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Old 07-29-2021, 10:29 PM   #3551
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10/10, would pick the porsche over the iphone i mean tesla, any day. the last time i went to a drag strip was... never.
You could teach a chimp to go fast in a straight line. Itís all about the corners.
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Old 07-30-2021, 09:18 AM   #3552
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We're looking at CUV's (wife nixed the van idea, oh well), and I want the Tesla Y batteries, motors, etc. but in something else; the Mach E is the one that works as a vehicle, but their EV tech is years behind Teslas; I really wish Tesla would start building cars instead of rolling iphones, as the Tablet-centric controls make it a no-go for us. The Mach-E has so many short comings as well (like no tow rating which makes it a no-go for us) that we'll probably wind up with a hybrid or ICE vehicle if we buy sooner rather than later (Rav-4 or more likely a Highlander or Ridgeline if she's comfortable dailying it). We aren't that old either, Tesla just makes really stupid moves interior-wise (like the freaking joke of a yoke in the S) that it makes the vehicles unappealing.
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Old 07-30-2021, 10:33 AM   #3553
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Car & Driver's latest issue tests all the EV's for their EV of the Year and the Mach E was an easy winner. Are you looking for the best EV or the EV with the best tech?
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Old 07-30-2021, 10:51 AM   #3554
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Originally Posted by Sid03SVT View Post
We're looking at CUV's (wife nixed the van idea, oh well), and I want the Tesla Y batteries, motors, etc. but in something else; the Mach E is the one that works as a vehicle, but their EV tech is years behind Teslas; I really wish Tesla would start building cars instead of rolling iphones, as the Tablet-centric controls make it a no-go for us. The Mach-E has so many short comings as well (like no tow rating which makes it a no-go for us) that we'll probably wind up with a hybrid or ICE vehicle if we buy sooner rather than later (Rav-4 or more likely a Highlander or Ridgeline if she's comfortable dailying it). We aren't that old either, Tesla just makes really stupid moves interior-wise (like the freaking joke of a yoke in the S) that it makes the vehicles unappealing.
If you want a new Tesla you will be waiting for months, Q3 productions is sold. Both of our friends that ordered Model Y have been waiting for a while. I am trying to sell my Model 3 right now to upgrade to a Model S but the delivery times are crazy.

By the way Tesla offered $45,800 for my 2018 Model 3 Performance Stealth, back interior, with FSD and 21.5k miles. Anyone here wants it?
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Old 07-30-2021, 11:14 AM   #3555
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Car & Driver's latest issue tests all the EV's for their EV of the Year and the Mach E was an easy winner. Are you looking for the best EV or the EV with the best tech?
Mach E has no tow rating, I need something in my fleet with a Tow rating for occasional use (utility trailer so at least ~1,500lbs anything more than that is gravy). If Ford rated it to tow I'd take it as is over the Y.

The Tesla Y has a tow rating (3,500lbs), but the tablet user interface is abysmal; I want physical controls for the things that I adjust while driving so I don't have to take my eyes off the road. Beyond that, I want a gauge cluster in front of me so I can check my speed in my peripheral vision, rather than looking down and to the right at the center console/tablet and taking my eyes off the road to see how fast I'm going. I don't even like the center-mount gauge clusters that came in some sub-compacts (older Yaris & mini cooper).

I spec'd out a Model Y (DM AWD LR) and a Mach-E (Premium ER AWD) and they were within $700 of each other, I know that the Mach-E still qualifies for the full Federal Tax credit, which honestly that combined with the better interior (and likely better build quality) I had made my decision, but when I found out I couldn't tow anything with it, I started looking at ICE/hybrid crossovers, and the Ridgeline (again).

The Range of the Y & Mach-E ER are good enough for me, but they have shortcomings that take them off the table completely. Neither one will be cheaper for me to own than a comparable ICE/Hybrid vehicle; I'm not willing to pay more to get less just to say I have an EV.

The only "Tech" that matters to me in an EV is the driveline (batteries, motors, controllers, etc.) the functional make it go stuff; Tesla is still well at the head of the pack here, Ford is closing that gap but they are still years behind.

ICE/Hybrid crossovers aren't exactly the most engaging "drivers cars" so an EV would fit well here as a utility-focused vehicle that I don't really care about outside of A to B family/house stuff, would also free up a spot in the driveway for something fun (V8, manual, RWD, possibly drop top).

I'm not looking to buy "right now" I always to try to keep myself out of the position of "needing" a vehicle, but I don't want to drag my feet for too long, as it just inconveniences me by not having something that can do these tasks that lives in my own driveway, I have access to a Ridgeline whenever I want it, but I have to go pick it up and bring it back after I'm done, and it's someone else's vehicle so if I f*** it up I will feel bad.

Last edited by Sid03SVT; 07-30-2021 at 11:23 AM.
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Old 07-30-2021, 11:34 AM   #3556
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Mach E has no tow rating, I need something in my fleet with a Tow rating for occasional use (utility trailer so at least ~1,500lbs anything more than that is gravy). If Ford rated it to tow I'd take it as is over the Y.

The Tesla Y has a tow rating (3,500lbs), but the tablet user interface is abysmal; I want physical controls for the things that I adjust while driving so I don't have to take my eyes off the road. Beyond that, I want a gauge cluster in front of me so I can check my speed in my peripheral vision, rather than looking down and to the right at the center console/tablet and taking my eyes off the road to see how fast I'm going. I don't even like the center-mount gauge clusters that came in some sub-compacts (older Yaris & mini cooper).

I spec'd out a Model Y (DM AWD LR) and a Mach-E (Premium ER AWD) and they were within $700 of each other, I know that the Mach-E still qualifies for the full Federal Tax credit, which honestly that combined with the better interior (and likely better build quality) I had made my decision, but when I found out I couldn't tow anything with it, I started looking at ICE/hybrid crossovers, and the Ridgeline (again).

The Range of the Y & Mach-E ER are good enough for me, but they have shortcomings that take them off the table completely. Neither one will be cheaper for me to own than a comparable ICE/Hybrid vehicle; I'm not willing to pay more to get less just to say I have an EV.

The only "Tech" that matters to me in an EV is the driveline (batteries, motors, controllers, etc.) the functional make it go stuff; Tesla is still well at the head of the pack here, Ford is closing that gap but they are still years behind.

ICE/Hybrid crossovers aren't exactly the most engaging "drivers cars" so an EV would fit well here as a utility-focused vehicle that I don't really care about outside of A to B family/house stuff, would also free up a spot in the driveway for something fun (V8, manual, RWD, possibly drop top).

I'm not looking to buy "right now" I always to try to keep myself out of the position of "needing" a vehicle, but I don't want to drag my feet for too long, as it just inconveniences me by not having something that can do these tasks that lives in my own driveway, I have access to a Ridgeline whenever I want it, but I have to go pick it up and bring it back after I'm done, and it's someone else's vehicle so if I f*** it up I will feel bad.
So the Kia/Hundai EV twins are expected to have 3,500 pounds of towing. And they have more traditional interiors. Personally I like the EV6 much better than the Ionic 5.
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Old 07-30-2021, 11:42 AM   #3557
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Beat the Porsche ring time and the Master Race car builders will reply with a better time as they always did for the GT-R
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Old 07-30-2021, 11:43 AM   #3558
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So the Kia/Hundai EV twins are expected to have 3,500 pounds of towing. And they have more traditional interiors. Personally I like the EV6 much better than the Ionic 5.
They aren't out yet, let alone the full specs or pricing, so I can't configure them; only kia/hyundai offerings on the market are the FWD models.

Hyundai Ioniq is a no-go already based solely on the exterior colors shown, at least the Kia has one Acceptable color in "Urban yellow", but the interior shots are a couple steps in the wrong direction as far as physical controls go, but definitely better than the Y.

When they become available/configurable they will make the list but not until then.
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Old 07-30-2021, 12:31 PM   #3559
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Beat the Porsche ring time and the Master Race car builders will reply with a better time as they always did for the GT-R
starting at 300k

Tesla has a Model S Plaid at the ring so I assume they will run it as soon as they open it. With Tesla opening Giga Berlin later this year they are going to be at the ring way more often than before. For $80k+ as tested in that video the Taycan should come with gold plated buttons.
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Old 07-30-2021, 01:19 PM   #3560
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starting at 300k

Tesla has a Model S Plaid at the ring so I assume they will run it as soon as they open it. With Tesla opening Giga Berlin later this year they are going to be at the ring way more often than before. For $80k+ as tested in that video the Taycan should come with gold plated buttons.
But the Porsche does not look like a squeezed turd.
And will last longer without
Falling apart

If you care about such things more than an imaginary lap time you cannot ever hope to duplicate
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Old 07-30-2021, 01:47 PM   #3561
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But the Porsche does not look like a squeezed turd.
All Porsches look like squeezed turds.

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Old 07-30-2021, 02:36 PM   #3562
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But the Porsche does not look like a squeezed turd.
And will last longer without
Falling apart

If you care about such things more than an imaginary lap time you cannot ever hope to duplicate
What about all the Porsche engine failures or the Taycan drivetrain/power lost failure that will leave you stranded and has to be fixed at the stealership. Panel gaps is not equal to long term reliability ... there are Model 3 with 200k miles already and used as taxis and police cruisers.

All cars have issues and your perception about Tesla is wrong and fueled by the media. Maybe you can get a German assembled Model Y next year .

https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/fo...calls-tsbs.15/

Last edited by juanmedina; 07-30-2021 at 02:44 PM.
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Old 07-30-2021, 04:43 PM   #3563
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But the Porsche does not look like a squeezed turd.
And will last longer without
Falling apart

If you care about such things more than an imaginary lap time you cannot ever hope to duplicate

I finally just had to turn to the ignore list. The fanboy bs is completely out of control. I'm all for reading up on car news, even Tethla, but f me.
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Old 07-31-2021, 02:48 PM   #3564
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What about all the Porsche engine failures or the Taycan drivetrain/power lost failure that will leave you stranded and has to be fixed at the stealership. Panel gaps is not equal to long term reliability ... there are Model 3 with 200k miles already and used as taxis and police cruisers.

All cars have issues and your perception about Tesla is wrong and fueled by the media. Maybe you can get a German assembled Model Y next year .

https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/fo...calls-tsbs.15/
Interesting you should post about reliability. Maybe you have read C&D's EV of the year comparison.

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a3...v-of-the-year/

A few tidbits. Note only three of the EV's tested had any issues. I wonder which ones?

Quote:
Our eyes were also left wanting when they noticed the large gap around the hood of our test car, a too-common Tesla build-quality issue.
Quote:
It didn't help that the infotainment system on the Model Y we tested stopped working within 12 hours of the car's arrival.
Quote:
Sloppy fit and finish and grating squeak coming from the right rear seat were reminders that no Teslas are identical.
Quote:
A front-motor failure sidelined our 3600-mile car in the middle of testing.
One would be the Tesla Model Y (obviously as named in one of the quotes) and the other two were the Model 3 and the Model S. These issues came up on short term testing so you can imagine what typical ownership is like for a lot of people. Let's face it (okay we know you won't), these cars are junk.
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Old 07-31-2021, 09:26 PM   #3565
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Interesting you should post about reliability. Maybe you have read C&D's EV of the year comparison.

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a3...v-of-the-year/

A few tidbits. Note only three of the EV's tested had any issues. I wonder which ones?





One would be the Tesla Model Y (obviously as named in one of the quotes) and the other two were the Model 3 and the Model S. These issues came up on short term testing so you can imagine what typical ownership is like for a lot of people. Let's face it (okay we know you won't), these cars are junk.

*waits for ďfake news media is out to get TeslaĒ response *
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Old 07-31-2021, 09:28 PM   #3566
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Interesting you should post about reliability. Maybe you have read C&D's EV of the year comparison.

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a3...v-of-the-year/

A few tidbits. Note only three of the EV's tested had any issues. I wonder which ones?









One would be the Tesla Model Y (obviously as named in one of the quotes) and the other two were the Model 3 and the Model S. These issues came up on short term testing so you can imagine what typical ownership is like for a lot of people. Let's face it (okay we know you won't), these cars are junk.
Nice generalization. I just love how much hate this brand can drive. Naysayers keep loosing ground and there is nothing they can't do about it. All I did was post a video of the Taycan't vs the Plaid and people lost their minds haha. 1 year ago when the Taycan was beating the Model S by a car length the haters were so happy proclaiming how amazing German engineering was, the superior 800V architecture and 2-speed transmission. A few months later they have nothing other to say and they go back to their usual tactics of complaining about looks and so call and untrue statements about the car's "reliability".

We have some people talking about how their Leaf is the **** and how the world is so unfair and this are toys for the rich . This junk will become the best seller car in the world by revenue very soon and in a few years the best seller by volume. If the issues that your posted were critical and wide spread there would be recalls. I just know we have two 2018 model 3's one with zero issues and the other with minor issues fixed on my driveway, tail light condensation, rattle and charge port door getting stuck from time time. My Lexus and Subaru had way more serious issues than the Tesla's and not covered by a warranty. My next car will be a Tesla and I am also scheduled to test drive the Lucid Air just because I like to keep my eyes open. I would not be buying another Tesla if they were a bad car. I put my money where my month is and maybe I just have been lucky with my cars and the people that I know that have Tesla's.
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Old 07-31-2021, 10:16 PM   #3567
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Somebody has their jimmies in a rustle. Calm down dude, it's just a car, it's not your child or wife we're talking about. Good lord man.
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Old 07-31-2021, 11:04 PM   #3568
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Somebody has their jimmies in a rustle. Calm down dude, it's just a car, it's not your child or wife we're talking about. Good lord man.
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Old 08-01-2021, 02:18 AM   #3569
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Somebody has their jimmies in a rustle. Calm down dude, it's just a car, it's not your child or wife we're talking about. Good lord man.
It's getting to this level man, srsly.

https://www.scientology.org/

All I need now is for 4S to post a Tom Cruise jumping on the chair Oprah .gif and I'm all f'in set brah!
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Old 08-01-2021, 02:36 AM   #3570
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It's getting to this level man, srsly.

https://www.scientology.org/

All I need now is for 4S to post a Tom Cruise jumping on the chair Oprah .gif and I'm all f'in set brah!
Listen you pompous Leaf driver. You think youíre so above all with the Nissan Leaf. Why donít you Leaf Tom Cruise out of this!

Jk, you know Iím joking.
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Old 08-01-2021, 03:09 AM   #3571
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Listen you pompous Leaf driver. You think youíre so above all with the Nissan Leaf. Why donít you Leaf Tom Cruise out of this!

Jk, you know Iím joking.
I got news for you dude. Leaf drivers are rebel scum. They arenít above anyone. With that whole 80 mile range, dude how could they be ďaboveĒ anyone

It just works for some of us for local transpo. To me at least, EV = something like a Honda Fit EV type deal. Inexpensive, DD, beater. For 50k an EV better be DATY, and the GFE. Otherwise for my 50k Iím buying ICE/6MT.

The funny thing is Iíve driven a number of Tethlas. Iíll admit in a straight line, only thing comparable Iíve driven is a MP4-12C. Ridden in a relatively new 911 turbo, or one of my bikes sending it every weekend. Get the things in the turns though and the boat comes out, heavy AF. They are a one trick pony to me. I care zero about ADAS, loathe it in fact, ACC included. Just fast AF in a straight line, not much else and itís a soulless appliance at that. Thatís cool and all but I could teach a chimp how to drive one fast in a straight line.

One thing is fo sho. The big players are coming for dat @$$. Ford just hit them with strike one. Much mo to come.
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Old 08-01-2021, 03:22 AM   #3572
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Yeah, but nearly 11's out of a 39. They said it could not be done.
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Old 08-01-2021, 09:29 AM   #3573
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I got news for you dude. Leaf drivers are rebel scum. They aren't above anyone. With that whole 80 mile range, dude how could they be "above" anyone

It just works for some of us for local transpo. To me at least, EV = something like a Honda Fit EV type deal. Inexpensive, DD, beater. For 50k an EV better be DATY, and the GFE. Otherwise for my 50k I'm buying ICE/6MT.

The funny thing is I've driven a number of Tethlas. I'll admit in a straight line, only thing comparable I've driven is a MP4-12C. Ridden in a relatively new 911 turbo, or one of my bikes sending it every weekend. Get the things in the turns though and the boat comes out, heavy AF. They are a one trick pony to me. I care zero about ADAS, loathe it in fact, ACC included. Just fast AF in a straight line, not much else and it's a soulless appliance at that. That's cool and all but I could teach a chimp how to drive one fast in a straight line.

One thing is fo sho. The big players are coming for dat @$$. Ford just hit them with strike one. Much mo to come.
Post like this makes my head hurt . Ford coming for who? please. The Ford Mach-E is a good car and its taking market from ICE cars not other EV's. Have you not seen Tesla achieving record quarters one after the other? Have you look at the Mach-E sales in the USA declining with the top of sale in February and hopefully higher this month? The EV market is wide open and is open for many players, stablished and non stablished. I agree Tesla current market share will not be as dominant but doesn't mean that Tesla will not be able to sell millions of cars at a profit. Have you look at the 10-K from Ford in Q2? thy had an operational lost of 22M but they make money in "Other income"; could that be EV credits ? I know you hate Tesla and their American products but I am sorry Tesla will not fail at this point it is too late for that to happen. Maybe one day they will make a 20k something car.... tax the rich.

Also, I think you should go to you local autocross and see how many Tesla's are running and how well they are doing. You will be surprised.
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Old 08-01-2021, 10:57 AM   #3574
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Post like this makes my head hurt . Ford coming for who? please. The Ford Mach-E is a good car and its taking market from ICE cars not other EV's. Have you not seen Tesla achieving record quarters one after the other? Have you look at the Mach-E sales in the USA declining with the top of sale in February and hopefully higher this month? The EV market is wide open and is open for many players, stablished and non stablished. I agree Tesla current market share will not be as dominant but doesn't mean that Tesla will not be able to sell millions of cars at a profit. Have you look at the 10-K from Ford in Q2? thy had an operational lost of 22M but they make money in "Other income"; could that be EV credits ? I know you hate Tesla and their American products but I am sorry Tesla will not fail at this point it is too late for that to happen. Maybe one day they will make a 20k something car.... tax the rich.

Also, I think you should go to you local autocross and see how many Tesla's are running and how well they are doing. You will be surprised.
I have several coworkers who purchased the Mach E after I suggested looking at it before pulling a trigger on a model 3 or Y. So yeah, Ford is pulling some business from Tesla. It might not be a ton but itís still some. Anytime another any company sells an EV car, itís a sale taken from Tesla.

Dude, the world is big enough for lots of companies to thrive. No one here is wishing Tesla to fail nor saying they will. That discussion ended nearly 2 years ago but youíre still beating that drum alone.

Itís a car company, relax. You get so uppity about posts that I get concerned you might have an aneurism.
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Old 08-03-2021, 01:13 PM   #3575
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Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
Nice generalization. I just love how much hate this brand can drive. Naysayers keep loosing ground and there is nothing they can't do about it. All I did was post a video of the Taycan't vs the Plaid and people lost their minds haha. 1 year ago when the Taycan was beating the Model S by a car length the haters were so happy proclaiming how amazing German engineering was, the superior 800V architecture and 2-speed transmission. A few months later they have nothing other to say and they go back to their usual tactics of complaining about looks and so call and untrue statements about the car's "reliability".

We have some people talking about how their Leaf is the **** and how the world is so unfair and this are toys for the rich . This junk will become the best seller car in the world by revenue very soon and in a few years the best seller by volume. If the issues that your posted were critical and wide spread there would be recalls. I just know we have two 2018 model 3's one with zero issues and the other with minor issues fixed on my driveway, tail light condensation, rattle and charge port door getting stuck from time time. My Lexus and Subaru had way more serious issues than the Tesla's and not covered by a warranty. My next car will be a Tesla and I am also scheduled to test drive the Lucid Air just because I like to keep my eyes open. I would not be buying another Tesla if they were a bad car. I put my money where my month is and maybe I just have been lucky with my cars and the people that I know that have Tesla's.
Ha ha ha man you are way too attached to a car company. I countered your post with legit Car & Driver findings and you pretty well lose your mind. I feel people would accept Tesla's more if the fanboys weren't next level extreme fanatical.
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