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Old 06-15-2022, 08:00 PM   #1
atbwrx
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Default Upgraded FEAL 442's on the way, what control arms to use?




I've been running FEAL 441's for many years now, and with close to 60K on them, it was time for a rebuild. I went ahead and ordered the "Upgrade" to 442's, which will be dual adjustable with reservoirs, and went with heavier springs.

With COVID Supply chain issues etc., its taken awhile waiting for parts to arrive, but I got notice today that they are done and are getting shipped out.

Looking forward to getting back out on the track with the upgraded coil overs. The 441's were really good, great for street driving, and for about 90% of the track (meaning I was overdriving them about 10% of the time). I've upgraded to an STI 6 speed tranny (from my WRX 5 speed) since last time I was on a road course, and it shifts so much cleaner I'm sure my times will be improving on that alone. I'll need the new suspension to keep up.

Will post pics when they arrive, but have some questions.

My 2014 WRX has 120K on it, and definitely starting to hear some clunks from the suspension. If I replace the front control arms, is it best to stick with OEM, or go with some of the aftermarket pieces? Anyone have any suggestions? I'll probably do the rears as well. Any preferences on what aftermarket parts to use or is it best just to stick with OEM?
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Old 06-17-2022, 07:31 PM   #2
atbwrx
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I decided to go Whiteline for the control arms front and rear.



On the front, I liked that the main bushing appears to suspended between two shim spacers. I think that's a good way to isolate any harshness.

On the rear, I want to keep it simple, and not mess with any lock nut adjustments.

Unfortunately, the fronts are back ordered. Hopefully they will arive in time for me to get in a track day in July .
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Old 06-17-2022, 07:31 PM   #3
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Duplicate post. Please delete.
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Old 06-20-2022, 07:33 AM   #4
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I have had those rear lower control arms before. My suggestion is to cancel the order and grab a set of SPL rear lower arms. My whiteline arms slipped on the first AutoX I took them on and I could never get the alignment correct after that.
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Old 06-21-2022, 09:55 AM   #5
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I would recommend getting 15+ WRX/STI control arms. The rear bushing is sealed spherical and the "spacer" to the chassis is taller which would induce some anti-lift. You'll have to replace the studs and get the bolts to secure it to the chassis. It's something worth considering. You can find a set for about $200.
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Old 06-22-2022, 01:49 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by REX_WGN View Post
I would recommend getting 15+ WRX/STI control arms. The rear bushing is sealed spherical and the "spacer" to the chassis is taller which would induce some anti-lift.
Actually it should do the opposite. 99% certain it will reduce anti lift and anti dive.
Inducing anti lift would mean the front end lifts less on acceleration.
A taller spacer, and lower rear bush location will reduce anti lift and the front will lift more on acceleration.

This is exactly the same as 10+ years ago when people installed 'Anti Lift' kits and would write a rave review about how they notice less lift on acceleration and less dive on braking..... Actually the exact opposite was true. The vehicle was lifting more and diving more. Even Whiteline would admit this is what happens in their technical sheets

How ever as Centre of Gravity changed over the years of Imprezas and also sepcifically as spring and damper technology evolved since 20 years ago, the need for high levels of anti lift and anti dive has decreased. This could be why they chose to reduce anti-dive on the newer models.
There is also more to it since this is Macpherson Strut suspension. The location of the strut changes the anti-dive as well. So I am not sure how the position of the strut has changed over the years from GC-GD-GR-GV.
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Old 06-22-2022, 10:47 AM   #7
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Yes, that's what I meant to say
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Old 06-22-2022, 01:20 PM   #8
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Hey OP, Mike from Feal here.

You've went as far as ordering a very track oriented suspension, if you're replacing the front suspension bits anyways I'd recommend looking into the Wisefab replacement knuckles:https://usa.wisefab.com/subaru-impre...op-knuckle-kit

These will pair with any OE/OE replacement arm (like the Whiteline you mentioned above) and will do a ton for geometry revision. No need to get an ALK or anything of the like with these.

Last edited by Mike_Feal; 06-22-2022 at 01:26 PM.
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Old 06-23-2022, 03:18 AM   #9
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I have had those rear lower control arms before. My suggestion is to cancel the order and grab a set of SPL rear lower arms. My whiteline arms slipped on the first AutoX I took them on and I could never get the alignment correct after that.
It seems like all of the aftermarket rear lower control arms have issues holding alignment, I was hoping since the Whitelines didn't have an external adjustment that used a locknut that they would be okay. They just came in so I'll take a closer look and see if its something I can work with. Thanks for the heads up.
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Old 06-23-2022, 03:20 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by REX_WGN View Post
I would recommend getting 15+ WRX/STI control arms. The rear bushing is sealed spherical and the "spacer" to the chassis is taller which would induce some anti-lift. You'll have to replace the studs and get the bolts to secure it to the chassis. It's something worth considering. You can find a set for about $200.
Any idea what the spacer height is? I think the Whiteline is 11mm? I thought that was pretty good. Was there something in particular about the Whiteline as far as quality or construction that is an issue?
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Old 06-23-2022, 03:26 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike_Feal View Post
Hey OP, Mike from Feal here.

You've went as far as ordering a very track oriented suspension, if you're replacing the front suspension bits anyways I'd recommend looking into the Wisefab replacement knuckles:https://usa.wisefab.com/subaru-impre...op-knuckle-kit

These will pair with any OE/OE replacement arm (like the Whiteline you mentioned above) and will do a ton for geometry revision. No need to get an ALK or anything of the like with these.
Hey Mike!

Thanks for chiming in. I just replaced the hubs so not looking forward to trying to extract those again anytime soon. The originals totally welded themselves to the backing plates so I just replaced with all new. If its a long back order on the front control arms, then I'd be more inclined to order up the knuckles, we'll see how it goes and how the alignment turns out. For now I just want to get back out on the track. BTW, the new suspension certainly looks awesome, looking forward to the first track session.
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Old 06-23-2022, 07:33 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by atbwrx View Post
It seems like all of the aftermarket rear lower control arms have issues holding alignment, I was hoping since the Whitelines didn't have an external adjustment that used a locknut that they would be okay. They just came in so I'll take a closer look and see if its something I can work with. Thanks for the heads up.
<br />
Close, but your logic is backwards. The SPL arms have a spherical bearing with a locking nut. That can't slip. The cam adjustment on my whiteline arms is what slipped. Infact it was starting to slip even before I made it to the first event. YMMV but I won't put them on another car that is used in competitive scenarios.

Last edited by xpystchrisx; 06-23-2022 at 07:41 AM.
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Old 06-23-2022, 10:08 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atbwrx View Post
Any idea what the spacer height is? I think the Whiteline is 11mm? I thought that was pretty good. Was there something in particular about the Whiteline as far as quality or construction that is an issue?
So I said spacer in quotes meaning it's kind of built into the entire bushing pivot tube. Look at this arm and the stubby sticking out of the rear bushing:



I don't have comment on the Whiteline front arms you purchased as I've never tried them or heard anything bad about them on the forums or FB groups. I have seen the rear bushing (KCA425) in person (actually selling a set) and it looks really good and has a lot of adjustment based on the spacers provided and how to use them in the instructions. Just be mindful of the fact that you may not be able to install them direct onto your WRX. Just like my Forester, it has a double-sided threaded stud to mount to chassis and the rear bushings of the front control arms. If you start the install and realize you don't have enough threads off the stud to install them, then you may have to remove the stud and get the oem bolts from the 15+ chassis.

So it was my mistake that I didn't see you already purchased the WL set as I thought you meant you were only looking into them. I recommended the oem 15+ arms because they are relatively cheap compared to the WL arms. The big benefit with the WL ones is that it provides additional positive caster in it's offset rear bushing whereas the oem 15+ arms do not. If they do, it can't be much.
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Old 06-23-2022, 10:14 AM   #14
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Quote:
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<br />
Close, but your logic is backwards. The SPL arms have a spherical bearing with a locking nut. That can't slip. The cam adjustment on my whiteline arms is what slipped. Infact it was starting to slip even before I made it to the first event. YMMV but I won't put them on another car that is used in competitive scenarios.
What am I missing? The SPC arms I have look exactly like the Whiteline ones in post #2 and that includes the camber adjustment hardware for the outer mounting point.



In fact, I think SPC makes the arms for Whiteline. I read somewhere the Whiteline arms are the same arms as SPC and even have the SPC part number stamped on them. Only diffferences are the color and the inner mounting point bushing style. Whiteline is poly, SPC is sealed spherical.
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Old 06-23-2022, 11:14 AM   #15
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What am I missing? The SPC arms I have look exactly like the Whiteline ones in post #2 and that includes the camber adjustment hardware for the outer mounting point.



In fact, I think SPC makes the arms for Whiteline. I read somewhere the Whiteline arms are the same arms as SPC and even have the SPC part number stamped on them. Only diffferences are the color and the inner mounting point bushing style. Whiteline is poly, SPC is sealed spherical.

My bad, I'm talking about SPL arms. Easy to confuse with SPC, and my apologies for not catching the confusion earlier.

https://www.splparts.com/products/re...rz-86-wrx.html

I know that $700 for a set of camber arms is a lot, but they basically cannot slip. Normally I wouldn't suggest something this expensive but in this case, I wouldn't recommend the alternatives.
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Old 06-23-2022, 12:30 PM   #16
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That clears things up and it's my fault as I saw SPL and assumed you meant SPC. These SPL arms definitely have a unique locking mechanism and these style of control arms are definitely in a different class compared to the SPC/WL/Superpro ones. I believe all of the other offerings similar to SPL - Voodoo13, ISC, etc - all have the double nut locking mechanism but SPL has that unique version.

For a daily driver, I'm going to keep the SPCs and see how they go. When I install them, I'll mark them after alignment to keep things in check. Thanks.
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Old 06-23-2022, 12:31 PM   #17
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That clears things up and it's my fault as I saw SPL and assumed you meant SPC. These SPL arms definitely have a unique locking mechanism and these style of control arms are definitely in a different class compared to the SPC/WL/Superpro ones. I believe all of the other offerings similar to SPL - Voodoo13, ISC, etc - all have the double nut locking mechanism but SPL has that unique version.

For a daily driver, I'm going to keep the SPCs and see how they go. When I install them, I'll mark them after alignment to keep things in check. Thanks.
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Old 06-23-2022, 02:54 PM   #18
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That clears things up and it's my fault as I saw SPL and assumed you meant SPC. These SPL arms definitely have a unique locking mechanism and these style of control arms are definitely in a different class compared to the SPC/WL/Superpro ones. I believe all of the other offerings similar to SPL - Voodoo13, ISC, etc - all have the double nut locking mechanism but SPL has that unique version.

For a daily driver, I'm going to keep the SPCs and see how they go. When I install them, I'll mark them after alignment to keep things in check. Thanks.

Cool. Yeah, I saw track work and got all itchy lol. Give what you have a shot and see what happens. Worst case you sell them to someone else if they don't work.
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Old 06-23-2022, 06:18 PM   #19
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The 'spacer' height or difference in bush height should be 10mm.
Subaru part number 20126FG001 is a 10mm spacer for this location on certain Subarus (foresters, possible others) with the standard (old) height bush control arm.
This means you can use the spherical GR arm and spacer for same effect as GV arm.
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Old 06-23-2022, 08:19 PM   #20
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Yes, that's correct. the 11-14 STI arms need that 10mm spacer to equal 15+ arms in terms of that stubby "spacer" height.
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Old 06-27-2022, 12:07 AM   #21
atbwrx
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Well here's the plan on the White Line rear control arms.

I'll have the alignment shop mark the rear camber plates after the alignment.

I bought some set screws, so after the alignment I'll drill and tap the camber plates and punch a dimple in the control arm, tighten with locktight, and see if they hold.

Not sure how much torque the camber plates will actually see, but hopefully this will hold them in place. These are 8mm. After taking a closer look I may go back and grab a set of 12 mmm set screws.

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Old 06-27-2022, 12:07 AM   #22
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Duplicate post (again!). Not sure what's happening, only hitting post once.
Please delete.
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Old 06-27-2022, 06:54 AM   #23
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My opinion is if you do actually experience the adjuster slipping then you would be best just to buy an ultra high strength bolt and increase torque (clamping load).

US grade 8 is approx 1034MPa tensile strength.
Metric class 10.9 1040MPa
Metric class 12.9 1220MPa

If you go to specialty bolt manufacturers you can get bolts in the 1500MPa range. So possibly 50% stronger than what is currently being used.
For example ARP bolts ARP2000 is listed at 1500MPa, and they list bolts over 1900MPa.
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Old 06-28-2022, 09:02 AM   #24
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You know what's interesting about the outer mounting point of the rear LCAs slipping is that the bushing in the knuckle is sealed spherical. So the union between this bushing and the camber hardware of the LCAs should move together and shouldn't really have any pressure or turning force to make it slip. Just something that crossed my mind and I hope it makes sense.
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