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Old 01-09-2006, 06:49 PM   #1
swapstar
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Default Rear Hubs & Brake FAQ; 1 pots, 2 pots subaru, 2 pots brembo

ok. due to overwhelming people asking me redundent questions, here is FAQ.

this only applies to DISC brake REAR hubs. I dont care for drum brake rear hubs, neither should you. AWD rear hubs as well as FWD rear hubs do not have disc standard (although it has been done......)

#1. your disc brake hub. single piston sliding caliper 170mm e-brake hub.
the following is the brakes that your hub will directly fit
= direct bolt on
= remove and replace directly.

************************************************** ************
known disc brakes that fit this rear hub+backing plate that you have OEM:

A. non-vented single piston - 9mm thick solid rotor

10.5" diameter
-GC8 2.5RS - non-vented 9mm thick, 10.5" diameter
-2002-2005 wrx - same thing as above (note various years have various brackets that hold differnt pads- ask subysouth in brake forum for this)
-various outbacks, legacy, all pretty much the same - break out your tape measure and such when you come across one.

11.0" diameter disc
-outback H6 - most people call it "h6" upgrade
-JDM sti version 3 RA - ive seen this on 2 of them, strange occurance since previous v2 sti-RA was 10.5" vented, and v4 Sti-Ra is 2 pot subaru 11" vented ith r180...... **this is from cut cars ive seen, 2 seperate occasions in 2 differnt states and 2 differnt importers.

B. Vented single piston

10.5" diameter, 18mm wide vented. single piston sliding
-USDM legacy turbo has this oem
-jdm wrx 1993-2001 (all GC8 body).
-JDM WRX-STi versions 1/2/3/4/5/6- contrary to popular belief, JDM STi has SINGLE PISTON SLIDING REAR just like wrx.
**
i have had complete Version 5 sti CAR to verify that. 4pot front, but sliding 1 r160 rear. yes it had a EJ207 and 4.44, and yes it was a RHD JDM CAR.
**
Only version 4/5/6 Sti-RA/R/22B has 2 piston black subaru with r180
-JDM WRX-STi RA version 2 1995, sti 555 (funky special ed v2 eara car)

11.0" diameter, 18mm wide, single piston sliding
-JDM B4 legacy twin turbo car
-USDM legacy GT (2.5 turbo)
**notes - this is afaik the biggest bestest deal rear brake you can fit on your standard hub. direct bolt on caliper and rotor (fits 170mm e-brake), you will need to remove part of the backing plate shield to clearance the rotor per this thread instructions

(insert brake forum thread with smart stuff in it- or ask subysouth, bc he is smart.)

************************************************** ***********

#2 hub : R160 with 2 pot backing plate- unique afaik to 2006 usa WRX and equivilents

comes with 11" vented 18mm thickrotor, 170mm e-brake and 2 piston red "subaru" brake caliper. red caliper is identical to black caliper foundon ver 4/5/6 Sti-RA cars, ex for the obvious fact that it is red. Rotor is 170mm ebrake instead of 190mm e-brake. 170mm ebrake rotor is identical to the LGT 2005 rotor in the above.

************************************************** ********


#3 hub:

R180 GC8 rear hub. - unique to sti-RA (RA and R only) for sti-RA/R 4/5/6. No others have this.

-11.0"(290mm) 18mm wide rotor, 190mm e-brake, (identical width to above usdm 05 LGT but bigger e-brake). with 2 piston black subaru caliper

** you will need to run a R180 diff+axels, or have driveshaft shop rear axels that goes from 180 hub to 160 diff if you want to run these.

************************************************** *************

heres a thread about the parts needed to fit the rear 2 pots if you want them for some weird reason with the part numbers, backing plate info, etc.

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=915201
and
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...ght=pot+thread

************************************************** **************

IMO its a bear for the money and time you will spend. 2005 LGT rear brake swap uses the same rotor with no need to mess with backing plates, or buy the expensive bracket adapters. yes, you dont have the bling factor, but it will stop pretty much the same. i guess if you want the bling factor....... it would be most ideal to rob a 2006 WRX of its 2 complete rear hubs :P

you will have differnt opions, personal deals vary.
- i have nothing against the bling factor, i did the brembos as below.
************************************************** **********
#4 rear hub/ brake. - R180 with 13" gold brembo setup

-usdm 04-06 sti (05/06 usdm is 5X114.3, only 04 is 5X100)
-JDM Version 7/8/"9" sti. version 7/8 is 5X100, new pignose 06 is 5X114.3 in jdm land

this thread explains how to put blingin gold brembos on a GC8:

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=907818
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Old 01-09-2006, 10:38 PM   #2
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should add #4A 05 -06 hub which is differnt than the jdm 01-04 and usmd 04
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Old 01-10-2006, 02:14 AM   #3
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has anyone ever measured the diameter of the V7 rear hub where it passes thru the bearing? as well as the the outer diameter of the bearing itself? It just strikes me as odd that they'd use an entirely different knuckle when all you'd need to change is the bearing/hub/backing plate.
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Old 01-10-2006, 02:19 AM   #4
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the GDB rear hubs look the same as a GC8 160 rear. although, the measured rear track is about 7mm wider per side. with the GDB rear hub (and gc8 arms and x-member) on my car
how i know;

i used to have to run a 4mm wheel spacer on my wheel to clear room betwen tire and coilver. now i have approx 3mm more than that w.o the spacer.



Jaxx, if you would be kind enough to PM me your revisions, i would be glad to post the correction-
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Old 01-10-2006, 07:27 AM   #5
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nice observation. so you're basically saying that 48 offset rims on gc hubs would theoretically be spaced from coilover to rim like a 41 offset on a gdb?
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Old 01-10-2006, 03:44 PM   #6
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hmm. lemme think of that math.

im running the stock usdm bbs at a 53 offset iirc. it will rub on the back of a GC8 with JIC FLTA2's

i put on a 4mm spacer, and it didnt rub anymore. so it be = to a ~49mm offset wheel correct?

the GDB hub spaced it out about 7mm (per side) by the hub being physically wider.

48 offset wheel would be nice. but with the GDB rear hub, would bump it out 12mm per side theoretically. mm 24mm wide track?
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Old 01-10-2006, 04:26 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swapstar
hmm. lemme think of that math.

im running the stock usdm bbs at a 53 offset iirc. it will rub on the back of a GC8 with JIC FLTA2's

i put on a 4mm spacer, and it didnt rub anymore. so it be = to a ~49mm offset wheel correct?

the GDB hub spaced it out about 7mm (per side) by the hub being physically wider.

48 offset wheel would be nice. but with the GDB rear hub, would bump it out 12mm per side theoretically. mm 24mm wide track?
do you know how much it would rub by? barely? so you took out the spacer and now the rim has 3mm more clearance? If this is correct, I'm wondering where the extra 7mm or more is coming from. the hub housing or the knuckle itself?
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Old 01-10-2006, 04:54 PM   #8
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with a 235mm conti tire, the shock rubbed a 4mm deep groove in my tire. 4mm x 3mm wide U shaped thing (obviosuly sideways)

with the no spacer and the 225 070 oem sti tire, it rubbed about a 1mm groove - the issue here is rear camber. it rubbed slightly even with the 4mm spacer, bc the camber was about neg 2.5 deg. after adjusting camber to -0.75 deg, no more rub with the 4mm spacer - about 2 mm of clearance, but without the 4mm spacer it would still rub.

when i fit the GDB rear knuckles on, the spacer wasnt needed anymore. camber stayed the same at the .75 deg i set it at. theres approx 3-4 mm of clearance between the tire and the strut, which in my brain can be related to the previous non rubbing setuo (160 hub+ 0.75 deg camber + 4mm spacer)

i cant say its actually 7mm. 7mm is a rough guestimate of the track change on each side.

mmm. funny puzzle eh?

no idea where the width is coming from. WE NEED AN ENGINEER!@!!!
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Old 01-11-2006, 04:24 PM   #9
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hm. I swapped rear hubs/knuckles and brakes off of an 02 wrx sedan onto my gc. I lined the knuckels up side by side, and took some (sorta crude) measurements and decided they were the same. I know the GD is 15mm wider track than the GC, but I figured they must have made the changes in the lateral links or x-member.... I guess I could have been wrong...

I can't see any track width difference, not even looking down the side of the car and comparing to the front. maybe I need to get a tape measure out.

Jim
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Old 01-11-2006, 04:54 PM   #10
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hmm.

i know that the links are differnt. i have GC8 and GDB links side to side (both dogbone style) and could not find a differance.

supposedly the X member is same dimensions too, although ive never measured myself.

i know the front design is a little differnt too:

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Old 01-12-2006, 12:34 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swapstar
#2 hub : R160 with 2 pot backing plate- unique afaik to 2006 usa WRX and equivilents

comes with 11" vented 18mm thickrotor, 170mm e-brake and 2 piston red "subaru" brake caliper. red caliper is identical to black caliper foundon ver 4/5/6 Sti-RA cars, ex for the obvious fact that it is red. Rotor is 170mm ebrake instead of 190mm e-brake. 170mm ebrake rotor is identical to the LGT 2005 rotor in the above.
Why then did one only have to press new backing plates into the RS pre-06 US WRX? the R160 FHI 2pot had to have come on GC8 and GDA vehicles prior to '06...

PS...whats the 2.5RS ebrake? 170mm? 190mm? I'm gettin brackets for my FHI 2pots because I'm too lazy to do the hub dismantle and I'm trying to figure out which rotor I'm going to need (aftermarket slotted)
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Old 01-12-2006, 04:28 AM   #12
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2.5rs ebrake is small 170mm. only R180 diffs have the 190mm e-brake.

it is strange to me as well, perhaps the R160 black 2 pot small e-brake came on the WRX-NB jdm GDA? but i've seen those things with 2 piston sliding fronts identical to the usdm, which would mean rear slidning as well.

my observations and conclusions are from my actual experiances with JDM GC8 WRX STi non RA's which i have personally handled (the whole stinkin car) several times. i dont know why, i would like to solve this myth as well.

ive heard that a R160 2 pot rear does exist on some legacy B4 models?

can somone else who has actually touched full GC8 sti cars chime in>? ive only poked sti-RA's (which have 2 pots and R180), and Sti normals (which have always had rear 1 pots and r160). so thus is my conclusion. perhaps there was a RA that had a r160 and the black 2 pots?'

or all the vendors are pulling the part number from some legacy.......


Also, if they existed oem in japan (commonly existed), why do japenese people pay $300 for a set of caliper relocation brackets to fit a subaru 2 piston brake to a sliding calipers spot?

if common, everyone in japan would just buy the whole rear end off a "mythical 2 pot rear r160" hub with brake and rotor still attached, and just bolt the sucker on. but they dont. they swap backing plates just like us americans do, or they pay big money for the CNC brackets.

Last edited by swapstar; 01-12-2006 at 05:19 AM.
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Old 01-12-2006, 05:24 AM   #13
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i did some research; quoting one of the smartarest brake guru's

"Originally Posted by subysouth
The GD/GG came with the non-Brembo 4/2 pots on R160 and R180 rear assemblies. Its the R160 GD/GG non-Brembo 4/2pot cars where the backing plate for this swap(onto a USDM R160 car) is sourced.

ss"

this confirms my notion that there were NO r160 + 2 pot rear GC8's.
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Old 01-12-2006, 05:26 AM   #14
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moss, for your car you'll need 2005 legacy GT rotors if you are using the black subaru 2 pots. they are 290mmX18mm wide.

if you're going to get aftermarket brackets, why not just get the god or twr kit for the brembos? the brembo rotor+ caliper is about the same price as the subaru stuff, its BIggor, MOre bling and you have a good excuse to bling out the front to brembo as well :P

Last edited by swapstar; 01-12-2006 at 04:38 PM.
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Old 01-12-2006, 07:58 AM   #15
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05 GT brackets or brake rotors?

Well, the aftermarket brackets I can find for $150-$300. The Brembo one is $600, and in addition I'd need to buy an entire Brembo setup, then deal with trying to find wheels that will fit the GC and Brembos.
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Old 01-12-2006, 04:39 PM   #16
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rotors.
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Old 01-13-2006, 01:13 PM   #17
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I was seriously considering picking up a set of Legacy Turbo rears at the wrecker today, but a quick search shows no Hawk, Porterfield, or other trackable pads for them, or am I missing something? 0471 pad shape, right?
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Old 01-13-2006, 01:37 PM   #18
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i know that project mu makes pads. i had some. the big japenese makers should all have you covered, its also the same pad as a 1998 outback.
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Old 01-13-2006, 03:04 PM   #19
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I have a version 2 555 edition and it only came with the 10.5 vented single piston not a 2 pot

Also, the 'newer' R160 4/2 pot non-brembo MY06 wrx setup has been on UK WRXs ever since the GDs started production afaik.
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Old 01-13-2006, 04:49 PM   #20
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yup, ever since GD started, and i think the 2pots started in V4
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Old 01-13-2006, 04:59 PM   #21
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2 pot rears started in v4 sti-RA only. that is the fact that ive been trying to track down.

normal sti v4 (non RA) dont have rear 2 pots. no dice.
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Old 01-15-2006, 08:57 AM   #22
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the 4/2 pots were STANDARD on the v4 STi-RA onwards. they OPTIONAL, the buyer could check the box at the dealer, from at least the v4 WRX onwards. the RA/R, basically anything that had DCCD, would have the r180 rear, and the corresponding 190mm parking brake. a nonDCCD tranny like a v5 STi would get the r160 rear, 2 pot w/ 170mm parking brake hub.

The GD/GG frame had the 4/2pot setup standard on the r160 for the wrx for everymarket but north america. all GG/GD STi recieved r180+brembos.

this info has not changed.
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Old 01-15-2006, 08:19 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swapstar

A. non-vented single piston - 9mm thick solid rotor

11.0" diameter disc
-outback H6 - most people call it "h6" upgrade
-JDM sti version 3 RA - ive seen this on 2 of them, strange occurance since previous v2 sti-RA was 10.5" vented, and v4 Sti-Ra is 2 pot subaru 11" vented ith r180...... **this is from cut cars ive seen, 2 seperate occasions in 2 differnt states and 2 differnt importers.

B. Vented single piston

11.0" diameter, 18mm wide, single piston sliding
-JDM B4 legacy twin turbo car
-USDM legacy GT (2.5 turbo)
**notes - this is afaik the biggest bestest deal rear brake you can fit on your standard hub. direct bolt on caliper and rotor (fits 170mm e-brake), you will need to remove part of the backing plate shield to clearance the rotor per this thread instructions

#2 hub : R160 with 2 pot backing plate- unique afaik to 2006 usa WRX and equivilents

comes with 11" vented 18mm thickrotor, 170mm e-brake and 2 piston red "subaru" brake caliper. red caliper is identical to black caliper foundon ver 4/5/6 Sti-RA cars, ex for the obvious fact that it is red. Rotor is 170mm ebrake instead of 190mm e-brake. 170mm ebrake rotor is identical to the LGT 2005 rotor in the above.

************************************************** ********


#3 hub:

R180 GC8 rear hub. - unique to sti-RA (RA and R only) for sti-RA/R 4/5/6. No others have this.

-11.0"(290mm) 18mm wide rotor, 190mm e-brake, (identical width to above usdm 05 LGT but bigger e-brake). with 2 piston black subaru caliper

** you will need to run a R180 diff+axels, or have driveshaft shop rear axels that goes from 180 hub to 160 diff if you want to run these.

************************************************** *************

-h, great FAQ. But since you're putting decimels on brake diameter sizes, you may want to correct the 11.0" to 11.4" for the 290mm diameter brakes.

290mm / 25.4mm per inch = 11.41"

The H6, LGT and nonBrembo disc diameters are close to 1" larger than the other 170mm ebrake discs.

Also, solid discs measure 10mm and are stated in the FSM as such too. (Checked against 2004 WRX/STi and 1995 Legacy FSMs)

GGT

PS, yes Subysouth is the man...I learned my brake stuff from him.
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Old 01-15-2006, 11:35 PM   #24
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to confirm my personal experiances of TOUCHING FULL Sti Version 5 cars; that only STi-RA's 4+ came with the 2 pot rears, i emailed a reputable source. as posted:

"Only STi type RA Version 4-6 GC8 models had the 2-pots with R180 rear diff. The normal STi models had 4-pot fronts but 1-pot rear with R160.

The brake backing plates are $67 each for any of the Subaru 2-pot setups. Brembo type backing plates (for R180) are $103 each. I have most of these in stock."

Thanks.
Regards,
Dave
Rallispec


normal non RA sti 4/5/6 cars do NOT have rear 2 pots unless dealer installed option of some sort.

that is fact from experiance in person.
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Old 01-31-2006, 07:59 PM   #25
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Does anyone know what the piston diameters are for any of these calipers? That is the single most important piece of information and it's missing.

Specifically I'm looking for the diameter of the US 03 WRX rear caliper and the US 03 Sti rear caliper.
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