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Old 02-22-2006, 03:39 PM   #1
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Default Any aftermarket turbo with VF39 spool that makes more power and torque?

Hi all, got a question for all you guru.

I got a 04' STi, only mods are catted TBE, 1 step colder NGK and Ecutek.

I absolutely LOVES the powerband with the instant 300 wtq @ 3200rpm punch.

My question to you all is, if the only thing I want to change is the turbo and retune the Ecutek, is there any different turbo out there that retain 100% of the low end punch of the VF39 while providing any gain of power?

In another words, any turbo that can provide a bigger area under the curve without the curve dipping down the stock curve anywhere especially between 1k~4k rpm?

My intention is trying to find out if there is a better turbo out there when my stock VF39 is due for replacement. I have a feeling the stock VF39 is the best for my preference. If I can't find a better turbo, I'll just get another new VF39.

I drove my friend's STi with the same exact mods as my car but he has a TD06 20G, while it does pull noticably harder in the higher rpm range, I absolutely hate the fact that it lost the low end punch. So is there a turbo that are size between the VF39 and the 20G. How about a modified/ported VF39? Or a VF34?

And is there a turbo out there that makes more low end torque and power then the VF39?

I know what I really want is a 911 Turbo, 500 lb-ft @ 2k rpm and 500 hp @ 6k rpm

I want a REALLY quick off the line street car
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Old 02-22-2006, 04:12 PM   #2
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td06-18G ported
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Old 02-22-2006, 04:15 PM   #3
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You can run a TD05 or 5h hot side... they will spool quite quickly, but not have much up top.

The td06 (non clipped) should be the best balance... and with the 18g compressor, you should be able to see similar spool, maybe even a tad better than the VF39... and still have some room left up top...
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Old 02-22-2006, 04:28 PM   #4
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tdo6h 20g. I have the stocker and my bro has this turbo. Very similar spool except 150 more whp with the 20g. Don't forget that the new 911 turbo has Variable Area Turbine Nozzle turbos (they call it variable geometry). That's how it has a 2000rpm boost threashold. It's a freak show, I'd love to drive one.

I don't know about your 20g experience but IMO, the 20g has a pretty violent low end hit. It shares that lack of smoothness with the VF39 that isn't there with the bigger turbos (Green, Red, SZ49, SZ55) My bros setup and tune feels very stock-like in terms of boost threashold and such. Good luck
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Old 02-22-2006, 04:44 PM   #5
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Yeah TD06 18G will spool at least as fast as stock but make a good bit more power
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Old 02-22-2006, 04:51 PM   #6
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I imagine almost any larger turbo, including the 18G which seems the best choice, you're gonna need new injectors.
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Old 02-22-2006, 04:53 PM   #7
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A td06-20g with 3" inlet would probably outspool your current VF39 with TBE, and give you a lot more up top. It would definitely outspool it if you added water/alky injection.
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Old 02-22-2006, 05:58 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JDM addict
I drove my friend's STi with the same exact mods as my car but he has a TD06 20G, while it does pull noticably harder in the higher rpm range, I absolutely hate the fact that it lost the low end punch.
vs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeyg
I don't know about your 20g experience but IMO, the 20g has a pretty violent low end hit.
Quote:
Originally Posted by klattery
A td06-20g with 3" inlet would probably outspool your current VF39 with TBE, and give you a lot more up top. It would definitely outspool it if you added water/alky injection.
is the difference in the tune or the butt dyno?
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Old 02-22-2006, 07:14 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by black06wagon
vs.

is the difference in the tune or the butt dyno?
I am wondering about the same thing.

I think it depends on the tune, the butt dyno and also there are different trim in a TD06 20G, like klattery mention, a 3" inlet, I think there are different inlet size, wheel size.......etc......

So confusing, I just know the 20G STi I drove completely lost the low end punch of the VF39. My VF39 hit hard at 3200 rpm, where this particular 20G STi I drove, full power come on much more softly/linearly at 3800~4000 rpm or so.

The owner of that 20G STi didn't like it over time too and put the VF39 back on.
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Old 02-22-2006, 07:17 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 06WRXTR
td06-18G ported
This is one of the one I will look into, since it is size in between a 20G and VF39. You just never know until you tried it
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Old 02-22-2006, 07:19 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Capt Crunch
I imagine almost any larger turbo, including the 18G which seems the best choice, you're gonna need new injectors.
I can handle buying a set of bigger injectors, I just don't want any FMIC, this, that....etc.

Thanks for the reminder though
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Old 02-22-2006, 07:31 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klattery
A td06-20g with 3" inlet would probably outspool your current VF39 with TBE, and give you a lot more up top. It would definitely outspool it if you added water/alky injection.
No water/alky injection to minimized cost, hassle and headache

I need to look into all the different trims and configurations of the TD05, TD06 family, if anyone would be kind to point me in the right direction to look (links), I would really appreciate it
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Old 02-22-2006, 08:01 PM   #13
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Default top mount?

Was the 20g you drove with a FMIC? With the top mount, the characteristics will be different. Just a variable to consider. Also, maybe try to get a ride in someone elses just to verify. Tunes and such can vary greatly.

Also keep in mind that the bigger turbos have a smoother power delivery. I have at times wondered if the 20g on my bros car really spooled as fast as stock because it felt smoother. He is also running a Blow through MAF.

But ultimately I have never considered the 20g to be a compromise in any way or fashion compared to the stocker in terms of threashold or lag. Especially when it was mated with a top mount.
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Old 02-22-2006, 08:22 PM   #14
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Keep the 39 and go with ALKY. Most of todays systems are very reliable and hassle free, offer fail safes, don't require injector upgrade and will give you 80-100whp over stock with flat hp and tq curves and fast spool. It's a win win.
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Old 02-22-2006, 08:45 PM   #15
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Easy answer, VF34. Someone on the forums has already done it with surprisingly good results. Take a look around and see if you can find his post.
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Old 02-22-2006, 08:45 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JDM addict
This is one of the one I will look into, since it is size in between a 20G and VF39. You just never know until you tried it
I'll be having my 05 STi with a ported TD06-18g dyno tuned on Monday, keep an eye out for it.
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Old 02-22-2006, 11:11 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HerculesPeanut
Easy answer, VF34. Someone on the forums has already done it with surprisingly good results. Take a look around and see if you can find his post.
The vf34 and the vf39 are so close to exchange one for the other would be pointless. Hell, going from a vf3x to a vf22 is almost pointless. Go 18G or keep the vf39.
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Old 02-22-2006, 11:17 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Capt Crunch
The vf34 and the vf39 are so close to exchange one for the other would be pointless. Hell, going from a vf3x to a vf22 is almost pointless. Go 18G or keep the vf39.
Not according to this guy:

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...highlight=vf34
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Old 02-23-2006, 12:39 AM   #19
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Subscribed Like this thread what I am looking for a good track turbo. Quick spool with some nice HP/Torque!!!!

18G sounds like a good bet.

How much HP/Troque are you lookin get with an 18G with the proper supporting mods?

For 93 octane?

For Race Gas?

Thanks,
Matt
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Old 02-23-2006, 01:54 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HerculesPeanut
butt dynos vary from person to person. He even put a header and inlet on at the same time, so I wouldn't say it was all due to the turbo. In fact, I bet most of it wasn't due to the turbo. Hell, we just had a guy claim he gained top end by adding a fuel pump, so I wouldn't just go by word of mouth.

Thing is, on paper the vf39 and the vf34 are very, very close. If you get a butt dyno reading from the swap, then you're liable to get a butt dyno reading from intercooler hoses. Whoop de do.

VF3x<VF22<18G<20G<fpgreen

lets say each turbos is about 15-20 hp up from the previous one... 20 hp isn't worth the turbo upgrade, a fraction of that even less so.
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Old 02-23-2006, 03:35 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJ04STi
You can run a TD05 or 5h hot side... they will spool quite quickly, but not have much up top.

The td06 (non clipped) should be the best balance... and with the 18g compressor, you should be able to see similar spool, maybe even a tad better than the VF39... and still have some room left up top...
So a few of you guys mention a H, I need to look into what that means. Sorry guys, I am not very familar with all the different trim of turbos, that is why I am asking now.

So TD05h-18g, or TD06-18g is what I need to look into.
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Old 02-23-2006, 03:44 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeyg
Was the 20g you drove with a FMIC? With the top mount, the characteristics will be different. Just a variable to consider.
Yes I know. Like I said, the 20g STi I drove has the exact same mods as my car except the 20G. He also had the stock STi top mount, TBE and Ecutek tuned. He had bigger injectors too to support the bigger turbo, but that is not a factor, you know.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeyg
Also, maybe try to get a ride in someone elses just to verify. Tunes and such can vary greatly.
Yeah true. I tried when I can. I actually rode in some other guy's STi with a 20G and a FMIC, weak low end, I was blaming it on the FMIC, then I tried a 20G with the stock TMIC, same feeling from my butt.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeyg
Also keep in mind that the bigger turbos have a smoother power delivery. I have at times wondered if the 20g on my bros car really spooled as fast as stock because it felt smoother.
That is one of the reason why I think that a 20G car feel weaker in the low end because the power delivery is much smoother. The biggest feeling I got from the 20g STi I drove with the TMIC is it just feels so smooth. You know how a smooth car make it feels slower, less exciting, even though it is a faster car.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeyg
He is also running a Blow through MAF.
I don't know what that is, do you mind explaining?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeyg
But ultimately I have never considered the 20g to be a compromise in any way or fashion compared to the stocker in terms of threashold or lag. Especially when it was mated with a top mount.
Maybe you are correct, but the extra smoothness made it feels slower.

Thanks a bunch for your valuable inputs
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Old 02-23-2006, 03:45 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silver arrow
Keep the 39 and go with ALKY. Most of todays systems are very reliable and hassle free, offer fail safes, don't require injector upgrade and will give you 80-100whp over stock with flat hp and tq curves and fast spool. It's a win win.
Sounds great, but I really don't want to get into extra stuff. I am a all boost kinda guy
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Old 02-23-2006, 03:46 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HerculesPeanut
Easy answer, VF34. Someone on the forums has already done it with surprisingly good results. Take a look around and see if you can find his post.
I hear some people think the VF34 is great, but I also hear some people think it is no different then a VF39.........

If you can find the link for me, I would appreciate it
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Old 02-23-2006, 03:46 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by th1rd3y3
I'll be having my 05 STi with a ported TD06-18g dyno tuned on Monday, keep an eye out for it.
Definitely, good luck and thanks for letting me know
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