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Old 08-13-2019, 09:13 AM   #26
godfather2112
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So my problem with the M is I worry about BMW reliability issues, but at the same time the Supra is a BMW. I don't worry too much about the Vette's reliability being a GM product of course this is coming from someone who drives GM products. Speaking of a new ZL1 1LE stickers from around $60k with a, "normal" ZL1 for not much less. Too bad they're so horrible to see out of.
The M2 does come with a warranty for 4 years 50k miles. If you want a longer warranty then buy one. 0 problems to report with my M2 and I think you’ll find most don’t have any issues either.

Actually, I had one issue. The dealer had to update the infotainment system as it would lose connection to Pandora. Oh the inhumanity!
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Old 08-13-2019, 10:21 AM   #27
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So I plan of getting a C8 too but to be fair the supra with a tune and downpipe just ran an 11.48 and put down like 442whp 478tq. So other than the warranty factor both are capable of making ridiculous amounts of power. I can only imagine once shops have had time with these how they will perform.

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Old 08-13-2019, 10:44 AM   #28
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Everyone is comparing these already. Will be interesting to see which one gets recalls, has issues, etc.
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Old 08-13-2019, 11:16 AM   #29
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Holy hell, a GTR is really that expensive now? They used to be 85k brand new or less, right?
Nah, not even close. They base around $113K now, which is itself a big increase, but it's still a decent value. The NISMO is $210K, but you get 99% of the NISMO (including the engine) in the $145K Track model.

Also, lilredwagon's insinuation that there "no huge difference" between a launch-era 480hp GT-R and a current 600hp post-all-the-updates-they've-done NISMO is absurdly reductive at best.
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Old 08-13-2019, 01:16 PM   #30
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So I plan of getting a C8 too but to be fair the supra with a tune and downpipe just ran an 11.48 and put down like 442whp 478tq. So other than the warranty factor both are capable of making ridiculous amounts of power. I can only imagine once shops have had time with these how they will perform.

Quickest 2020 Toyota Supra - Tuned vs Stock MKV Supra Drag Race! - YouTube
Would you rather a modded Supra that goes as quickly as a stock corvette in a straight line, or a stock corvette?

Not trying to piss in cheerios here, but you're talking about a modded car; if quarter mile times are all that matter, drag radials will cut 2/10ths off your quarter mile time in a vette, and that doesn't throw your warranty out the window.

stock to stock the vette appears to be the better value.
modded to modded, it depends on your budget, and I suspect that power mods aren't out there for the C8 vette yet the same way they are for the bimmer engine under the hood of the supra, but they will come.

manual swap for this gen supra is here:
https://www.motor1.com/news/364746/t...l-not-factory/

TLDR version: it's a Texas shop, BMW parts bin except for the shift knob, $12k+/- ask, 30-45 day turnaround.

Last edited by Sid03SVT; 08-13-2019 at 01:27 PM.
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Old 08-13-2019, 01:26 PM   #31
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It is a stock last years V8. There are already plenty of parts for it. But whether it fits and whether it will make it over heat is another story
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Old 08-13-2019, 01:38 PM   #32
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It is a stock last years V8. There are already plenty of parts for it. But whether it fits and whether it will make it over heat is another story
I was more referring to the packaging issues you eluded to; it's not like going from C6 to C7 where it's still FMR with arguably the same space under the hood; they moved the noise maker to the back, you can slap a cam in there, swap heads, but there are a lot of issues related to doing that, cooling being a major one of them, also not sure what the threshold of the DCT is, it might grenade and/or weld it's clutches at power levels much beyond stock (I doubt it, but wouldn't be too surprised).

As new a platform as the Supra is, it's a bread and butter bimmer engine/drivetrain combo that has been in many FR applications; it's not like the ZF8 transmission is an unknown.
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Old 08-13-2019, 01:48 PM   #33
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yup, all true, but man I have to bet even GM knows this car will be messed with extensively. And also keep in mind that they have at least 2 more higher HP versions of this car coming, which tellls me the chassis should have enough cooling 'capability' to handle those with some margin. But I could be completely wrong
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Old 08-13-2019, 01:57 PM   #34
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Would you rather a modded Supra that goes as quickly as a stock corvette in a straight line, or a stock corvette?

Not trying to piss in cheerios here, but you're talking about a modded car; if quarter mile times are all that matter, drag radials will cut 2/10ths off your quarter mile time in a vette, and that doesn't throw your warranty out the window.

stock to stock the vette appears to be the better value.
modded to modded, it depends on your budget, and I suspect that power mods aren't out there for the C8 vette yet the same way they are for the bimmer engine under the hood of the supra, but they will come.

manual swap for this gen supra is here:
https://www.motor1.com/news/364746/t...l-not-factory/

TLDR version: it's a Texas shop, BMW parts bin except for the shift knob, $12k+/- ask, 30-45 day turnaround.
I would rather get the vette which is why I said I plan on getting a C8. All I'm saying is the Supra is looking to be pretty damn impressive as well.
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Old 08-13-2019, 01:58 PM   #35
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I am concerned with the heat. Being current Vette had issues. But I could see the potential benefit of design and more area around the engine to feed cool air and extract hot air existing that simply couldn’t in a slippery low front end and crammed engine bay of the current car.
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Old 08-13-2019, 02:28 PM   #36
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The M2 does come with a warranty for 4 years 50k miles. If you want a longer warranty then buy one. 0 problems to report with my M2 and I think you’ll find most don’t have any issues either.

Actually, I had one issue. The dealer had to update the infotainment system as it would lose connection to Pandora. Oh the inhumanity!
Over a year and zero issues to report for me. In general the forums are pretty quiet in regards to problems with these cars.
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Old 08-13-2019, 02:30 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by SCRAPPYDO View Post
yup, all true, but man I have to bet even GM knows this car will be messed with extensively. And also keep in mind that they have at least 2 more higher HP versions of this car coming, which tellls me the chassis should have enough cooling 'capability' to handle those with some margin. But I could be completely wrong
I have it on authority that there is quite a bit of headroom in this motor and it's capacity in this chassis.

It has run hours at speed at the track with no cooling issues as all.
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Old 08-13-2019, 02:44 PM   #38
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I like the Supra and don't consider its BMW bloodlines to be an issue. It's absurd to even think that given the high level of engineering talent at both companies.

That said, the Corvette is a game changer. There's so much value at the base level that you have to think GM is going to start jacking the price up each year.
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Old 08-13-2019, 07:47 PM   #39
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I’m taking the approach of “if it sounds to good to be true....” with the C8 as I have a feeling the price point will be short lived and the car will have a lot of teething issues. The Fiero was small scale compared to the C8 and GM botched it badly as it’s pretty rare they ever get anything right on the first try.
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Old 08-14-2019, 10:03 AM   #40
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I’m taking the approach of “if it sounds to good to be true....” with the C8 as I have a feeling the price point will be short lived and the car will have a lot of teething issues. The Fiero was small scale compared to the C8 and GM botched it badly as it’s pretty rare they ever get anything right on the first try.
What I like is the dollar figured being bantered is the lowest base model deal, which very very few will buy. Realistically it's a 70k car.
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Old 08-14-2019, 10:23 AM   #41
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You also have to consider GM discounts on the car after the initial hype. I have no doubts in my mind the ultra low advertised MSRP is for a car that doesn't have a windshield, wheels, or seats and a typically equipped car will be $70k+. However, that doesn't take in account for the typical GM model of having a stupidly high MSRP and then offering a "discount" of $15-20k at any decently high volume dealership once there's a decent supply of cars out there. That's where the bargains are had with them, not on what the sticker says.
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Old 08-14-2019, 10:44 AM   #42
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There is no comparison between the new "Supra" (POS Frankenstein econobox) and the C8, or even the C7 for that matter. The Supra is for millennials who think they're car people. Just cut to the chase - trim the moustache, put a dress on, and have mommy and daddy finance a Tesla for you instead. Yeah, disappointed Toyota didn't give us an updated LFA with a Supra badge. Would've bought it.
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Old 08-14-2019, 11:00 AM   #43
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There is no comparison between the new "Supra" (POS Frankenstein econobox) and the C8, or even the C7 for that matter. The Supra is for millennials who think they're car people. Just cut to the chase - trim the moustache, put a dress on, and have mommy and daddy finance a Tesla for you instead. Yeah, disappointed Toyota didn't give us an updated LFA with a Supra badge. Would've bought it.
The Crosstrek is for millennials who think they're outdoorsy people.
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Old 08-14-2019, 11:04 AM   #44
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The Crosstrek is for millennials who think they're outdoorsy people.
The CUV is for ANYONE who thinks they are OUTDOORSY people.
The JEEP WRANGLER is for anyone who thinks they are OFFROAD people.
The INSERT VEHICLE HERE is for anyone who thinks they are INSERT MOSTLY ACCURATE STEREOTYPE HERE people.
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Old 08-14-2019, 12:05 PM   #45
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You are not your khakis.

I get that people buy cars to wear as some kind of social signal to others, but I refuse to accept these as car enthusiasts. They are poseurs.

They do buy a lot of cars to support the industry, but their preferences are generally not the ones that make a car fun to drive.
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Old 08-14-2019, 12:10 PM   #46
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I bought a new Subaru. Thus I am automatically a Subaru enthusiast and stereotypically awesome.
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Old 08-14-2019, 12:16 PM   #47
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The Nasioc engine has a very light flywheel and wonderfully flowing heads - catless obviously.
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Old 08-14-2019, 12:57 PM   #48
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I see the Supra being sold out for the first 1-2 years (assuming economy doesn’t **** the bed). After that, I see a pretty steep decline in sales in which Toyota will have to make yearly or biyearly changes to keep sales going. It could be power / handling, a facelift, a more “hardcore” version, etc.
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Old 08-14-2019, 01:14 PM   #49
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I see the Supra being sold out for the first 1-2 years (assuming economy doesn’t **** the bed). After that, I see a pretty steep decline in sales in which Toyota will have to make yearly or biyearly changes to keep sales going. It could be power / handling, a facelift, a more “hardcore” version, etc.
And probably a price increase with every change too. I have a feeling the $50k starting price won't last long.
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Old 08-14-2019, 01:19 PM   #50
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2 seats kills this thing. YouTube content whoring will dry up as will sales. I'm all for M4 levels of performance for a lower price in a fun looking sporty coupe, but those sales will eat it when hype is gone. The hype right now is as high as it will ever be. Can't make little tweaks and get first wave buyers to buy over and over again. What is this, a Mustang? lol
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