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Old 10-12-2005, 08:17 PM   #1
wuuusaa
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Default Strongest Block?

Does anybody know what was the strongest block Subaru ever produced and that can handle the most boost stock?
Thanks Alex
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Old 10-12-2005, 08:39 PM   #2
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If I am not mistaken an i could be it would be our blocks, the ej22t. But there are also 2.0 liter closed deck blocks found in japan and europe.
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Old 10-13-2005, 06:13 AM   #3
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I've been told the same thing.... The Leg 2.2 is the strongest stock block... DynoComp tuned a 2.2 with a Garret rotated mount turbo on 100 octaine gas at 400 to the tires! Great block in my opinion, and I have an STi!
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Old 10-13-2005, 06:32 AM   #4
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The EJ22T out of the 91-94 turbo Legacy's is a closed deck block, the EJ20 from the Ver3 (I think) Spec C is closed deck also. These are the only 2 closed blocks Subaru produced that I know of. I have heard of a 2.2 taking 30+ psi on completly stock internals with a little over 150K miles.
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Old 10-13-2005, 08:47 AM   #5
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The overseas 1st gen Legacy/Liberty turbos had the EJ20G which is closed deck as well. The v1/v2/v3 blocks were all closed deck too, IIRC. The 22b also has a closed deck block that is very similar to the EJ22T block but varies slightly.
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Old 10-13-2005, 03:06 PM   #6
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ej22G -22b block(uber rare) the ej20G legacy RS and V1.V.2 (not v3) and usdm ej22T
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Old 10-13-2005, 03:55 PM   #7
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Oh ya, that's right. V3, MY97, was the year they dropped the closed deck. My bad.
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Old 10-13-2005, 04:26 PM   #8
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I have heard that the closed deck 2.0's forge is not as strong(dense) as the 2.2 closed deck's forge and also does not have the oil squirters. This has been talked about before by Zephyr but i couldn't find the link but there is a lot of good info. It might be over on legacycentral now that i think about it.
-max
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Old 10-13-2005, 06:51 PM   #9
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Default close deck

i believe all EJ20G/EJ22G made in '94 and earlier were all close deck. correct me if im wrong.
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Old 10-13-2005, 07:17 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by legacymaximus
I have heard that the closed deck 2.0's forge is not as strong(dense) as the 2.2 closed deck's forge and also does not have the oil squirters. This has been talked about before by Zephyr but i couldn't find the link but there is a lot of good info. It might be over on legacycentral now that i think about it.
-max
Max,
He was comparing it to the other more modern open deck blocks. The EJ20G closed deck blocks use the same medium pressure casting method that the Ej22T blocks used. They have the same cross hatch marks on the blocks. And they have under piston squirters. Both of mine do...

And Mark is Xephyr, not Zephyr. Maybe why your search didn't bring up that old thread? But you are correct, quotes from it are stickied at the top of the engine forum on Legacy Central...

But one needs to be careful when block shopping, after MY94, all non-sti blocks, Legacy and WRX went open deck. I know of one member who recently got an Ej20G from a Legacy that he thought was closed deck, and he pulled the heads to find it open. He had been led to believe it was a '91, but when I ran the applied engine code for him, I found it to be later...
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Old 10-14-2005, 03:36 AM   #11
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Keep in mind the STi closed deck blocks, including the RS-RA will be stronger due to the forged pistons.
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Old 10-14-2005, 09:13 PM   #12
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i have 2 ej22t that have piston oil squirters in the cases.
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Old 10-15-2005, 01:58 AM   #13
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I have 2 EJ22T also right now, haven't really torn these down though. One of them has about 160k and the other one only has 80k. If I had extra cash I'd just keep buying them up and freshen them up for resale. I love this engine for it's superior durability.
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Old 10-15-2005, 02:02 AM   #14
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They just need to be screwed back in.......
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Old 10-15-2005, 02:41 AM   #15
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crossposter!
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Old 10-19-2005, 12:00 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spoolinsuby
The EJ22T out of the 91-94 turbo Legacy's is a closed deck block, the EJ20 from the Ver3 (I think) Spec C is closed deck also. These are the only 2 closed blocks Subaru produced that I know of. I have heard of a 2.2 taking 30+ psi on completly stock internals with a little over 150K miles.
Does that mean you could bolt on a bigger turbo and put in some larger injectors and just run it like that?
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Old 10-19-2005, 10:09 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guru Imakuni
Does that mean you could bolt on a bigger turbo and put in some larger injectors and just run it like that?
...you'd need to tune it, obviously. A lot of people on the LegacyCentral.org forums just crank their tiny turbos on their stock engines with no management. I don't hear much about them blowing up but a tiny turbo blowing very hot air into a stock motor at ~16 psi, with a MAF sensor that maxes out around 11psi, is a receipe for knock. Knock will bring down the strongest of engines (even an SRT-4).
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Old 10-19-2005, 11:42 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeusExMachina
...you'd need to tune it, obviously. A lot of people on the LegacyCentral.org forums just crank their tiny turbos on their stock engines with no management. I don't hear much about them blowing up but a tiny turbo blowing very hot air into a stock motor at ~16 psi, with a MAF sensor that maxes out around 11psi, is a receipe for knock. Knock will bring down the strongest of engines (even an SRT-4).
Tuning is what seperates the men from the blown motors. Just wondering because someone in OT linked an eBay listing to a Legact turbo that I last saw going for $~450, plus it's like 15 minutes away. So turbo and injectors vs. wrx swap. Hmmm...
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Old 10-19-2005, 01:33 PM   #19
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Noone, here or on Legacy Central is running 30psi on stock heads. There is just no point. The heads don't flow enough for really big turbos. If you want to run a big turbo on an Ej22T block, you want to change the heads to Ej25 or Ej20 heads. Do a search in the AFI forum for HOK, Wedge, No-Coast-Punk, Xephyr and Drac9 to see a few of the set ups that have been run. Those are all 400+hp cars.
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Old 10-19-2005, 02:14 PM   #20
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I read that the limit on stock rods was about 30psi, but wouldn't it matter much more on the HP of the setup rather than strictly the amount of boost?

that makes no sense to me... the limit on stock internals must be HP related rather than boost, right?

I am looking for one of these motors right now for possible use later in my car
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Old 10-19-2005, 05:28 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Monson
Noone, here or on Legacy Central is running 30psi on stock heads. There is just no point. The heads don't flow enough for really big turbos. If you want to run a big turbo on an Ej22T block, you want to change the heads to Ej25 or Ej20 heads. Do a search in the AFI forum for HOK, Wedge, No-Coast-Punk, Xephyr and Drac9 to see a few of the set ups that have been run. Those are all 400+hp cars.
I've got ej25 heads last I knew so that's cool! I was reading over on Legacy Central and I think it brings down the compression ratio to like 7.xx:1 with ej25 heads. Are the ej22t motors really rare? I ask because at this moment a high output ej22 is pretty useless when I have an RS transmission and the reason I looked at this swap was because the Legacy Turbo was cheap (it's at $812 right now with 29 hours left). An ej20 would probably be more suited for my needs since (especially considering this car is likely to sell for over half the cost of a well budgeted WRX swap) there's more available information out there for it and tuning is easier for it with ECUTek and the likes. I think.
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Old 10-19-2005, 08:48 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spoolinsuby
The EJ22T out of the 91-94 turbo Legacy's is a closed deck block, the EJ20 from the Ver3 (I think) Spec C is closed deck also. These are the only 2 closed blocks Subaru produced that I know of. I have heard of a 2.2 taking 30+ psi on completly stock internals with a little over 150K miles.
are all of the Legacy's from 91-94 turbo 2.2's or are some of them NA 2.2's ??

just curious as I look for a car/motor
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Old 10-19-2005, 11:12 PM   #23
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90-94 Legacy motors were available in both NA and Turbo version. The block was the main difference (closed versus open), but they also differed with low compression factory forged pistons and they also came with 370cc versus 270cc (or something close to that) injectors. The heads were different but interchangable to a point.

However, and a big however, is that the NA 90-94 blocks had the same crank and rods as the turbo models. The NA block has no trouble taking modorate boost (as far as I have seen). I doubt the NA block could take 30 psi, but I plan on taking mine up to 12-15 if I get the money. Currently I am running 8 psi and expect no failures due to the bottom end. I "destroyed" an 220,000 mile NA motor twice where the pistons broke and shattered and yet the bottom end was fine. Even after I drove it without water for over 20 minutes (melting all plastic touching it) it still drove fine when refilled with water and new oil (although something had obviously warped). They are strong motors.
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Old 10-20-2005, 03:03 PM   #24
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Hey Thanks So Much Guys, You'll Were All Very Helpful.
Gracias Alex
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Old 10-20-2005, 03:54 PM   #25
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Actually,
The turbo blocks use moly coated cast pistons, not forged. But they are still a high quality piston.
And the FSM lists different part numbers for the Turbo vs NA cranks. I have never compared them side by side to check the differences. But my best guess is that the turbo crank gets a bevelled edge like the EJ20G cranks got. But they are both forged cranks...
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