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Old 01-07-2022, 04:33 PM   #151
Pre
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Quote:
Originally Posted by subydude View Post

At 6'2" with a 32" inseam I've got a slightly taller torso than average but fit just fine with room to spare in the gen 1. I'm not worried about the gen 2.
Good to know. Itís been years since I drove a Gen 1. But I remember being appalled at how suited that drivers seat cockpit was. Iím similar build. Same height, 220 lbs at 10-12% body fat depending on the time of year. BRZ fit me extremely well for long torso and my height. Seriously one of the best fits for the tall man Iíve ever been in. I donít even remember having to do the lean back on the seat back. I like the seat back sitting straight up. Hate **** when I have to gangster lean that seat back.

Quote:
Originally Posted by winsor View Post
The more I see/watch this vehicle the more I want one. I've had a lot of fun driving modded frs/brz from friends but don't think I would want to swing it for a secondary 4 or 5 month out of the year vehicle.
Itís the same for me. Itís not a DD. Itís the fun vehicle for when I canít ride. So winter, inclement weather, or high wind. Wind gets above say 12 mph I donít want to be on the bikes. I come back from a ride needing a chiropractor, neck all jacked up I donít even care if itís 102 with 90% humidity. Perfed suit so as long as Iím moving Iím solid. But high wind, below 45 degrees, or rain, F That. Itís between the GR Corolla (will be the pick if it is available with Torsen LSDís) and the 86. All hinges on those diffs but either way next buy will be from Toyota. I justify the limited use thing for myself because ďcheapĒ. Ideally I want and can afford a M2C, new, but I donít want the payments. So cheap, relatively, easy to justify having it. That damn Corolla comes out with the standard AWD system and no circuit pack it will be the 86. If you canít get what you want and have to settle Iím settling for light weight, RWD, rear diff, and 6MT. The 86 currently is the most appealing package on the market to me.
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Old 01-07-2022, 04:39 PM   #152
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Originally Posted by fredzy View Post

I put my order in end of Dec, hoping it comes March-May timeframe. Any sooner and I won't be able to drive it anyhow and that will be harsh. Any later and I'll die so yeah, fingers crossed that timing works out.
Congrats Fred. Awesome man. Happy for you.

The 86 has grown on me quite a bit. Originally I preferred the BRZ but I watched, last week, whatever YT channel is just the drive, no commentary. It was a white premium (w/duckbill) 6MT and I love the black wheels myself. I wouldnít paint them. It was a gorgeous car in white with black wheels and now I find myself partial to the 86 over the BRZ. If I buy it the suspension and brakes will be gutted so I really donít care about the suspension differences between the cars any longer. I want a base model so I can gut the entire audio system. Iíll be that guy ordering the Alcantara or whatever seat covers to swap out the stock seat covers. Stock wheels will go pronto. Two sets of black aftermarket (flow formed cast from TR) wheels with 225/40/18 summers and winters (DWS06+). Iím finally stoked on some new model cars again. Toyota needs to hurry the F up on the GR Corolla specs so I can pick which Toyo Iím going to buy!
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Old 01-07-2022, 10:59 PM   #153
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Thanks, yeah the car definitely looks good in white. Looks racecar, not blingy. I think the 86 would be a more rewarding car to drive on the track than a GR-4 powered car despite the slowness, but that is only based on reviews and Gran Turismo (which I've come to learn is not very realistic as a sim.) Anyhow I don't plan to get onto a track. But who knows.

Even if the Corolla doesn't get more power than Yaris it'll feel like a rocket compared to the 86. I guess the question is: what did you enjoy more on the track, S2k response/revs or turbo power?
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Old 01-08-2022, 08:36 PM   #154
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Originally Posted by fredzy View Post
Thanks, yeah the car definitely looks good in white. Looks racecar, not blingy. I think the 86 would be a more rewarding car to drive on the track than a GR-4 powered car despite the slowness, but that is only based on reviews and Gran Turismo (which I've come to learn is not very realistic as a sim.) Anyhow I don't plan to get onto a track. But who knows.

Even if the Corolla doesn't get more power than Yaris it'll feel like a rocket compared to the 86. I guess the question is: what did you enjoy more on the track, S2k response/revs or turbo power?
AWD first and foremost. Thatís ďmyĒ more. But there are too many unknowns with the GR Corolla. First and foremost how much will it cost? Then how much does it weigh? Will it have the Torsen front and rear diff option like the Yaris, aka the circuit pack? The Corolla is not a WRC Homologation car like the Yaris, which is worth the cost premium. Those lucky souls who can buy the Yaris are getting an engine specifically developed for that car, a 2800 pound and some change car. A custom chassis that is part Yaris, part Corolla. Even the roof was changed, the door config. So if Toyota tries to bring some watered down deal and charge 40k+ for it, thatís a no for me at least. You are going to up the weight by 400-500 pounds I just donít know if a 3 banger is going to work and Iím certainly not going to pay GR Yaris money for it either. At the weight itís going to be it should really have more power and a 4 cylinder turbo but Iím trying to keep an open mind on it.

I owned an AP2, and was never enamored by it. I donít like inline 4ís at all. I learned why I donít like them from Masao Furusawa and why prior to this information, on the motorcycle side, I preferred Veeís. Vtwin or V4. Not much different in my tastes in car engines. The F20c revíd high for a car engine but as a motorcyclist it was never a big deal. The 86 addresses just about every issue I had with the S2k. The NVH. The claustrophobic cabin. The 86 is a great fit for tall folks like myself. And another main issue, snap oversteer. I got tired of that on my AP2. You havenít lived until youíve spun 180 degrees and are looking at cars coming right at you. That damn car youíd have to extremely careful those last few tenths because that thing would bite you back, hard. The only thing I miss about the AP2 was the ability to brake way way late. I mean I could wait until the last millisecond, jam on the brakes hard, and make the turn.

The 86 is a simple car. Light, cost efficient, and a great motor to me as I loathe inline 4ís. I still donít understand why the Japanese mfrís donít release a V4 powered enthusiast car as they have history with that engine, especially Honda and Yamaha. Toyota has worked closely on engines with Yamaha in the past and Furusawa built an inline 4 that fires at the exact same intervals as a 90 degree V4, the crossplane 4. I own that engine too as well as a V4 and I actually prefer the crossplane 4. If that engine was put into an enthusiast car people would **** a brick. Especially once they put an exhaust on. Itís a symphony to go through the revs, think Voodoo engine like ****. But at least the 86 is a boxer 4 which has more feel to me, and better sound. Iím already watching videos of new owners putting exhaust and UEL headers on the thing and it sounds incredible. Very reminiscent of EJ powered WRX And STiís with aftermarket exhaust.

Just waiting on the debut of the Corolla to make my decision and try to wait out this chip shortage car market crazy price deal. Iím ready to buy but Iím already pushing myself to wait until 2024 when most of this craziness should be a thing of the past. I also think Toybaru will release a PP, and Toyo lets you add it to the base model, unlike Boobaru. Thatís worth waiting on for me also. $1700 was a steal for Sachs, Brembos and wheels. I do think the 86 is an amazing car as is, and bang for the buck itís one of the best performance/enthusiast cars ever made. They nailed it and fixed everything that needed fixing. Best value on the market. I just wish it was AWD and had a turbo. But in the coupe RWD thing, itís the best thing out there to me for the dollar. Youíd have to spend double or more on a Cayman. And that would just be a base. Screw that. For that $ you could have a 86 and a DD, both new for that money.

So many interesting cars coming out also. Iím gonna have a nice seat in the peanut gallery watching the new Z, see what the STi does, the GR Corolla, and what a 6MT Supra is going to cost. Ze musical chairs game has begun. Last round too before a hybrid/EV takeover of the entire automobile market. Even Porsche has come out and said the next Cayman will be hybrid only. Wow. As an automobile market maven like many of us here, well the writing is on the wall and itís glaringly obvious. This is the Last Dance. And I donít want to make the wrong decision or play my hand too quick. I did that with the RS and I wonít make that same mistake again.
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Old 01-09-2022, 10:52 AM   #155
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Great analysis, Pre, I enjoyed reading your thoughts, most of which I agree with, and where I don't, it's mostly just small quibbles.

I have a GR86 on order, but having never driven any of the Gen1 originals I have no idea what to expect, despite reading every review/watching every video out there. I'm old enough that I bought a MR2 new in 1985, and this GR86 is only the second car besides that MR2 that has ever made me so excited for a new car. Perhaps I'm entering my second childhood. I hope so!
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Old 01-09-2022, 11:03 AM   #156
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Gen 1 took full ownership for me to appreciate it. Riding along with my friends who got their BRZs before me, I didn't really appreciate it and overall I was disappointed. With Gen 1, you REALLY had to wring out the power to enjoy it. Most of my friends didn't stick with their BRZs beyond two years. I kept mine for over 4 years, and pretty much loved every moment of it, but I really put it through its paces.

Gen 2 seems as though they made it much more effortless to drive it, which hopefully translates to greater customer retention. It's priced reasonably enough that I could realistically keep my Impreza that's paid off and enjoy a Twin as a second vehicle. The STI, GR Corolla and manual Supra would have to fail for me to consider another round with the Twins, but a GR86 is certainly worthy of my consideration. Especially with aftermarket suspension and tuning, I think Gen 2 will be insanely fun and overall a good value.

I'm excited to see what new owners say about it after a few months of ownership.
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Old 01-09-2022, 07:15 PM   #157
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Originally Posted by Pre View Post
The 86 addresses just about every issue I had with the S2k..
This is what hit me pretty hard and pushed me over the edge with the GR86.

I'd kicked around the idea of a 3rd car/toy for a long time but just couldn't imagine justifying it (I have many bicycles that desperately need what little free time I have.) I figured if I ever got anything at all, it would have to be an E46 M3 or S2000. The former was my peak dream car, basically sole inspiration for going to college. Latter I just have a long-time lust for, between the first one I ever saw in person (massively wowed me) to the 00's era Best Motoring vids on the ***8216;tubes.

My brother, who has or has had more cars than probably Jay Leno, helped convince me to pull the trigger on a 3rd car.. but it was his neighbors ***8216;99 2.5RS that I was going for! Idea was to have a winter beater that the wifey could learn stick on. The idea of a 3rd car that we'd actually DRIVE, and keep some miles off the dubya and the van was compelling for me. Fortunately the seller ghosted me and I dodged a rusty bullet. Few weeks later, it suddenly hit me that the new twins have so much of what I want from an M3 or S2K, none of what I don't want (convertible, BMW-ness) and the parts I'm missing, I can deal (M Power and Honda rev-gasms.) We will rack salt-free miles onto the GR with no remorse, something I could never see doing to a clean E46 or S2k.

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Originally Posted by cyrenus View Post
I'm old enough that I bought a MR2 new in 1985, and this GR86 is only the second car besides that MR2 that has ever made me so excited for a new car. Perhaps I'm entering my second childhood. I hope so!
Aye! Thumbs up!

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Originally Posted by chanomatik View Post
The STI, GR Corolla and manual Supra would have to fail for me to consider another round with the Twins, but a GR86 is certainly worthy of my consideration. Especially with aftermarket suspension and tuning, I think Gen 2 will be insanely fun and overall a good value.

I'm excited to see what new owners say about it after a few months of ownership.
I have no hopes for the STI now it's not even the looks, just no faith that we'll get a WOWZER powertrain, which it would desperately need to stick out in a good way now. It could look good with.. the.. cladding.. maybe. Wouldn't count on it. My expectations for it are so low.

I have a feeling a lot of folks in these forums will be getting GR Corollas, out of curiosity alone if nothing else. I look forward to seeing those farting around.

From the moment I saw the new BRZ, I got new Alpine A110 vibes from it. The new A110 has vaulted to a special place in my mind because it's one of the only (if not the only) new cars Gordon Murray owns. The twins are even better in a way though, because NA, revs and manual. I'd love to hear what Murray has to say about them if he drives one.

Both GR86 and A110 are in Gran Turismo Sport. I dropped the weight of the 86 to 2730lbs and power up to 260hp (my imaginary, attainable STI/GRMN version, lol) and could get within 1 sec of the A110s time on a fast 2:00 course. Keep in mind GT is to driving sims what Minecraft is to farming simulators, but still, makes me feel like people will be able to build some legitimately quick cars out of them.
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Old 01-11-2022, 03:53 PM   #158
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popped by a local dealer today. 49k at Serramonte Subaru (SF bay area) for a Limited. 45k for premium. good lordÖ

there are GR86s nearby for 33kÖ itís a no brainer for me despite any suspension differences. toyoís grey interior and better exterior color choices wins.
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Old 01-11-2022, 04:23 PM   #159
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Originally Posted by blackseafleet View Post
popped by a local dealer today. 49k at Serramonte Subaru (SF bay area) for a Limited. 45k for premium. good lord***8230;

there are GR86s nearby for 33k***8230; it's a no brainer for me despite any suspension differences. toyo's grey interior and better exterior color choices wins.
Conversely, on the east coast I have a BRZ Limited on order for $30,200 out the door.
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Old 01-11-2022, 05:25 PM   #160
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Conversely, on the east coast I have a BRZ Limited on order for $30,200 out the door.
How do you go about locking the price in on an order? Pay a deposit? There was a Redditor grieving about ordering a GR only to have the price upped 10k once it arrived at the dealer. Doesn't sound like he put any money down up front though.
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Old 01-11-2022, 07:54 PM   #161
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toyoís grey interior and better exterior color choices wins.
Don't they have the same interior? And they definitely have the exact same exterior colors with the exception of Neptune and World Rally Blue. The overlap colors are all the same Subaru paint colors with different names painted at the same factory just like last gen.
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Old 01-11-2022, 08:19 PM   #162
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Choosing between the Twins comes down to styling preference (front bumper), suspension preference (squirrely vs predictable), and price/availability. Besides that, I don't know anyone who chose one over the other specifically because of the one color that one model had over the other.

At launch it was a bit different because you had to get the BRZ Premium and/or Limited if you wanted dual zone climate, heated seats and mirrors, HID headlights, etc.
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Old 01-11-2022, 08:41 PM   #163
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I would get a BRZ and put a GR86 front bumper on it. Everything else about the BRZ I prefer even the interior stitching color (Gray is too drab)
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Old 01-11-2022, 09:11 PM   #164
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I would get a BRZ and put a GR86 front bumper on it. Everything else about the BRZ I prefer even the interior stitching color (Gray is too drab)
I do like the interior of the base BRZ better than the econo car fabric in the 86, but I think the premium 86 interior looks a bit cleaner than the BRZ.

I love the WRB on the BRZ and really like the Neptune blue on the 86. Nobody in San Diego has any test drive models available yet. Everything that comes in gets snatched up right away.
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Old 01-11-2022, 09:19 PM   #165
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We have a White auto. $33K and some change. Buyer ordered and it wasn't checked at the time if they were gonna be able to actually buy it. Now, it's available. Hope I get to drive it.
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Old 01-11-2022, 09:50 PM   #166
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How do you go about locking the price in on an order? Pay a deposit? There was a Redditor grieving about ordering a GR only to have the price upped 10k once it arrived at the dealer. Doesn't sound like he put any money down up front though.
If you can get a VIP pin then the dealer is supposed to honor it on orders. It's up to them if they want to honor it for cars on the lot, which is unlikely given the shortage now. I have a pin so I called the dealer, put the order in, and am waiting. No haggling or otherwise.

Regarding the difference between the cars, the only thing I like more about the GR86 is the front bumper and the duckbill. I could technically swap both if I wanted and with the deal on the BRZ it was a no brainer.
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Old 01-14-2022, 09:02 PM   #167
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Old 01-15-2022, 01:03 AM   #168
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Closer each day to the tS model.
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Old 01-15-2022, 04:36 AM   #169
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Closer each day to the tS model.
I agree. it seems to be the same STI tuned model that was white in color. same bronze rims, same gooseneck spoiler, and the STI exhaust and brembos. if or when get a ts in the states, will it only come in world rally blue and ceramic white. overall weight was kept low with aluminum fenders and hood. the carbon fiber spoiler will help keep the weight down. a carbon fiber roof, hood, and deck lid in addition to the carbon fiber spoiler would make for a very nice brz ts.
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Old 01-15-2022, 10:06 AM   #170
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As y'all know the BRZ sold orders have closed. We have speculated as to why and they have said it's due to how many sold orders they have. Which will take up nearly all of the '22 supply they are expecting. If they can get more cars from SBR, they may reopen it. Sounds like they will still have for-the-lot cars; but, probably not many.
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Old 01-15-2022, 10:43 AM   #171
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As y'all know the BRZ sold orders have closed. We have speculated as to why and they have said it's due to how many sold orders they have. Which will take up nearly all of the '22 supply they are expecting. If they can get more cars from SBR, they may reopen it. Sounds like they will still have for-the-lot cars; but, probably not many.
What is a "Sold Order?" Is that a customer placed order vs an inventory car?
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Old 01-15-2022, 11:07 AM   #172
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What is a "Sold Order?" Is that a customer placed order vs an inventory car?
Wow. I can't just say "yes" and post......but, Yes....
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Old 01-15-2022, 11:37 AM   #173
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"Yes12435" or something as such is what most people put to ensure enough characters are placed.

Is this the new norm then, instead of just leaving an order open and fulfilling them as they become available? Or is this for fear of having sold orders so backlogged that the new available models will be MY2023 BRZ anyway?
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Old 01-15-2022, 01:55 PM   #174
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"Yes12435" or something as such is what most people put to ensure enough characters are placed.

Is this the new norm then, instead of just leaving an order open and fulfilling them as they become available? Or is this for fear of having sold orders so backlogged that the new available models will be MY2023 BRZ anyway?
They have enough orders that they'll be filling them as they become available.......

If they left it open and kept taking orders at the rate they were, they would likely have to cancel orders as the '23MY approached.
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Old 01-15-2022, 02:13 PM   #175
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Ah okay. That's kinda what I figured.

On this forum, member edkwon ordered a Taycan Sport Turismo and as it was being built it could've been a MY2021 or MY2022, depending on the timing of when they retooled the assembly line. They wouldn't have cancelled his order, having ordered a MY2021. They would've just given him a MY2022 and the subsequent upgrades (Android Auto finally came standard on MY2022, so he was REALLY hoping to get a MY2022).

I know the money difference from Subaru to Porsche is huge. Just wasn't sure. Thanks for clarifying!
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