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Old 07-20-2009, 08:42 PM   #21
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: Boston
2015 Subaru STI
17Forester / 18Crosstrek


I own a set of Kics r40 NeoChros, and a set of Black McGard Spline Drives.
Originally Posted by zzz123 View Post
Hey guys,

Just wanted your opinions on these two sets of lug nuts as I'm trying to make a decision. My car does see the track occasionally so I ruled out all the aluminum lug nuts out there (especially since my wheels come on and off a lot).

Here are the details for each that I have found so far, please feel free to correct me or add on and give your opinion / personal experiences. I know both have rotating taper seats.

McGard Splinedrives:
-About $100 (roughly). They can be had for around $60 with locks
-Close ended
-Steel construction
-"30% lighter" whatever that means.

Kics R40:
-About $150 (roughly)
-Open ended, extended
-Chromoly construction
-weight 40grams

So my questions / concerns:

-I've seen pictures of a set of R40's that were completely rusted. Poster claimed he had them for about 5-6 months, through a winter. Some said they might be fake. Are there a lot of fakes out there? Does chromoly even rust?
ChroMoly can rust. Ive seen the Kics lugs rust. The NeoChro versions are a bit more corrosion resistant, but it's still possible. I wouldnt run any "nice" lug in the winter if youre from a place that throws salt on the roads.

-Do the kics have thread all the way to the taper seat? I have read the threads are recessed and you may not get as much engagement as you want with stock length studs. Any input here? Is it safe to use with stock length studs?
There could be about 1 more thread between where the threads stop and the bottom of the seat.

-If I use extended ARP studs, which are also chromoly, does chromoly seize onto chromoly?
I know plenty of people who use Kic's nuts on APR studs. Im installing my APRs next week.

-I've read mcgard spline drive keys break a lot. Any such problems with the kics?
Ive had SplineDrives since 2005 and have yet to break a key. Just done be an idiot with it.

-Which is tougher and will withstand more abuse? The steel McGards or the chromoly Kics?

-Is there any difference between the black kics and the neon chrome ones? Durability? Anything other than looks?
The NeoChro ones are mainly lookers, but they are also more corrosion resistant as I previously said

-Referencing this post tire rack claims kics is better than mcgard but provide no reasoning for it. Any input?
They both have their Pro's and Cons.

With the APRs I wont be able to use the McGards anymore. The hard coated McGards hold their finish well, but I have oxidization in the splines.

Ive had Name Brand and off brand Aluminum Lug Nuts, and I will never do so again. Ive yet to have a McGard or Kics thread deform

There is about 1.125" worth of thread in the Kic's r40, as opposed to about .615" of thread in the McGard. So the Kic's has about 1/2" more thread, but on stock studs, how many of htese threads will you be able to use?

The seat of the Kics is a little wider than the seat of the McGard. At the bottom, they are the same size, but the Kics stay at the 60* taper for longer before they go vertical.

Price isn't so much a factor. I just really want the "better" of the two.

Thanks in advance!
Originally Posted by zzz123 View Post
Thanks for your response dan avonN7.

Could you tell me if the mcgard's have threads all the way to the end of the taper? Their diagrams show that the thread truly runs from the start of the lug to the end of the inside near the closed-head. Is this actually true?
There could be about 3 more threads between where the threads stop and the bottom of the seat. On the opposite side, the threads stop about 1/2-2/3 the way up. They stop a lot sooner than the diagram claim.
Originally Posted by zzz123 View Post
Interesting, Boxologist. So the seat actually comes off after some significant wear and tear? I never use an impact gun to tighten but I do use one to loosen and remove the nuts. Will I have problems with the key? Some people have had experiences where they "broke" the key. How exactly does this happen? And how does it break? Cracks? Collapses? Shatters? Bends?
Ive never had a seat come off, and Ive never heard of it happening to anyone else. I have 100k miles on mine.

I watched a tech at a tire shop shatter the key once on someone else's car. Im surprised the stud didnt snap or the lug nut didnt shatter before that happened, though.
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Last edited by vision.dynamix; 07-20-2009 at 08:59 PM.
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