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Old 02-23-2006, 09:03 PM   #1
Udonboy
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Default STI Shortblock WRX heads, and stock turbo?

Earlier this week, my engine gave out while I was at the track (spun rod). I was at first thinking maybe I could get it fixed at the dealership, but then decided against even trying that. Since I've been told that a rebuild would probably cost as much as a new shortblock, I think I'm going to go with the shortblock.

I've thought about getting the STI shortblock since I've seen a number of people do that with their WRX's. My question is, can you run this setup with the stock turbo & injectors? If I go this route, I'd probably get a VF39 with pink injectors, but I was just wondering. The 06 WRX is a 2.5L with the TD04, and while it does have AVCS, would this setup work with nonAVCS WRX heads? Any major problems with this?
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Old 02-23-2006, 11:13 PM   #2
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you could use the td04 but it would be teh suck.

vf39 is more reasonable.

get em whatever you do.
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Old 02-24-2006, 04:14 PM   #3
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actually I have the same question as Udonboy -- (STI 2.5 sb + stock wrx head + stock TD04)... Suppose I will have custom tuning done, do you know what max safe psi the stock td04 will run at, and is it "overworking" the stock td04?
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Old 02-24-2006, 04:22 PM   #4
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I know of a car with this exact set up using the TD04 who got on the dyno for an ECUtek flash this week. He got 220whp on a Dyno-Dynamics that has stock WRX's around 170whp.
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Old 02-24-2006, 04:30 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Monson
I know of a car with this exact set up using the TD04 who got on the dyno for an ECUtek flash this week. He got 220whp on a Dyno-Dynamics that has stock WRX's around 170whp.
Suppose every other exhaust parts are same (stock UP, stock turboback), I could understand the gain in whp is not that much and 220whp is about right.

OTOH, what about the wtq?
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Old 02-24-2006, 05:14 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dcwrx2
Suppose every other exhaust parts are same (stock UP, stock turboback), I could understand the gain in whp is not that much and 220whp is about right.

OTOH, what about the wtq?
TQ was about the same at 225. These numbers basically are right about stock STi numbers. The TD04 just won't support much more than that. I also saw the numbers for the same set up with a VF-39 this week and the HP was almost identical, but the torque was up at 290ft/lb...
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Old 02-24-2006, 06:16 PM   #7
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My friend just got an EJ257 block on his 02 WRX, stock everything basically. Its definatly an improvement:

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=942699
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Old 02-24-2006, 06:22 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Monson
...I also saw the numbers for the same set up with a VF-39 this week and the HP was almost identical...
2.5 sb + VF-39 only has about 220whp?!?! I thought this number is about right for stock 2.0 sb + UP/full-TBE?
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Old 02-24-2006, 06:26 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dcwrx2
2.5 sb + VF-39 only has about 220whp?!?! I thought this number is about right for stock 2.0 sb + UP/full-TBE?
Yeah, it is.

The TD04 is seriously mismatched for a 2.5 block.
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Old 02-24-2006, 07:06 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by americanyouth
Yeah, it is.

The TD04 is seriously mismatched for a 2.5 block.
You kinda misunderstood me....
For *stock wrx* (2.0sb, stock everything), usually I see 17X whp on dyno
For *stock wrx* + UP/Full-TBE + tune, usually I see 21x-22x whp on dyno

Now, he said with 2.5sb + VF-39 (VF39 is better than td04, isn't it?), the whp is just about the same as *stock wrx* (2.0sb) + UP/Full-TBE?
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Old 02-24-2006, 07:23 PM   #11
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Yes,
The HP isn't much better by switching from a TD04 to a VF39, but don't forget that you are picking up 65ft/lb of torque. The power under the curve is substantially better even though the VF-39 is still a relatively small turbo. A stage II Cobb STI only gets 40whp over a stock STI. You really can't get past 350chp on a vf-39...
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Old 02-24-2006, 08:14 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dcwrx2
You kinda misunderstood me....
For *stock wrx* (2.0sb, stock everything), usually I see 17X whp on dyno
For *stock wrx* + UP/Full-TBE + tune, usually I see 21x-22x whp on dyno
I'll only say this once:

NOT ALL DYNO'S GIVE THE SAME NUMBERS!

You can only compair numbers from the same dyno, so if a stock WRX runs 17x on a dyno and a 2.5 block one runs 220 on that SAME dyno, then you have the numbers to compair... If a stock WRX runs 15x on a dyno, and then the 2.5 block runs 17x on the SAME dyno, then you have numbers to compair.

Get it?

Here is the dyno chart from my friends 02 WRX with a 2.5 block now, tdo4 stock turbo but now with an aftermarket uppipe and a tune as well to run the new block properly. Its also an AUTO which means these numbers could be off by as much as 10-20hp. And on the SAME dyno, a stock 2.0 WRX gets ~155hp. I don't know the stock WRX WHP on this dyno, but I know its below 200:

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Old 02-24-2006, 08:45 PM   #13
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Keep your fonts small and I don't need to turn on the Accessibility on my Windows.

Of course I know different dyno reads different, but since Matt Monson mentioned that dyno reads 170 on stock WRX in Post #4, which is about the same I saw from many dyno plots, so that's why I post what I've seen in Post #10, and I've been talking about the "possible" readings on that dyno.

Quote:
Get it?
No I don't understand you used all these big fonts and seem rude to me.

Last edited by dcwrx2; 02-24-2006 at 08:53 PM.
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Old 02-24-2006, 09:15 PM   #14
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These people using the stock TD04, are they also using stock injectors, or did they upgrade them, such as STI pink injectors?
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Old 02-24-2006, 10:03 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dcwrx2
No I don't understand you used all these big fonts and seem rude to me.
Of course i'm being rude, you completely ignored the link I gave you which has the information you wanted.
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Old 02-24-2006, 10:23 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dcwrx2
You kinda misunderstood me....
For *stock wrx* (2.0sb, stock everything), usually I see 17X whp on dyno
For *stock wrx* + UP/Full-TBE + tune, usually I see 21x-22x whp on dyno

Now, he said with 2.5sb + VF-39 (VF39 is better than td04, isn't it?), the whp is just about the same as *stock wrx* (2.0sb) + UP/Full-TBE?
If you want to know the truth of the matter, the VF39 is a crappy turbo and I can't understand why anyone uses them. Like Matt said, they are relatively small, and produce little power. They're also non rebuildable, the wastegates are non-adjustable, and they like to crack exhuast housings.
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Old 02-24-2006, 11:25 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by americanyouth
I can't understand why anyone uses them.
Because you can find them for $200 from folks who upgraded their STI's
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Old 02-25-2006, 05:56 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kostamojen
Of course i'm being rude, you completely ignored the link I gave you which has the information you wanted.
...and I wasn't even quoting or replying your Post #7. I was quoting and replying to americanyouth!
I don't care if you use all size 9 fonts from now on, just feel funny to know you get mad by a few words easily.

I'll stop quoting/replying your future comments in this thread, if that makes you happy.
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Old 02-25-2006, 02:15 PM   #19
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Any answers for my injector question? Are people using stock injectors with these or upgraded injectors?
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Old 02-26-2006, 03:49 PM   #20
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so the 2.0 -> 2.5 conversion is pretty easy ?

the only reason i'm wondering is i'm pretty interested in the saab 9-2x and i was wondering how hard it would be to convert that into a pretty bad ass machine...
i just like the nose a litte better.

i've done some work on turbo cars i'm either doing this or getting a legacy gt either way i'm getting a new shortblock and a gt-30r setup i'm just wondering how much easier it would be to start with the 2.5 or to swap into it from a 2.0.
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Old 02-26-2006, 04:26 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sumfoo1
so the 2.0 -> 2.5 conversion is pretty easy ?

the only reason i'm wondering is i'm pretty interested in the saab 9-2x and i was wondering how hard it would be to convert that into a pretty bad ass machine...
i just like the nose a litte better.

i've done some work on turbo cars i'm either doing this or getting a legacy gt either way i'm getting a new shortblock and a gt-30r setup i'm just wondering how much easier it would be to start with the 2.5 or to swap into it from a 2.0.
Replacing the shortblock with a 2.5 one is just as easy/hard as replacing it with a stock 2.0 block. The only hassle is plugging the AVCS lines.
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Old 02-26-2006, 06:35 PM   #22
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could the managment system handle the avcs heads too... i like those new cosworth heads and cams...

ok here is the deal... i'm headed for building a complete motor outside the car then dropping it in... will i need to move to a diff ecu or just get a re-flash ?
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