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Old 08-20-2012, 12:30 PM   #469
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Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Boca Raton, FL


Originally Posted by Davenow View Post
Its like you didn't read anything I had to say.

Please enlighten me as to where exactly you missed the part where I INCREDIBLY, VERY CLEARLY, IN A MANNER OF WHICH SOMEONE OF A 3RD GRADE READING LEVEL, stated, that all of this is directed at people who aren't professional type, driving a dedicated race car, sort of driver. Which is what virtually everyone on nasioc is not. Including yourself. None of what I am saying are guesses or statements coming from someone who doesn't know what he is talking about. I have done this for a living and as a hobby for over 20 years here. There is also a post somewhere in this thread with the hard data from testing with lap times, proving beyond shadow of a doubt, that upgraded brakes doing exactly nothing for lap times on an autocross car(and autocross more directly relates to the sort of driving almost everyone here will ever do). As for track days, for almost everyone, pads that can take more heat and fluid are all you need even on R-compounds, unless you A. Suck at driving (and on a race track, most of us do, even if we think we dont) or B. Have a brake system that has problems to begin with (in which case, you need to REPAIR, not upgrade)
However, the reality is that only about 1% of nasioc will ever do a track day.

Wow..... where to start. I guess I'll start by commenting on your incredibly childish/immature response. It appears I'm not the one who needs to improve their reading comprehension.

Next let's move on to this comment right here

"Those will only make you slower around a race track, not faster. There is a point where bigger becomes too big, and you are just adding weight and rotational mass. The BBK "Gran Turismo" kit is a perfect example of this. Its HUGE and heavy and will in no circumstance outperform the stock STI brakes."

This is the comment I was replying to, and how it is completely false. This comment was a blanket statement, you did not preface it as being aimed at everyone but dedicated track cars. And even then, you said "in no circumstance", which is false.

You then make a assumption as to my driving, of which you have no clue. I hold a FIA Grade C license, so I know what I'm talking about. My family has been racing Porsches for over 30yrs and ranging from the 962, 908, 934.5, 944, Nissan 8803 (P Car) and the list goes on and on and on.

At what point did I mention lap times??? How about never. But since we are on the topic, with wide/sticky enough tires you will see marginally better lap times with a BBK due to extra stopping power, provided that the wider slicks have enough grip that the stock brakes cannot achieve lock up. But the stock brembos with the right pads, SHOULD be able to lockup 99% of situations, if not all.

BUT what I DID say, was that in a actual race the BBK kit would be needed as it will resist fade longer than the stock Brembos. That's a fact.

Originally Posted by Davenow View Post
And the Brembo Gran Turismo kit weighs almost double the STI brembos. (ok not almost double, but a lot more) Have you held them both in your hands back to back, both on the same bench? I have. The Gran Turismo kit is INSANELY heavy.
I've held both side by side as I have owned both. And no, it is not a lot more. From what I have read, the stock Brembos are just over 8lbs, the F50 BBK is 8.6lbs. Like I said before, barely heavier. So please quit with the exaggerations.

Originally Posted by Davenow View Post
You also clearly don't understand rotational mass. A couple lbs isnt much. A couple lbs rotating at speed, starts to become a lot more.
Again with the baseless comments. I have a very very good understanding of rotational mass, so much so that I've spent a lot of money removing as much as possible from the car. And in terms of the calipers, they are not rotational mass, they are unsprung weight. With the rotors, a 332 will barely weigh more than the STi rotors, and compared to stock rotors they actually weigh significantly less. But let's assume that you are running a set of Girodisc rotors for the stock Brembos, while I'm running the 332mm Girodisc rotors for the F50 kit. I believe the weight difference is less than 1/2 a lb (correct me if I'm wrong). This is negligible when you factor in the benefit of heat dissipation from the extra surface area.

Car and driver did a test with a WRX a few years back, and multiple brake kits ranging from stock/stock with rotors pads/prodrive brakes/ F50 kit etc. From 70 mph the braking difference was slightly in the F50 kits favor (the largest of the group), but as the speeds increased to 100mph, the F50 kit stopped 15-20ft shorter on average. That is huge on the track. Now take the speed up to 150+...... the gap becomes even larger.

Originally Posted by Davenow View Post
In any case, go re-read everything you missed. Which seems to be almost everything that has been said.
I didn't miss anything, but I do suggest you take some courses on reading comprehension. Because you just failed miserably at it.

I agreed with pretty much everything in your post, apart from what I quoted. You completely missed the point of my post and ran off on some incoherent tangent that had nothing to do with my post, congrats!

Originally Posted by Davenow View Post
And for the record the Brembo kit on that time attack car is a lot lighter than the Gran Turismo Brembo setup. But hey, you know everything, so you already knew that right?
Really....... care to back up that claim with a source. I would be shocked if it weighs more than 1lb less than the F50 kit.

But hey, how about we mention all of the time attack cars on the forum. The LIC car? Uses the regular Brembo 6pot kit, which weighs more than the F50 kit. We could go on and on, the reality is you're wrong and cant handle it.

I gave you credit before in that your OP applies to 99% of the people on here not needing larger brakes. I was only pointing out your mistake in one specific area regarding the benefit of a BBK for the other 1%.
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Last edited by LIQUIDSK8S; 08-20-2012 at 03:13 PM.
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