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Old 02-02-2006, 10:39 AM   #1
c'dalerider
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Default from two 10inch subs to one 10 inch sub?

I realy enjoy the bass/thump on the subs. how much of a difference will there be going from 2 to 1 sub? would going up to one 12" sub help at all or maybe going to a better sub. I had 2 10" kickers in a nice big box but realy need my truck space back so i got a real nice box made for the wrx that only holds one 10". I put one of the subs in it , for now. Will a w7 or the like be MUCH improvement? OR, find another spot for another sub?
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Last edited by c'dalerider; 02-02-2006 at 11:39 AM.
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Old 02-02-2006, 11:43 AM   #2
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Default 1 10

Hi, I have had 2 AudioBahn 10's in my wrx for 2 years and I need more room and less weight so I went to 1 last month. I think that it sounds better than with 2, the sound is more clear and since I ran more power to the sub I think that it hits just as hard and better than before. + I dropped like 20+lbs off the car with 1 less sub and a smaller box, I bolted her down and now I can take turns without the box moving. good luck
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Old 02-02-2006, 11:59 AM   #3
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I only have one in mine and it's enough for me. Don't know what you like though. Just disconnect one of them and see.
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Old 02-02-2006, 12:01 PM   #4
the suicidal eggroll
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If the subs are sealed, at full output you'll lose a maximum of 6dB by going down to 1 sub. If you go to a different sub, you might lose more, you might lose less, you might gain some, it just depends on the abilities of the respective subs.
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Old 02-02-2006, 12:43 PM   #5
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I went for 2 mediocre subs to 1 decent sub, I reccommend doing it. Now, I'm going from nothing to a 10w7... I can't wait for the BaSS!
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Old 02-02-2006, 12:50 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the suicidal eggroll
If the subs are sealed, at full output you'll lose a maximum of 6dB by going down to 1 sub. If you go to a different sub, you might lose more, you might lose less, you might gain some, it just depends on the abilities of the respective subs.

6db? How did you get that? 50% reduction in power results in a 3db loss.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decibel...8_.C2.BD_power
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Old 02-02-2006, 01:22 PM   #7
the suicidal eggroll
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displacement scales like voltage (20*log(V2/V1)), not power (10*log(P2/P1))

cut displacement in half and you lose 6dB
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Old 02-02-2006, 01:38 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c'dalerider
I realy enjoy the bass/thump on the subs. how much of a difference will there be going from 2 to 1 sub? would going up to one 12" sub help at all or maybe going to a better sub. I had 2 10" kickers in a nice big box but realy need my truck space back so i got a real nice box made for the wrx that only holds one 10". I put one of the subs in it , for now. Will a w7 or the like be MUCH improvement? OR, find another spot for another sub?

which kickers? if they're comps, a single hi-end 12" will blow them away. heck, a single kicker L7 10" will shame them with enough power.

in my old age, a high-end single 12" will be enough for any compact car. i'm running a single 12" JL 12W3V2 w/ a 600watt rms amp. it's plenty of bass, enough to rattle my windshield mounted V1 like crazy.
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Old 02-02-2006, 01:56 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the suicidal eggroll
displacement scales like voltage (20*log(V2/V1)), not power (10*log(P2/P1))

cut displacement in half and you lose 6dB
I guess I need to read up on that. Going from two 10" subs down to one would half the displacement, and half the power of the system, or at least it seems to me that way. Assuming each speaker was being driven before at max power.
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Old 02-02-2006, 01:57 PM   #10
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a decent 12 or 15 with enuff power should make most people happy. unless you want every one to hear you.
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Old 02-02-2006, 02:11 PM   #11
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it all depends on your amp.

I had a 2 10in JL W3s w. a 500/1

changed to a 12in W6v2 w. a 500/1

= Same amount of bass
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Old 02-02-2006, 02:13 PM   #12
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I dont believe that to be a good comparison, much like a butt-dyno reading.
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Old 02-02-2006, 02:19 PM   #13
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then you do not have to accept it as true. Butt-dyno all you want. My rearview shakes the same.

500 watts going to the 2 10s, 500 watts going to the 12....same wattages, same bump in the trunk
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Old 02-02-2006, 02:22 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dantastic
which kickers? if they're comps, a single hi-end 12" will blow them away. heck, a single kicker L7 10" will shame them with enough power.

in my old age, a high-end single 12" will be enough for any compact car. i'm running a single 12" JL 12W3V2 w/ a 600watt rms amp. it's plenty of bass, enough to rattle my windshield mounted V1 like crazy.
^, thats what i thought. Im gona look into getting a dedicated amp and upgrading my sub to at least a JL 10"W7. (currently have a 5 channel hifonic Zeus, 600w?, running 6.5" mbquart Q components, 4"? reference in rear doors, and the subs). It is perfect, but if i add a bigger sub, im thinking ill need more power.
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Old 02-02-2006, 02:27 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChadC21
it all depends on your amp.

I had a 2 10in JL W3s w. a 500/1

changed to a 12in W6v2 w. a 500/1

= Same amount of bass
u need mo powah

add another 500 watts and tell us they sound the same.
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Old 02-02-2006, 02:28 PM   #16
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I used to have only 1 in my Impreza and it was just enough for me.
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Old 02-02-2006, 02:37 PM   #17
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if you want to save room, custom mount 2 JL 8w7's.

1 on each side and put a grill cover over them. they are flush on the sides of my trunk and they hit really damn good and so clean. plus they are light weight compared to all the 10's and 12's.

i like actual sound and i dont like hearing my outside of car rattle
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Old 02-02-2006, 04:31 PM   #18
tcs007
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If you want to save room, build yourself an isobaric push/pull box
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Old 02-02-2006, 05:52 PM   #19
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Look for some oldschool soundstream subs. I just put a 7 year old exact 12 in my jeep with a rubicon 500 amp and it sounds like theres 2 12's back there. And thats in a 1.5 cubic foot sealed box. If I went with a bigger box and a 4 inch port I would have all sorts of bass.
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Old 02-02-2006, 08:00 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rjbcw
I guess I need to read up on that. Going from two 10" subs down to one would half the displacement, and half the power of the system, or at least it seems to me that way. Assuming each speaker was being driven before at max power.
When you're comparing displacements, don't bother looking at power, it will only confuse you. If you have 2 subs moving to some level of excursion, then you switch to 1 sub and bring it to the same level of excursion, the total output will be 6dB quieter because you've cut the displacement in half. Now what you're probably thinking is that bringing a single sub to the same level of excursion will only require half as much power as the pair, and cutting the power in half is only -3dB, but that property only applies when you're talking about cutting the power in half on a single speaker, when you're going from 2 speakers to 1 there's more at play.
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Old 02-03-2006, 03:18 AM   #21
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But you're moving half the air. But obviously I'm missing something so I'll Google some more.
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Old 02-03-2006, 07:33 AM   #22
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If you are not trying to win any spl contests, go for the single sub and you'll be fine. I went with a single 12" in a sealed box to save weight and space. It sounds good enough for me, and I still have most of my trunk left.
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Old 02-03-2006, 08:05 AM   #23
the suicidal eggroll
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rjbcw
But you're moving half the air. But obviously I'm missing something so I'll Google some more.
yep, and half the air is -6dB

Remember, displacement scales like voltage. If you've got a single sub and you want to increase output by 3dB then you double power, but if you're measuring the sub at this time you'll see that excursion only increases by 40%. Only when you quadruple power does the excursion double, and in that case you're sweeping twice as much air and you're 6dB louder.

It will not be too easy to find articles on this, because many people don't understand it. One of the easiest ways you can prove this to yourself is to let a driver run freeair, play a test tone, and bring it to some level of excursion (say 1/4", you don't want it too high because you don't want BL non-linearities or thermal compression to factor into the test). Measure the voltage coming out of the amp and also measure the spl if you want to. Then increase the volume until it appears to be moving twice as far, again measure the voltage coming from the amp and the spl off the cone, you'll see that both are 6dB higher. You can go back and forth if you like, do the test at a different frequency or at a different base excursion, and you'll see that every time you're changing by 6dB, a 3dB increase only increases excursion by 40%.

This can also be verified in the cone movement/excursion graph in WinISD or a similar program.

Last edited by the suicidal eggroll; 02-03-2006 at 08:26 AM.
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Old 02-03-2006, 08:10 AM   #24
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Go with a really well built box and you will be happy. All the calculations aside 1 GOOD woofer will have more than enough to cause all the hearing loss you could ever want.

And if you REALLY want your trunk space back try a box like the one at www.sparetirebox.com or just get one from him....they are pretty cheap for what you get.
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Old 02-03-2006, 09:06 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BryanH
Go with a really well built box and you will be happy. All the calculations aside 1 GOOD woofer will have more than enough to cause all the hearing loss you could ever want.

And if you REALLY want your trunk space back try a box like the one at www.sparetirebox.com or just get one from him....they are pretty cheap for what you get.
i was looking at these. I like them and most of all the company is just 10 minutes from me! I should go check them out and have them build me something. However, it doesnt look terribly hard to build a similar box. I would realy like to add a 10" in the spare tire area and raise the floor/false floor alittle to get alittle bigger cube's for the sub. Im looking into a 10" W6 for this application. My friend who is a professional installer suggested a single W6 in a good enclosure and said my amp will be fine to power it (400w to the sub).
I realy like the box i just rec'd. It fits perfect in the side of the wagon and it is very light. My friend said a W6 may start to tear the box appart, but i dont think so, and so what if it does.
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