How much HP out of a 1.8L?

jester409 · 09-21-2005, 12:50 PM

I am not particularly power hungry, but wouldn't mind adding an extra 20 or so horsepower to the 1.8L. Can anyone recommend a good path to get there? Possibly a set of heads off of another subaru motor and new cams? Is this even possible, or should I just read up on a 2.5 swap?

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EcksJay · 09-21-2005, 01:24 PM

2.5 swap is by far a much better route, for the money.

99subi · 09-21-2005, 01:29 PM

wow im dumb

Nicklbrso · 09-21-2005, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EcksJay

2.5 swap is by far a much better route, for the money.

what he said

jester409 · 09-21-2005, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EcksJay

2.5 swap is by far a much better route, for the money.

That's what I was thinking...

2.5 it will be...

Matt Monson · 09-21-2005, 03:06 PM

I've got one, complete with ECU...

chip4761 · 09-21-2005, 03:35 PM

Matt - Oh yeah? How much $$?

jester - If you want 20HP, get an ej22. However, only if you can get it for free, or very very cheap. Mine was free. It was worth a saturday.

jester409 · 09-21-2005, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chip4761

jester - If you want 20HP, get an ej22. However, only if you can get it for free, or very very cheap. Mine was free. It was worth a saturday.

Agreed... I think a 2.2 would probably have enough power for me, and if I could get a dirt cheap one, I would think about going in that direction. Otherwise, I'd swap in 50hp before I would 20hp.

Matt Monson · 09-21-2005, 05:41 PM

Chip,
PM me if you are interested.

You guys should look up the high compression frankenstein thread. Use Ej22 heads on an Ej25 bottom end on your stock ECU and wiring. Don't even mess with putting Ej18 heads onto any other block. I should have a couple of rebuilt Ej25 bottom ends available sometime next month...

93subi · 09-21-2005, 10:36 PM

I found that putting a new motor in my car would be a pain since the 1.8 wireing harness goes thru a different spot in my cars fire wall then the 2.5 or 2.2 wireing harness does so instead of chopping stuff up I just put a 2.2 short block from a 1991 legacy in and slapped my 1.8 heads back on, gave me a lot of HP, more than I thought it would and the CR is up higher now, also the engine seems to be much more resposive

EcksJay · 09-22-2005, 06:49 AM

Ummm...no. The mounts for the wiring harnesses are in the same spot. But anyway, if you are swapping a 2.5 into a 1.8, you will most likely end up using the 1.8 engine harness and vacuum harness. No cutting and stuff that way.

chip4761 · 09-22-2005, 08:57 AM

ummm, no. The wiring harness from the intake manifold on a two port ej22 is on the drivers side. It is on the passengers side on an ej18. That's why you keep your intake manifold for that swap.

Lethargic1 · 09-22-2005, 11:47 AM

The Ej22 is a nice engine with some decent power; however, like all things, you will get used to it and then want more power. I say, go for the better engine swap NOW while you're going to do it anyway and get the Ej25. Trust me, I can already see a swap coming my way sometime down the road. This is also why I'm reluctant to put money into modding my engine.

Matt Monson · 09-22-2005, 12:56 PM

An Ej22 block under Ej18 heads can't be giving you more than 15 or 20 extra horses, for a lot of work. I concur with the guys saying go straight to an Ej25. And you can get a set of Delta cams for $165 and install them before you even drop the engine.

And I am sorry guys. I have gotten a couple of PM's about my Ej25. It is no longer available. I am putting it into my RS while I do some more work to my other engine...

EcksJay · 09-23-2005, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt Monson

....I concur with the guys saying go straight to an Ej25. And you can get a set of Delta cams for $165 and install them before you even drop the engine.

I got the Delta cams in my car, and it dyno's 150 HP and 158 TQ....AT THE WHEEL!!!

$500 for the motor, $165 for the cams, 2 days of work, and that's about it!

Lethargic1 · 09-24-2005, 12:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EcksJay

I got the Delta cams in my car, and it dyno's 150 HP and 158 TQ....AT THE WHEEL!!!

$500 for the motor, $165 for the cams, 2 days of work, and that's about it!

You send the cams out to Delta and they regrind them, or do you just buy new cams?

93subi · 09-24-2005, 01:29 AM

are u getting 150 hp to the wheels on a AWD L or a FWD L ?

EcksJay · 09-24-2005, 08:09 AM

You take the cams out of the 2.5, send them to Delta, they regrind them, ship 'em back the next day. Between shipping and work, you're looking at about a week total.

150hp AWD

Lethargic1 · 09-24-2005, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EcksJay

You take the cams out of the 2.5, send them to Delta, they regrind them, ship 'em back the next day. Between shipping and work, you're looking at about a week total.

150hp AWD

Hmm...I wonder how much I would get out of my ej22 cams. I must do more searching.

Kevin Thomas · 09-24-2005, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EcksJay

I got the Delta cams in my car, and it dyno's 150 HP and 158 TQ....AT THE WHEEL!!!

$500 for the motor, $165 for the cams, 2 days of work, and that's about it!

Are you sure about this? I was looking for dyno information and could've sworn you said this was crank hp.

Ahh, here it is.
In reference to this dyno plot:
http://we-todd-did-racing.com/wetodd...EzZGZkMzF5NTQx

This thread: http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...highlight=dyno

Someone asked this question about your dyno plot--->

Quote:

Originally Posted by supermoose

what kinda dyno was that. its showing crank Hp right?

You responded--->

Quote:

Originally Posted by EcksJay

I believe that it was a DynoJet. And yes, that is crank hp....

Either way, your torque band is excellent and anyone would love to have that.

93subi · 09-24-2005, 07:45 PM

think its time for me to get a 2.5 swap and some cams, that would be crazy power to a front wheel scooby

EcksJay · 09-24-2005, 10:36 PM

yes. I "thought" it was CHP. I was kinda dismayed to see those numbers, when I left, I failed to confirm if it was CHP or WHP. I went back a few days later, and they said that they really don't have a way to measure CHP. So yes, it is WHP

other post edited for clarity

redwagon · 09-25-2005, 12:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EcksJay

I failed to confirm if it was CHP or WHP. I went back a few days later, and they said that they really don't have a way to measure CHP.

Wow, you met an honest dyno operator. So few and far between.

<-- so sick of bs calculated/compensated/estimated chp numbers...

As to the OP's question, I'd either go straight to an EJ25 swap or DIY turbo. The little EJ18 makes so little power as it is, the few percent here and there from boltons just doesn't add up to enough to be worth the money. You spend the same amount of cash modding the engine as you do for a complete swap, but still end up with less power and driveability. Remember that the beauty of the EJ25 is not it's peak hp figure (which is still modest) but the low rpm torque. You can find good EJ25s from people who are swapping EJ20* engines for not much money. Easy swap. If you cash left over, get the cams at the same time as others here have suggested. Get some EL headers and maybe some engine management and you're well on your way to 200hp.

Go check out the AFI forum and search for EJ18 + turbo. Quite a few guys there have gone this route, Subachad is one that's had great success and has parts which you'll need. It seems you can get 200hp from 5psi or so and still have a reliable car. It's a bit more work than an EJ25 swap but if you like tinkering and having a unique car, that could be the way to go. If you're patient and pick up your parts at the right price you can put the whole thing together for not much more than a swap.
(sorry y'all, to be blaspheming in the NA forum

)
<-- too lazy/impatient to go the turbo route, swapped instead. Worth every penny.

Hawk296 · 09-25-2005, 01:59 AM

EJ25=FUN!

EcksJay · 09-25-2005, 07:03 AM

I agree with redwagon. If I had the time and money, I would have rather had gone turbo, but at 136k, I thought it a bit risky.

09-21-2005, 12:50 PM	#1
jester409 Scooby Newbie Member#: 64376 Join Date: Jun 2004 Chapter/Region: South East Location: TN Vehicle: 04 WRX WRB	How much HP out of a 1.8L? I am not particularly power hungry, but wouldn't mind adding an extra 20 or so horsepower to the 1.8L. Can anyone recommend a good path to get there? Possibly a set of heads off of another subaru motor and new cams? Is this even possible, or should I just read up on a 2.5 swap? * Registered users of the site do not see these ads.

09-21-2005, 01:29 PM	#3
99subi Scooby Guru Member#: 78118 Join Date: Dec 2004 Chapter/Region: Tri-State Location: Westchester NY Vehicle: 2002 Corvette coupe 05 Legacy	wow im dumb Last edited by 99subi; 09-21-2005 at 11:18 PM.

09-24-2005, 10:36 PM	#22
EcksJay Scooby Specialist Member#: 77677 Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Maine Vehicle: 1997 OBS '07 KLR 650	yes. I "thought" it was CHP. I was kinda dismayed to see those numbers, when I left, I failed to confirm if it was CHP or WHP. I went back a few days later, and they said that they really don't have a way to measure CHP. So yes, it is WHP other post edited for clarity Last edited by EcksJay; 09-24-2005 at 10:42 PM.

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09-21-2005, 01:24 PM	#2
EcksJay Scooby Specialist Member#: 77677 Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Maine Vehicle: 1997 OBS '07 KLR 650	2.5 swap is by far a much better route, for the money.

09-21-2005, 03:06 PM	#6
Matt Monson Scooby Guru Member#: 832 Join Date: Jan 2000 Chapter/Region: RMIC Location: Teh Ghetto Garage, CO Vehicle: 99 2.5RS, '85 911 '73 914 and 2012 BRZ	I've got one, complete with ECU...

09-21-2005, 03:35 PM	#7
chip4761 Scooby Newbie Member#: 55867 Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Ashtabula, OH Vehicle: 2005 Saabaru AS	Matt - Oh yeah? How much $$? jester - If you want 20HP, get an ej22. However, only if you can get it for free, or very very cheap. Mine was free. It was worth a saturday.

09-21-2005, 05:41 PM	#9
Matt Monson Scooby Guru Member#: 832 Join Date: Jan 2000 Chapter/Region: RMIC Location: Teh Ghetto Garage, CO Vehicle: 99 2.5RS, '85 911 '73 914 and 2012 BRZ	Chip, PM me if you are interested. You guys should look up the high compression frankenstein thread. Use Ej22 heads on an Ej25 bottom end on your stock ECU and wiring. Don't even mess with putting Ej18 heads onto any other block. I should have a couple of rebuilt Ej25 bottom ends available sometime next month...

09-21-2005, 10:36 PM	#10
93subi Scooby Newbie Member#: 81255 Join Date: Feb 2005 Chapter/Region: Tri-State Location: Westchester/Rockland Vehicle: 98 05 LGT, silver 98 Trans AM, Red	I found that putting a new motor in my car would be a pain since the 1.8 wireing harness goes thru a different spot in my cars fire wall then the 2.5 or 2.2 wireing harness does so instead of chopping stuff up I just put a 2.2 short block from a 1991 legacy in and slapped my 1.8 heads back on, gave me a lot of HP, more than I thought it would and the CR is up higher now, also the engine seems to be much more resposive

09-22-2005, 06:49 AM	#11
EcksJay Scooby Specialist Member#: 77677 Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Maine Vehicle: 1997 OBS '07 KLR 650	Ummm...no. The mounts for the wiring harnesses are in the same spot. But anyway, if you are swapping a 2.5 into a 1.8, you will most likely end up using the 1.8 engine harness and vacuum harness. No cutting and stuff that way.

09-22-2005, 08:57 AM	#12
chip4761 Scooby Newbie Member#: 55867 Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Ashtabula, OH Vehicle: 2005 Saabaru AS	ummm, no. The wiring harness from the intake manifold on a two port ej22 is on the drivers side. It is on the passengers side on an ej18. That's why you keep your intake manifold for that swap.

09-22-2005, 11:47 AM	#13
Lethargic1 Scooby Specialist Member#: 20998 Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: I'm still in Arkansas Vehicle: 97' Impreza L Wagon Mystic Blue Pearl	The Ej22 is a nice engine with some decent power; however, like all things, you will get used to it and then want more power. I say, go for the better engine swap NOW while you're going to do it anyway and get the Ej25. Trust me, I can already see a swap coming my way sometime down the road. This is also why I'm reluctant to put money into modding my engine.

09-22-2005, 12:56 PM	#14
Matt Monson Scooby Guru Member#: 832 Join Date: Jan 2000 Chapter/Region: RMIC Location: Teh Ghetto Garage, CO Vehicle: 99 2.5RS, '85 911 '73 914 and 2012 BRZ	An Ej22 block under Ej18 heads can't be giving you more than 15 or 20 extra horses, for a lot of work. I concur with the guys saying go straight to an Ej25. And you can get a set of Delta cams for $165 and install them before you even drop the engine. And I am sorry guys. I have gotten a couple of PM's about my Ej25. It is no longer available. I am putting it into my RS while I do some more work to my other engine...

09-24-2005, 01:29 AM	#17
93subi Scooby Newbie Member#: 81255 Join Date: Feb 2005 Chapter/Region: Tri-State Location: Westchester/Rockland Vehicle: 98 05 LGT, silver 98 Trans AM, Red	are u getting 150 hp to the wheels on a AWD L or a FWD L ?

09-24-2005, 08:09 AM	#18
EcksJay Scooby Specialist Member#: 77677 Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Maine Vehicle: 1997 OBS '07 KLR 650	You take the cams out of the 2.5, send them to Delta, they regrind them, ship 'em back the next day. Between shipping and work, you're looking at about a week total. 150hp AWD

09-24-2005, 07:45 PM	#21
93subi Scooby Newbie Member#: 81255 Join Date: Feb 2005 Chapter/Region: Tri-State Location: Westchester/Rockland Vehicle: 98 05 LGT, silver 98 Trans AM, Red	think its time for me to get a 2.5 swap and some cams, that would be crazy power to a front wheel scooby

09-25-2005, 01:59 AM	#24
Hawk296 Scooby Specialist Member#: 14555 Join Date: Jan 2002 Chapter/Region: MWSOC Location: Troy, MI Vehicle: 1995 L (Apex Tiger) Battle Ready Baja	EJ25=FUN!

09-25-2005, 07:03 AM	#25
EcksJay Scooby Specialist Member#: 77677 Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Maine Vehicle: 1997 OBS '07 KLR 650	I agree with redwagon. If I had the time and money, I would have rather had gone turbo, but at 136k, I thought it a bit risky.