upgrade over last weekend. ERZ downpipe, gutted UP, and AP running the stage 2 91 octane maps. Huge difference, like night and day. I have the stock cat back in the car still, as well. Something is definately going wrong with your upgrade, somwhere.

Check the wastgate to make sure that it is in the shut position. Are you sure you turned the control arm clevis coupling in the right direction to add more tension to the wastegate at the closed setting?
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Old 09-13-2005, 05:30 PM   #7
tk686
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im pretty sure the wastegate is in the shut position, but im new to turbo cars so i could be wrong. i turned the arm nut torwards the right, that im positive about. as for the plugs, well, its almost at the scheduled changing time, 60,000, my car has 58,000 miles. that could be a factor. the car doesnt really spoll up that quick and hessitates a small bit. how much of a pain is changing the plugs? anyone close to burlington, VT that feels like hepling a brother out, lol?
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Old 09-13-2005, 11:00 PM   #8
shinsain
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First of all, your target boost is not off in any gear. First through third will be lower than 4th and 5th. You only hit full boost in those two gears. And 15.8 +/- .5psi is target boost, so you're spot on. I'm not sure why you tried the HWG map, or adjusted your actuator arm, there was NO point in doing either. The problem doesn't lie in faulty boost control or anything related to that.

You *need to give the car a week or two to smooth out. You really need to get a boost gauge. You really need to stop futsing around with stuff when you really don't know if what you're doing is even going to help. If you are adjusting your WG actuator and asking about boost, and using the HWG map, you are wrong.

Look elsewhere such as compression, plugs/wires/ect. Your problem is also *not your stock cat-back. I ran that setup for quite a while and never had a problem like that. The cat-back is the least of your restriction worries right now. Do you have the catless or the catted Cobb downpipe? It shouldn't make a difference but...

Also, you should have felt a pretty major difference. From my uppipe and downpipe to Stage 2, I felt an enormous difference. Now I've gotten the car tuned/dynoed and feel another big difference.

You should definitely be checking elsewhere. Or, you could just be smoking crack...?
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Old 09-13-2005, 11:36 PM   #9
bluestone
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why are you using the HWG map? try switching to the regular stg 2 v1.30 map, that's the proper starting point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shinsain
First of all, your target boost is not off in any gear. First through third will be lower than 4th and 5th. You only hit full boost in those two gears. And 15.8 +/- .5psi is target boost, so you're spot on. I'm not sure why you tried the HWG map, or adjusted your actuator arm, there was NO point in doing either. The problem doesn't lie in faulty boost control or anything related to that.

You *need to give the car a week or two to smooth out. You really need to get a boost gauge. You really need to stop futsing around with stuff when you really don't know if what you're doing is even going to help. If you are adjusting your WG actuator and asking about boost, and using the HWG map, you are wrong.
don't know what you're talking about, i get 15.8 psi in 2nd and 3rd gear. why does he need a boost gauge when he has the live boost reading? and he did say in his post it's been flashing for two weeks already and that should be long enough for the map to adjust.
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Old 09-14-2005, 12:18 AM   #10
shinsain
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluestone
don't know what you're talking about, i get 15.8 psi in 2nd and 3rd gear.
No you don't, I promise you. Unless something is broken, you don't get 15.8 in 2nd gear. Possibly in third for a fraction of a second, but not 2nd.

At any rate, his boost is fine. If he let the car go for a week or two and his power didn't increase (or increase to what he expected that is ) either something else is wrong, or he had just expected something that he didn't get.....?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bluestone
why does he need a boost gauge when he has the live boost reading?
Tried holding your AP still, in a visible place, where you can still see the road, while doing WOT and full boost runs, along with making sure you don't break the AP connection lately? Its a safety thing.
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Old 09-14-2005, 12:32 AM   #11
tk686
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ok, first off, i know how to drive safely, im not some teenager, im a 30 year old man. i was extremely safe when i did the live boost read. second off, shinsain, smoking crack? whats with the abrasive attitude? i didnt just read one post and try these things! ive been reading these forums for the past 3 months and have found that no one agrees in majority on wether or not the accuator arm adj. is bad or good. ive also read that trying the hwg map could give me better results. yes, i planned on switching back to the stage 2 1.30 map but i figured i try it and see for myself. i did let it run for 2 weeks also. all im asking for is a bit of advice from what i thought was a friendly forum. if youve got nothing patient and friendly to say, i suggest you dont respond at all. i may not be extremely knowledgable with cars, but im not idiot either. please dont talk to me like one. bluestone, i appreciate you comments.
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Old 09-14-2005, 07:31 AM   #12
f4phantomii
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Just out of curiosity, did you reset the ECU? Or is that not necessary after a reflash?

Seems like I remember several folks complaining that it really did take about 2 weeks for their cars to cope with the AP map...especially if they didn't reset the ECU.

-Michael
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Old 09-14-2005, 10:13 AM   #13
J-Rex2004
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It resets when you reflash.
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Old 09-14-2005, 10:30 AM   #14
shinsain
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tk686
ok, first off, i know how to drive safely, im not some teenager, im a 30 year old man.
If you're 30 years old, you should know how to read posts better. I was trying to help you. You took it the wrong way.

Furthermore, knowing how to drive safely and being able to perform that same safe driving while doing many other things are two different things.

Buy a boost gauge, they're like 50 to 60 bucks for a decent one and then you don't have to mess with your AP every time you want a boost reading. Not to mention the PITA of trying to take live readings from the AP. That's all.

And what I tried to tell you is that the HWG map only has revised WG duty cycles, essentially keeping it closed longer to try and make/hold boost better. But, if you're making boost fine, its a non issue to even use it.

Try loading the real-time map of the Stage 2 over the base-map. Sometimes that seems to help folks' cars to "learn" quicker. I know it helps mine.

But I would really be looking elsewhere.

Aaron
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Old 09-14-2005, 10:38 AM   #15
StealthfishWRX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tk686
ok, im new here! i have 2002 WRX. ive got a cobb downpipe to stock back exhaust, gutted Up pipe, and cobb stage 2 HWG 93oct for a base map. no intake mods except drop in kNN filter. i dont feel big or even medium gains. ive done the actuator arm adj. 2 turns as well. i installed these mods in one day, straight from stock, with the exception of the arm adj mod. ive done a live boost read, and even though i get 15.3 in 4th and 15.7 in 5th, i get low #'s in 1st, 2nd, and 3rd and not much pull. it doesnt feel that much different than stock. does anyone have any suggestions as to what my problem is or what might be going on?

hit the tracks or go against an sti for fun.......u'll def see it, I have stg 2 AP with stock CBE, and i'm neck to neck with an STi........i thought the same thing......its not feelable bc its your ride but when you go against one u'll feel the difference...it might not feel as tho your pulling as hard but it is.
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Old 09-14-2005, 10:50 AM   #16
DJ Catchem
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It sounds like you're where you should be if you're seeing those boost numbers. I just took my '02 to a Stg. 2 AP tune (adding a Helix Catted DP), and it took me at least a week to really feel the difference and see the right boost numbers.

You'll only see over 15psi in your top gears, as was said already. Did you notice a big gain in your bottom end? I noticed that right off. No more goosing the pedal to take off from stoplights...it just pulls. Now that the ECU has re-learned, it's a monster. I was happy but a little unconvinced too, until my wife finally rode in it last night, and she was blown away at the difference. My guess is that you're just fooled a bit by the gradual change. Don't worry about it. =)

I'm down near White River Junction...I'd meet you at some point to check it out and compare our two cars, but I'm installing a Greddy cat-back on Saturday morning, so it might be a bit skewed by then...

--->DJ
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Old 09-14-2005, 10:58 AM   #17
tk686
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ok, i apologize if i took your post the wrong way. yes, it came off a little abrasive to me, but im new to this forum and a little nervous about how ill be responded to. i guess i got a little overwhelmed. so i apologize for that. as for the HMG map, i switched it back to v 1.30 yesterday. im changing the plugs today, as its due anyway. as for the wastegate arm adj.,whats the deal with this anyway? safe? not safe? i ony shortened it 2 turns. should i return it to normal? also, is the HWG map dangerous?
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