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Old 01-09-2019, 01:27 PM   #1
trueno92
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Default School me on Carberry 4.2?

Hi All, Been playing around with flashing and got some work going on with the Carberry map.

Everytime I am running it, i notice a significant hesitation as the car gets into boost as it crests passing 0psi. It happens every time.

What I am suspecting is the timing. I had transferred a few tables over that are from my non-carberry map and seem to be working well non-carberry

MAF
WGDC
Boost Targets
AFR Targets
AVCS
Ignition Timing

I noticed the ignition timing tables have a totally different axis measurement and was wondering if anyone knew how to rework my timing values to satisfy the carberry measurements.
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Old 01-09-2019, 03:15 PM   #2
CarmelValleyWRX
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ALL the tables are different. Stock roms use load(g/rev). Cranberry uses MAP readings. So essentially none of the stock maps will work. You have to log a bunch of data and build a new set of maps.
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Old 01-09-2019, 05:10 PM   #3
trueno92
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Thanks Carmel,

Yeah I took a look at using other EJ205 maps as a base, but it seems they are specific for the USDM EJ205 and my engine is 9.5:1 compression ratio and I thought the timing should change and is having the most adverse impact.
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Old 01-11-2019, 02:40 PM   #4
jon7009
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2003 WRX Flex Fuel
EJ205 TD04L FMIC SD

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As IAT increases or decreases, engine load (mass of air charge, per revolution) changes because air/density fundamentals

so the engine load at a given pressure will be different at different temps, there isn't a way to get MAP axis to exactly reflect the principles of having load axis timing.

You can figure out the load at all the RPMxMAP points if using speed density (g/rev / psig) multiplier + g/rev offset * VE * IAT, etc. but this gives you a timing table that makes sense just for one temp/load point. Interpolating is fun, kids.

MAP axis works, but it's not preferred by me. It can however eliminate problems for engines that have load calculating issues (injector calibration problems, MAF problems, etc.)

use the definitions in romraider or figure out how to do it with ecuflash, either way, you might check into changing the axis type to load (g/rev) and then assembling a table into it.

changing the axis type does not modify the table, there is no conversion other than how the RAW data from the ROM is interpreted for the user differently (and that the ecu looks up LOAD instead of MAP)

Carberry has a bigger timing map than all other 16-bit ROMs, so you'll have to at least figure out what to do with the extra column or three and potentially extra rows, but you've already been flashing away so you must have seen that already.

Is your 9.5:1 a 2.0L of the ej20y JDM 04-07 LGT or JDM non-avcs ej205 variety, or did you swap internals for more compression?

also, base timing is essentially total timing, without other compensations
knock correction retard is kinda opposite of knock correction advance. For stock MAF roms, total timing is base timing plus (advance/16) * IAM where total timing for Carberry is base timing minus a proportional amount of KCR if IAM is less than 16. so if IAM is 12, 25% of the value of the KCR table is reduced from base timing. if IAM is 8, half the value of a given cell is the value of timing being cut from base.

add base+KCA from that style ROM to get base for carberry

do you have a tune that was working before on the original MAF ROM?
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Old 01-11-2019, 03:02 PM   #5
86Dreams
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trueno92 View Post

I noticed the ignition timing tables have a totally different axis measurement and was wondering if anyone knew how to rework my timing values to satisfy the carberry measurements.
I can help you out but I would need your rom and as many logs as you can give me to get a new table set up. PM me if youre interested
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Old 01-17-2019, 12:42 PM   #6
trueno92
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Hey guys, ok cool, ppl still read forums.. you guys READ!!

Nasioc is so dead that i think the whole world went to meets to vape and talk about fitment....

so yes, I can provide a map but the map that is working best is a non carberry map. I'd really want to look at carberry as I also have grey coil packs and want to take advantage of the longer ignition dwell times.

I think my compression ratio is actually 9:1 and i was confusing myself. Its a EJ205 but from a 2006-2007 GGA wrx. Drive by cable. it has AVCS and TGV from the factory and I can confirm AVCS is functional.

Its been -15 degrees celcius so i haven't done much driving but the car setup is:

stock intake minus snorkle
STI Dark Blue Injectors
9:1 compression
VF48
AVO silicone inlet
Catless 3" Turboback
255 walbro

its running smooth to 19psi without any hesitation or pinging on 94 octane gas, but i notice im not htting 12 afr on my wideband.. its still around 12.9 - does it matter that its -15 ambiant intake temp?

im short on logging but i can post up the map. Ive probably gone thorugh 20 revisions of it by now,
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Old 01-18-2019, 12:26 PM   #7
CarmelValleyWRX
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i can send you a map that i developed for my car

9.5:1 forged pistons

79mm stroke

JDM AVCS/stock AVCS ej205 cams max 30 advance on my map currently.

tgv delete

speed density

IAT sensor (gm fast response) in the TGV

VF48

91 octane.

might be close enough to your setup to get you going on a MAP timing map shape at least. you will need to do your own boost control because im running EWG/short DP stock 3rd cat/cat back.
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Old 01-18-2019, 12:55 PM   #8
trueno92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CarmelValleyWRX View Post
i can send you a map that i developed for my car

9.5:1 forged pistons

79mm stroke

JDM AVCS/stock AVCS ej205 cams max 30 advance on my map currently.

tgv delete

speed density

IAT sensor (gm fast response) in the TGV

VF48

91 octane.

might be close enough to your setup to get you going on a MAP timing map shape at least. you will need to do your own boost control because im running EWG/short DP stock 3rd cat/cat back.
Carmel, that would be awesome. I saw your dynoplot in the AVCS tuning thread and its impressive - no joke. I am working with the cold ambiants currently but I am still trying to hit my AFR targets as from what I can see from my WB, it doesn't look like I am hitting them - yet... so when i see you hold a solid 11AFR on your charts, it looks like i have some work to do.

i'll pm you my addy.
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Old 01-18-2019, 07:21 PM   #9
CarmelValleyWRX
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keep in mind that was my front o2 sensor on virtual dyno so it pegs low and changes based on turbine pressure. but my AFR on the WBO2 is similarly smooth though. its way easier to get the AFR smooth with SD tuning (IMO) because the table is 3D instead of the MAF being 2D.
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Old Yesterday, 02:56 PM   #10
trueno92
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Carmel, the map is great. I bumped the timing across the board 1.03x multiplier and the jdm EJ205 is really happy with the IAM 16. Keep in mind im running 94 octane, and the smoothness is noticable.


Maybe you guys can help me with this weird idle issue. THe engine once in closed loop and while coasting wants to idle at 1750 rpm until i come to full stop. Once at a stop the revs drop and settle at normal idle parameters.

I can't find any other changes to adjust anything in the map. it will idle just fine at 750-800 rpm if I am stationary... normal non-carberry map doesn't show any issues with idle.... ideas of where i should look?
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Old Yesterday, 03:37 PM   #11
CarmelValleyWRX
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well my map has quite a bit more timing near idle in the base map. it could be a delay switch between base timing table and idle timing table. also keep in mind there is an idle timing table for stopped and also one while rolling. my car hangs too but i don't mind since i have a 9lb flywheel. are you running my AVCS timing as well?

Last edited by CarmelValleyWRX; Yesterday at 04:21 PM.
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Old Yesterday, 05:56 PM   #12
trueno92
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yes, i am also running your AVCS tables, ignition dwell and injector timing tables

I checked out rolling and stationary idles, and there doesn't appear to be anything that points to keeping the revs up between shifts. I thought maybe it has to do with NTLS and i made some changes at the enable point, but it was disabled anyway.

this is really odd, and I can't figure out why it would happen..?
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