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Old 04-02-2020, 01:22 PM   #10
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 183032
Join Date: Jun 2008
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: CT
RWD Camry
Pull me over red


Originally Posted by neg_matnik View Post
The dearly departed Focus ST was just over 3200 lbs for 250-hp/270 and it was pretty good.
The I3 turbo in the Corolla makes 257-hp/265; same power with less pumping losses, better fuel economy and less weight on the nose of the car.
There's nothing wrong with that; especially because no other manufacturer is rushing to build relatively inexpensive AWD hatchbacks (Golf R doesn't count).
You're missing the point Pre and I are making, the GR was attractive at 257/265 and 2,800lbs with proper diffs.

There are two issues here, and the main issue is:
Toyota is stuffing that drivetrain into a chassis that is going to weigh at least 400lbs to 600lbs more; even if Toyota kept the power to weight ratio, it's going to lose a lot of fun factor due to weight gain.

To your example, people preferred the Fiesta ST to the Focus ST because it was way more fun to drive even though it was slower & less powerful, and had a torsion beam rear setup.

secondary issue:
Toyota isn't going to keep the power to weight ratio. At 10.89lbs:1hp a 3,200lb car would need 294hp, a 3,400lb car would need 321hp, and that's again assuming they keep the car down to that weight range, which is being optimistic, unless they are willing to let the price go really high.

Other potential issues:
Mechanical diffs may go by the wayside in favor of a front biased "FWD+" AWD system with some form of brake simulated limited slip.
price could go too high for what it is, the article mentions CF potentially being utilized & the golf R as a potential target.

Pre (and others) wanted a 3dr lightweight rally car for the street that the rest of the world is getting - aka hot yaris
I wanted a 5dr lightweight rally car for the street - aka hot yaris
We are not getting that, we are getting a WRX competitor, 3 years from now.

Toyota is providing too little too late (or is it too big too late?)
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