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Old 09-25-2005, 02:42 AM   #1
kgb
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Unhappy As expected, failed smog check (or as I call it, getting AirScared)

Ugly numbers from the IM240 test (a simulated drive for 4 minutes)
HC = 2.288 > 0.37 (Avg = 0.1184)
CO = 36.767 > 6.21 (Avg = 3.7343)
NOx = 0.2022 < 0.93 (Avg = 0.2016)
all g/km

Either I have a tune that is not emission-friendly (safe conservative tune that throws fuel to prevent detonation), that the Link-1 can't be made emission-friendly (crap closed-loop, no knock detection, no inlet air temp compensation at least the AVO firmware, richen mixture on snap closed throttle), or that RS-Ts can never be made to pass the IM240 (under the readings of an NA car). 3 months to fix it or else it's off the road.

Just curious if any of you guys might have a suggestion - run higher octane, lean tune it, switch ECU, etc. The problem is that I can't verify that I will pass unless I go test again.
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Old 09-25-2005, 02:58 AM   #2
Drac9
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My suggestion is a link plus, autronic, or an "expensive emmissions test"
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Old 09-25-2005, 03:36 AM   #3
turb04
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pay off some mexican dude that corrupt to do it..thats what i do :-) "no cats"
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Old 09-25-2005, 06:52 AM   #4
b4437
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turb04
pay off some mexican dude that corrupt to do it..thats what i do :-) "no cats"
pm,me of where,fool.
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Old 09-25-2005, 09:42 AM   #5
LotusDriftx
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Run that stuff from the auto store for passing emissions tests, here is a blurb from some random site:
Quote:
Powerful and super concentrated formula designed to PASS the Emissions Test Control. Before taking the emissions test control add Pura Emissions Test to gasoline that guarantees to pass the smog check.

Several days before the test, add PT-GAS Emissions Test to the tank full of gasoline and let the product work while driving some 200 miles (320 kms). Before taking the test, we recommend changing the oil and treating the engine with PuraLube.

If the car doesn’t pass the test, check for possible mechanical problems.


and obviously you need to lean out your mixture. I would also consider putting a cat on there just for the test.




And just a blurb for proof behind the theory (no clue which product to buy though)
Quote:

TITLE: Fuel Additives for Reduced Engine Emissions


Q: What soot reducing fuel additives have been attempted by USAF
sponsored studies? What were the results?

A: In the 70s, various additives were found to be very efficient
in reducing particulate emissions, however, these additives also
had major drawbacks. The additives had metals which deposited or
eroded turbine blades, were thermally unstable causing deposition
problems in fuel nozzles, and some were toxic which caused handling
problems. Additives tested recently that have shown potential
include the +100 additive (a detergent dispersant) formulated for
increasing thermal stability, and proprietary compounds (some
commercially available and others in experimental phase). These
new compounds are all believed to be of organic nature with no metals.
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Old 09-25-2005, 12:01 PM   #6
modaddict
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the "pour some siht in your tank and go pass emissions" doesnt work. please, its probly water. you need cats. you have high unburnt fuel and partially burnt fuel. you need to retard your timing to start. and your cylinder temps need to be hotter. without cats, its dam hard to reduce your hc's and co levels. its probly possible, but not likely.
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Old 09-25-2005, 12:43 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by modaddict
the "pour some siht in your tank and go pass emissions" doesnt work. please, its probly water. you need cats. you have high unburnt fuel and partially burnt fuel. you need to retard your timing to start. and your cylinder temps need to be hotter. without cats, its dam hard to reduce your hc's and co levels. its probly possible, but not likely.
learn how to spell and don't dodge the swear filter.



It is a proven concept (but like I said I have no idea what brand is NOT a snake oil product). I have also read experiences on other forums of people failing and then passing later with the only change being an additive.
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Old 09-26-2005, 02:46 AM   #8
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Had 2 high flow CATs already, and in the process of leaning out the map as much as I can without knocking (not that I can really tell other than EGT reading). Right now I'm working on Row 1 (0-40KPa, supposingly centered at 20KPa). Tuned to stoich, EGT rises rather quickly - max adv is 37* starting at 2000rpm (Zi125) all the way to the end (Zi165). Again, at this point, I seriously rather need only a tune to pass without blowing it up due to knock and I have 3 months to do it - any pointers would be appreciated, and ask as much info as you need - this is an AVO kit with Link-1, 3" CAT back with dual highflow CAT.
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Old 09-26-2005, 02:48 AM   #9
kgb
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turb04
pay off some mexican dude that corrupt to do it..thats what i do :-) "no cats"
Actually, up here would be pay some union dude to get it thru, if you're lucky that there aren't more of them. Don't know how effective the cats are now given that they were subjected to rich mixture for 8 months or so
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Old 09-26-2005, 10:53 AM   #10
Souperduck
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This could be really expensive, and it's a real newbie question, but could you just throw a couple more cats on the car? it would be hard to fabricate, but IMO if it's the difference between being able to drive your car and not, it would be worth it.
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Old 09-26-2005, 11:13 AM   #11
Drac9
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I would say it would be easier to teturn to stcok for emmissions then put everything back rather than try to add any more cats. What injectors are you running? Any chance of just lowering static fuel pressure and running stock ecu to pass? Around here they only run it at idle and 2500 rpm's.
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Old 09-26-2005, 12:27 PM   #12
kgb
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Well, if it was only just the idle test, I can tune for that - returning to stock is a hell lot of trouble - I have to yank all the coolant lines and oil lines off the turbo (and plug up what ever hole I have created) and re-wire the injectors and ignition back onto the stock ECU, not to mention the removal of the whole exhaust system starting from the uppipe, as well as the intercooler - I suspect that job alone is close to $1000 in labour. I don't have much of a pipe left after the 2 cats because of 2 resonators. Might be able to find a regular cat and swap out one high-flow. Right now I don't know how much leaning out I can do before I blow it up due to knock and high EGT - I've been running around 1300-1400F during cruising and the minute I try to accelerate, it would go dangerously near 1500F
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Old 09-26-2005, 12:28 PM   #13
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I just want to find a setup that will pass smog instead of getting around it - or is that mission impossible?
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Old 09-26-2005, 02:08 PM   #14
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do you have stock cats? i think that is the best way to go.
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Old 09-26-2005, 04:36 PM   #15
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stock cat's location is now occupied by the downpipe, plus it has an ID of 1.75"
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Old 09-26-2005, 05:24 PM   #16
Boom05rs25
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Its going to sound deadly,maybe a bit crazy......Stock ecu open wastegate as much as you can "0 boost preferable but probbly not obtainable" Run 87 octane on a hot engine,this will reduce your overall CO output......Your HC levels arnt bad these should reduce with CO levels.


Edit:RS-T's arnt going to pass most emission test under N/A guidlines because of the amount of fuel that is used to prevent detnation....It is possible with a perfect tune but a perfect tune is few and far between

Last edited by Boom05rs25; 09-26-2005 at 05:39 PM.
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Old 09-26-2005, 07:27 PM   #17
kgb
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I'm wondering if the high CR has anything to do with the need to throw more fuel - a WRX has the same limit to meet. Haven't seen the numbers for an STi yet because none of those required smog check. Displacement (2.5 instead of 2.0), CR (10:1 vs 8:1) seems to factor in. I guess if the internal wastegate is wired open I might have a chance to fully lean it out since it would technically not be able to make any boost (thus, not needing to worry as much about detonation)
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Old 09-26-2005, 09:43 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kgb
Ugly numbers from the IM240 test

CO = 36.767 > 6.21 (Avg = 3.7343)
Your ****ed

Your emissions are worse than the '78 scoob wagon im trying to get smoged... And it doesnt have stock cats (cause it didnt come with 'em) and it has CARBS!
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Old 09-26-2005, 09:46 PM   #19
kgb
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kostamojen
Your ****ed

Your emissions are worse than the '78 scoob wagon im trying to get smoged... And it doesnt have stock cats (cause it didnt come with 'em) and it has CARBS!
Yeah - who knows how much boost the guy drove it to... and he wasn't smooth either

Plan of attack - 0 boost, as high octane as possible, lean out, wire wideband simulated narrowband to allow for close loop, hope for cooler day, and if all fails, back to stock ECU
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Old 09-26-2005, 09:47 PM   #20
kgb
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oh and I forgot - I might need to switch to a non hi-flow cat for one of the cats
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Old 09-26-2005, 11:16 PM   #21
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Lower octane is better,it dosnt burn off as hot.....thus less burnt carbons...trust me lower octane, not higher
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Old 09-27-2005, 01:27 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kgb
oh and I forgot - I might need to switch to a non hi-flow cat for one of the cats
Your best bet would be to modify a WRX downpipe to fit.

But high CO's wont are not an issue cats can solve.
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Old 09-27-2005, 01:57 AM   #23
kgb
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lower octane = knock to death before the test is over...

would running closed-loop at stoich solves a lot of it? It seems I can't really tune for stoich open-loop without grossly leaning out (which would have meant dangerously lean during transition from cruise to boost, even slight boost)
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