Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Friday March 29, 2024
Home Forums Images WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC General > News & Rumors > Non-Subaru News & Rumors

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.







* As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases. 
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads. 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-14-2008, 02:07 PM   #1
AVANTI R5
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 73805
Join Date: Nov 2004
Vehicle:
24 TypeS ZO6
White

Default Half of Ford’s U.S. lineup to get six speed autos, dual-clutch Powershift on its wa

Quote:
Half of Ford’s U.S. lineup to get six speed autos, dual-clutch Powershift on its way




No bolt is being left untouched as carmakers in both the U.S. and Europe strive to develop cleaner and more fuel-efficient vehicles. Everything from weight-saving measures to aerodynamic tweaks and even downsized engines are being investigated in the hope that engineers can come up with fuel economy improvements. One area that has the potential for some of the biggest gains is gearbox technology.

In its quest for improved fuel economy, Ford has adopted a strategy of replacing its aging transmission designs with more efficient ones. The Blue Oval plans to add new smooth-shifting six-speed ‘boxes to more than half of its North American product lineup, including the new 2009 Ford F-150.


Later this year, Ford will begin producing a new fuel-saving, FWD six-speed transmission for use first in the 2009 Ford Escape and Mercury Mariner, which goes on sale this summer. The new transmissions deliver 4 to 6% improvements in fuel efficiency on average compared with typical four- and five-speed gearboxes. Ford’s design features a higher than normal top gear for fuel-efficient cruising.


Beyond the new automatics, Ford will also add its dual-clutch Powershift transmission to a number of North American models with the first cars to be equipped with the fuel-saving gearbox due next year. Powershift has already shown to improve fuel-economy by 10% in the European Focus range and similar savings are expected for American models.

http://www.motorauthority.com/cars/f...way/#more-5464
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
AVANTI R5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Old 04-15-2008, 08:38 AM   #2
Hazdaz
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 14611
Join Date: Jan 2002
Default

WOW.. you mean Ford is actually *GASP* updating their product line and trying to keep up with the competition?!? Bold Move indeed.



Sorry for the cynicism, but sending out a news released that you will sometime in the future replace your elderly transmissions with 6-speed autos is not the answer... talk is cheap. How about actually releasing that 6-speed in all your cars, and then talking about it.

The dual-clutch system does sound interesting though.
Hazdaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2008, 08:51 AM   #3
kukabuka
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 41218
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: North Idaho
Vehicle:
2022 EV6 Wind AWD
2019 Ascent Touring

Default

From what I can glean from some Google searches, I think the powershift is supplied by Getrag, but I believe that Getrag is licensing the technology from Borg-Warner. Sorry for no hard web page links, but I didn't find any single web page to explain this clearly. If I remember correctly, the Evo X is doing the same thing for their version. Please correct me if I'm wrong about this anyone.

So nothing new, but at least it's already out there, and Ford just needs to implement it.

Kudos to Ford for finally doing something that makes sense. And a high cruising gear is something I wish a lot more manufacturers would get into (listening Subaru?).
kukabuka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2008, 09:03 AM   #4
scott_gunn
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 4203
Join Date: Feb 2001
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Palm Harbor, FL
Vehicle:
2009 WRX 5spd hatch
Platinum Silver Metallic

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hazdaz View Post
WOW.. you mean Ford is actually *GASP* updating their product line and trying to keep up with the competition?!? Bold Move indeed.



Sorry for the cynicism, but sending out a news released that you will sometime in the future replace your elderly transmissions with 6-speed autos is not the answer... talk is cheap. How about actually releasing that 6-speed in all your cars, and then talking about it.

The dual-clutch system does sound interesting though.
Yeah, shame on Ford for releasing a press release touting future features. I can't believe an auto manufacturer would do such a thing.
scott_gunn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2008, 09:48 AM   #5
Hazdaz
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 14611
Join Date: Jan 2002
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by scott_gunn View Post
Yeah, shame on Ford for releasing a press release touting future features. I can't believe an auto manufacturer would do such a thing.
How about releasing the product FIRST.

Detroit has a looooooooooong history of over-promising future developments and under-delivering.

Where is that new fangled technology that Ford was touting just a few years ago where the exhaust fumes coming out of the tailpipe was supposedly cleaner than the air going into the car?

Talk is cheap - lets actually see this new technology on the road today.
Hazdaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2019, 07:14 AM   #6
AVANTI R5
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 73805
Join Date: Nov 2004
Vehicle:
24 TypeS ZO6
White

Default Should You Buy a Car With a Dual-Clutch Transmission? Not A a Ford

1234567890

Quote:
Should You Buy a Car With a Dual-Clutch Transmission?

Updated January 2019

In the quest to find a new car, there are a lot of questions that need to be asked. Questions about cargo room, technology, options, luxuries and other various elements will come up more than a few times while shopping for a new car. However, from the car driver’s perspective, there are just three main questions: ***8232;***8232;How comfortable is the driving experience? ***8232;How fun is it to drive? ***8232;How good is the car on fuel?


A major factor in answering those three questions has to do with the right transmission. Let’s face it, manual transmissions aren’t for everyone. They require familiarity and a level of perfection to get just right. With a traditional automatic transmission, drivers have been able to experience a fairly comfortable, yet less engaging experience. Still, an automatic transmission can leave any driving enthusiast unsatisfied. Luckily, progress has been made in the world of automatic transmissions that can help alleviate those woes.

A recent trend in transmissions is the Dual-Clutch Transmission, or DCT. Dual Clutch Transmissions have been around for quite a while, especially in high-powered performance cars, but the technology has been steadily making its way into more everyday driver consumer cars.***8232;***8232; DCTs are a lot like manual transmissions, except they have two clutches, and no pedal to control them. What this means is that there’s less interruption of power when shifting gears. It works like this: as you’re driving along, the car has already selected the next gear, so when it’s needed, it just does a quick change. No need for disengaging and engaging the clutch. The whole gear change takes just milliseconds to complete and is much quicker than a manual transmission.

To compare, the average person’s time to shift a manual transmission ranges between half a second to a full second. Previously, regular automatic gearboxes took much longer to shift than a DCT. These days, though, new advancements in automatic transmission software and design have made them much, much faster and quicker shifting. DCTs were once the gold standard in performance transmissions, but with automatics now getting faster, they are beginning crop back up.


Many DCTs can operate in two modes, a fully automatic mode, so the car’s computer chooses when to changes gears for you, or a manual mode, which lets you select gears via buttons, steering wheel paddles, or by moving the gear stick. The DCT in the end is an ideal candidate for a driver who wants to have an engaging manual like driving experience when they want it, and a comfortable automatic transmission for more mundane driving.

The first passenger car to have a DCT was the 2003 Volkswagen Golf R32. Other car companies have jumped on board with the DCT technology, offering it as an option on many cars. The technology seems to suggest that DCTs are a great idea for high-performance cars, where precision gear-changes are necessary, but how do DCTs act on your regular passenger car?

Ford’s version of the DCT, called Powershift, has been available on the Fiesta, and Focus for a little while now, and has encountered a few snags. Drivers found that the shifting is not as smooth as they expected. Additionally, there was some slowness in the selection of the next gear, especially when trying to accelerate at lower speeds. These issues aren’t just present on Ford’s DCT. Some drivers call VW’s dual clutch solution jerky too, especially in slow speeds.

Those minor quibbles about DCTs, however, are nothing compared to the issues that have plagued single clutch sequential gearboxes. DCTs are significantly smoother than single clutch units, prompting a switch by companies like Ferrari and BMW.

Richard Truett from Ford explained what the future holds for their DCT. “We are continually working to refine and improve the dual clutch transmission, so that when it changes gears the sensation won’t be any different from a traditional hydraulic step-gear transmission,” he said, acknowledging past criticisms. As of 2019, though, Ford has never truly solved this problem and has faced class action lawsuits over the defective transmission. This is easily one of the worst transmissions found on any modern-day car, to be frank.

Volkswagen is upbeat though. Mark Gillies, manager of product and technology communications for VW says, “The future looks good for DSG, because it combines the ease and convenience of an automatic transmission with the fun-to-drive element of a manual and because it doesn’t have an energy-sapping torque converter, it usually gets better gas mileage than a conventional automatic.” For what it’s worth, VW’s DSG box is one of the best transmissions in the business.

Gillies also adds, “We are very happy with the technology and feel it gives us a unique selling proposition, particularly on our TDI and sporty vehicles.” To date, Volkswagen has sold 3.5 million cars with their dual clutch transmissions.

Are DCT’s an ideal option for every car? Truett tells us there are a few places where a DCT just won’t work. “Dual clutch automatics don’t make sense for some vehicles, such as our Super Duty pickups.” Truett added, “A dual clutch transmission works best in a vehicle where fuel economy is the top priority. So, you are likely to see dual clutch automatics in our global small cars.” ***8232;***8232;So if you’re looking for a sportier feel in your daily drive, but want the ease of an automatic, a DCT is a great choice. It’s far more responsive than a traditional automatic or a Continuously Variable Transmission, and brings comparable fuel efficiency. DCT’s can be a good blend of performance and fuel economy, but that ratio depends on the manufacturer and the car. Some are much better on gas than manual or traditional automatic, while others can be more performance oriented.

Either way, try it out yourself when deciding if it’s truly better for you. DCT transmissions in cheap mass market passengers cars are extremely uncommon now, though, so it’s unlike you’ll ever be faced with this dilemma. Traditional automatics are much more common and for good reason: they are more reliable, shift smoother and are cheaper to service and maintain.
AVANTI R5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2019, 02:39 PM   #7
Calamity Jesus
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 44501
Join Date: Oct 2003
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Yeah, well, you know
Vehicle:
that 's, like, your
alternate facts, man.

Default

The press release that nearly bankrupted Ford.. again. Anyone have high hopes for Ford over the next decade? Do they have anything worthwhile for 2020 other than the F-150 and Mustang? Will the Ranger keep them afloat?
Calamity Jesus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2019, 03:08 PM   #8
FaastLegacy
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 11671
Join Date: Oct 2001
Chapter/Region: SWIC
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Default

I had Ford's DCT and now I have VW's DSG and the difference is night and day. VW's is smooth as silk and the *ONLY* time you notice any jerking is when you first pull away after having started the car.

Ford's DCT is another matter. It's completely earned all of the negative press and class action lawsuits that it's garnered.
FaastLegacy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2019, 05:53 PM   #9
godfather2112
Papi Chulo
Moderator
 
Member#: 53794
Join Date: Jan 2004
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: Boner kill city
Vehicle:
... 2017 BMW M2
2017 F-150

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calamity Jesus View Post
The press release that nearly bankrupted Ford.. again. Anyone have high hopes for Ford over the next decade? Do they have anything worthwhile for 2020 other than the F-150 and Mustang? Will the Ranger keep them afloat?
Maybe you should listen to their earnings call and see the mountain of cash they are sitting on. You seem to think that Ford needs to manufacture cars to stay alive yet seem to ignore the profitability and amount of trucks, suvs, and cuvs they sell.
Quote:
Originally Posted by FaastLegacy View Post
I had Ford's DCT and now I have VW's DSG and the difference is night and day. VW's is smooth as silk and the *ONLY* time you notice any jerking is when you first pull away after having started the car.

Ford's DCT is another matter. It's completely earned all of the negative press and class action lawsuits that it's garnered.
VW has had time to get the transmission down so expecting ford to have something amazing right out of the gates is kind of foolish. First gen DCT from BW was nothing amazing.
godfather2112 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2019, 07:09 PM   #10
humpthebobcat
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 443793
Join Date: Mar 2016
Vehicle:
2016 WRX m6 ISM
2005 F-150 FX4

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calamity Jesus View Post
Do they have anything worthwhile for 2020 other than the F-150 and Mustang?
Do you need anything else in your life besides a raptor and gt350? No, no you do not.
humpthebobcat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2019, 07:25 PM   #11
SubaDuba420
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 102793
Join Date: Dec 2005
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Vehicle:
2016 WRX
Ugly Sedan

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by godfather2112 View Post
VW has had time to get the transmission down so expecting ford to have something amazing right out of the gates is kind of foolish. First gen DCT from BW was nothing amazing.
Perhaps with the new Ford / VW partnership VW can share some of the knowledge related to programing of the DCT...
SubaDuba420 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2019, 09:10 PM   #12
heavyD
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 194216
Join Date: Nov 2008
Chapter/Region: W. Canada
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Vehicle:
2022 Fast POS

Default

The Powershift (made in Mexico) transmission is not a lot different than the MT82 (made in China) in that they are co-developed with Getrag but Ford builds them which is why both transmissions have been plagued with issues. It's easy to blame Mexico and China for poor manufacturing but it has to be noted that VW is building some of their DSG's in China and they don't have the widespread issues associated with the Powershift. I really like the Mustang and the Focus RS but Ford is amongst the worst when it comes to cutting corners and quality control so you can imagine why building their own transmissions has been somewhat of a disaster.
heavyD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2019, 09:36 PM   #13
godfather2112
Papi Chulo
Moderator
 
Member#: 53794
Join Date: Jan 2004
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: Boner kill city
Vehicle:
... 2017 BMW M2
2017 F-150

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by humpthebobcat View Post
Do you need anything else in your life besides a raptor and gt350? No, no you do not.
Yes. A Ford GT.
godfather2112 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2019, 02:29 PM   #14
FaastLegacy
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 11671
Join Date: Oct 2001
Chapter/Region: SWIC
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by godfather2112 View Post
VW has had time to get the transmission down so expecting ford to have something amazing right out of the gates is kind of foolish. First gen DCT from BW was nothing amazing.
The transmission has been around for 11 years now so I wouldn't exactly call it brand new, but I would have just settled for a transmission that just worked the way it was intended to and a manufacturer that wasn't lieing their ass off in ignoring the problem.

The design itself wasn't the problem so much as it was the ****ty build quality and the faulty seals they installed in just about all of them.

It would have to take a pretty special vehicle to get me back into a Ford at this point. Never again.
FaastLegacy is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Ford kicks off production of dual-clutch PowerShift gearbox AVANTI R5 Non-Subaru News & Rumors 24 03-30-2010 08:27 AM
Toyota Mark X G Sports To Get Six Speed Manual AVANTI R5 Non-Subaru News & Rumors 18 03-07-2010 09:41 PM
Ford officially announces dual clutch PowerShift gearbox for 2010 AVANTI R5 Non-Subaru News & Rumors 20 01-25-2009 01:08 PM
Hyundai Reveals New Six-Speed Auto Transmission AVANTI R5 Non-Subaru News & Rumors 28 12-28-2008 05:22 PM
Ford confirms roll-out of more efficient six-speed auto AVANTI R5 Non-Subaru News & Rumors 5 05-08-2008 01:27 PM

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:11 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2024 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2019, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.

As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases.

When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission
Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.