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Old 12-02-2018, 06:00 PM   #1
Flowerz
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Default Manley platinum vs Mahle 2618 ej207

Does anyone have any input on these two pistons ?

looking for 500-550whp reliably.
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Old 12-03-2018, 12:33 PM   #2
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Manley>Mahle proven time and time again
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Old 12-03-2018, 12:43 PM   #3
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Quote:
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Manley>Mahle proven time and time again
Which Mahle 2618 models? He's also talking EJ207, not EJ25.
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Old 12-03-2018, 02:04 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by Homemade WRX View Post
Which Mahle 2618 models? He's also talking EJ207, not EJ25.
I know, but between the ej205 and ej207 they will still be 92mm pistons. Because they are 2.0L engines
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Old 12-03-2018, 02:11 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WRXXXED View Post
I know, but between the ej205 and ej207 they will still be 92mm pistons. Because they are 2.0L engines
Do you know this first hand or are you regurgitating what your tuner told you again?
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Old 12-03-2018, 02:23 PM   #6
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Do you know this first hand or are you regurgitating what your tuner told you again?
Ahhhh, you got me there, im glad you remembered me. The ej20 is the 2.0L's but the 5vs7 is for stronger stock rods and 8k of revs, at least thats what ive learned so far. If you have something else to add please do. . Im bored a lot so i look at the built motor category like ever hour or so lol
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Old 12-03-2018, 08:16 PM   #7
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EJ207 and EJ205 pistons are differenct from the factory, with different combustion chambers and CR. Aftermarket pistons will undoubtedly have limited options but double check chamber volume used for advertised CR.

And again, now I'll ask, which Mahle forging do you consider to be inferior to Manley and why?
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Old 12-03-2018, 08:26 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Homemade WRX View Post
EJ207 and EJ205 pistons are differenct from the factory, with different combustion chambers and CR. Aftermarket pistons will undoubtedly have limited options but double check chamber volume used for advertised CR.

And again, now I'll ask, which Mahle forging do you consider to be inferior to Manley and why?
Im not saying they are inferior, i just personally perfer manley because there has been plenty of builds that i know of who run them to the power level he wants. Im sure manley has the CR and piston size he needs, but i know nothing about Mahle, never used them, never seen anyone use them, just a personal preference. No need to get hostile
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Old 12-03-2018, 08:29 PM   #9
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The Mahle pistons are strutted (stiffer piston for a given crown thickness), have skirt coating, graphal hard coat and anodize a top ring, as well as pull forced oiling for the wrist pin off of oil ring. Pretty nice feature tree for an out of the box piston. Again though, this is the 'box in box'.

If you a slug to put in the hole and take some abuse, the Manley has proven to be capable of that too.
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Old 12-03-2018, 08:30 PM   #10
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Im not saying they are inferior, i just personally perfer manley because there has been plenty of builds that i know of who run them to the power level he wants. Im sure manley has the CR and piston size he needs, but i know nothing about Mahle, never used them, never seen anyone use them, just a personal preference. No need to get hostile
And yeah, you did say it was inferior.

This literally means Mahle is less than Manley, and that you've seen it time and time again

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Manley>Mahle proven time and time again
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Old 12-03-2018, 08:36 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Homemade WRX View Post
And yeah, you did say it was inferior.

This literally means Mahle is less than Manley, and that you've seen it time and time again
Manley is popular for a reason 🤷🏻*♂️
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Old 12-03-2018, 11:10 PM   #12
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You need to stop giving advice. I was poking fun earlier because I’ve seen you state something several times that just flat out isn’t true, then later when called out you back track and say you heard it or read it from someone else. Now I’m going to say it’s ok to just not post and let questions go unanswered for a while instead of giving the wrong answer.

For reference I’ve raced against people who’ve used both brands of pistons. Assuming the assembly is fine and you’re not doing something stupid in the tune they’ll both last reasonably well. Too many people get caught up in having the “perfect” mix when in reality most things will work just fine if you pay attention and get clearances right.
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Old 12-04-2018, 08:59 AM   #13
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Best is to ask you machinist what he perfers
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Old 12-04-2018, 08:20 PM   #14
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He PM'ed me picture that his "tuner" (note, not engine builder) posted of an open forged, looked like 4032 piston...so you know he either wasn't making much power or doesn't know what he's doing.

If it was a 2618, he was still on the wrong forging for big power. It was also a tension failure (pin pull out). I'm wondering if PTW was set for 2618 and running a 4032. Would easily explain the failure.

Anyway, Manley's are cheap. They went out hustling crazy deals to a lot of shops and builders (me included), to get people to switch branding. They even wanted me to switch my custom rods to them for manufacturing. So unless you know the whole story, just stick to what you do know and don't make absolute claims without claims.

Long story short, if you're building your own, do your research. If you're going to a builder, ask them what they prefer. Everyone has their own reason (and luck) with varying pistons. Heck, I actually don't choose Mahle or Manley for my Subarus.

Last edited by Homemade WRX; 12-04-2018 at 08:30 PM.
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Old 12-04-2018, 08:36 PM   #15
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I used Manley graded B drop in pistons in my build.

new OEM Case halves.
Manley B pistons
Eagle H-beams
OEM 2012 Sti crank

that said, my car has ~23k miles on it with 0 issues with the Manelys. they are a bit loud on startup but when warmed up, quiet down.

YMMV. I think for that power level you will want a 2618 compared to a 4032. The Mahels are 4032 and will have a tighter PTW clearance and will last longer + be quieter, but a good knock event can crack a ringland where as a 2618 piston wont crack as easy.

Forgot to add turbo info.

I am running a rotated EFR 7163 on E85. high boost (Sport sharp) is ~500 whp. 480 wtq

I didnt measure anything (NOT RECOMMENDED) cause i had no idea what i was doing but its been 3 years and I've had no issues
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Old 12-04-2018, 08:56 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Homemade WRX View Post
He PM'ed me picture that his "tuner" (note, not engine builder) posted of an open forged, looked like 4032 piston...so you know he either wasn't making much power or doesn't know what he's doing.

If it was a 2618, he was still on the wrong forging for big power. It was also a tension failure (pin pull out). I'm wondering if PTW was set for 2618 and running a 4032. Would easily explain the failure.

Anyway, Manley's are cheap. They went out hustling crazy deals to a lot of shops and builders (me included), to get people to switch branding. They even wanted me to switch my custom rods to them for manufacturing. So unless you know the whole story, just stick to what you do know and don't make absolute claims without claims.

Long story short, if you're building your own, do your research. If you're going to a builder, ask them what they prefer. Everyone has their own reason (and luck) with varying pistons. Heck, I actually don't choose Mahle or Manley for my Subarus.
Thats was the builder of the shop just saying. He was tearing down an engine that someone else built and obviously it was a bad build. They are a very reputable subaru oriented shop on the east coast. I dont know why your fighting me on this so hard it was an honest mistake, not meaning to sly any company of orginization. I dont have experience with mahle so of course i wouldnt choose them, i have experience with manley and ive had nothing but good experiences so far (with their pistons) so im "recommending" them.
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Old 12-06-2018, 10:03 AM   #17
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I'm not fighting you. I'm just leaving the facts as they are.

Due to their push, you'll find a LOT of heavy Manley influence with the Subarus. They've had some good results.

Like with anything, you'll find people that swear by their brand of choice.
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Old 12-06-2018, 01:00 PM   #18
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I honestly dont think that one is better than the other i have seen both fail.It all comes down to the preference that you have ,or your familiarity to the product. BTW what is the difference between the 205 and the 207 pistions?
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Old 12-06-2018, 03:13 PM   #19
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I've always kind of though of manleys as not as nice. Would rather go with je, cp, cosworth, mahle. But it doesn't really matter all that much. I mean, what's more important, the specific pistons that go into the block or the assembly and clearances and rest of the parts and tuning?

And mahle is pretty good at making pistons. I've used a lot of their 4032s in street car rebuilds and 2.1 strokers.
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Old 12-06-2018, 06:04 PM   #20
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I've built two EJ257's with Mahle's, and one EJ207. I believe they were all the 4032's PowerPak models.

Quiet, and held up to VF turbo style use. All I wanted and worked when stock subaru pistons failed.

Mahle is used in several extreme OEM applications from "premium" brands. I wonder if CP would be able to play in that game...
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Old 12-06-2018, 09:31 PM   #21
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Mahle is used in several extreme OEM applications from "premium" brands. I wonder if CP would be able to play in that game...
CP-Carrillo's parent company is Pankl. When they leave the race engine world, it's only to work with Ducati, Koenigsegg, Porsche (996/997 GT3 I know), etc...
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Old 12-06-2018, 10:37 PM   #22
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My builder actually recommended the manley 2618 version with the manley I beam rods for my sleeved (and other mods) build. Same machinist/builder who machined the engine for the first six speed impreza to run 7s. The shop does very precise work though, and the machinist mentioned also does the programming for their cnc programs. I asked around, didn't go on their advice alone. A lot of the issues with noise on startup are obviously clearance related, and having your ptw very accurate is going to minimize it, but not eliminate it if you're running 2618 alloy. The 4032 versions can run tighter tolerances obviously but for power level each has its advantages. I ran JE 2618 for a few years and the cold start noise wasn't bad, not much more than the piston slap from my old ej20k. In the warmer months it was pretty much inaudible.

I still have the JE from my previous block, but that block was assembled by me and machined by a shop in Houston that was recommended by several members here. (never again) The heads were machined by another shop in Houston, they also clued me in to how the shop who did the cylinder bore machining screwed up.

Not dumping on Mahle, obviously they are a top tier brand, just giving a little input based on personal experience.

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Old 12-06-2018, 11:56 PM   #23
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Could be the builder just has a better profit margin or gets free stuff from manley.
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Old 12-07-2018, 12:24 AM   #24
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Manley at least uses total seal rings which I had pretty good luck with. I've used Mahle(4032), wiseco, manley, CP, In my own blocks. My favorites are the CP and Manley, I had the least amount of blow by with those where as the mahle's were horrible from the beginning the power pak PTWC was something like .0045 out the box, and that is what they recommended for a PTWC. had horrible compression and lots of blow by. wiseco were awesome until the wrist pin area broke.
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Old 12-07-2018, 12:27 AM   #25
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Quote:
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Could be the builder just has a better profit margin or gets free stuff from manley.
Could be either or both, or also that he feels their tolerances are consistent and he has less client issues with them. Also doesn't mean the quality isn't on par with top tier brands. The same goes for any brand, there are usually perks but that doesn't necessarily discount their quality. :shrug:

It's rare you see 2618 pistons of the brands the majority here post about, with quality issues causing problems, considering the power range some members run them to. Failure almost always gets blamed on tuning, another component failure, or abuse...at least on the forums I frequent.
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