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Old 02-02-2021, 02:33 PM   #1
cmiovino
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Default 2021 Tire Faceoff: Falken RT660 vs Yokohama A052's

Car: 2017 BRZ performance pack, 225/45/17 tire size. ~1.3* camber up front.


I've run the RE-71R's for the last three seasons. STH WRX and then bolted them on my new 2017 BRZ to run in CS (now reclassed to DS). I run approximately 20-25 events/year. I ran a set of REs out to 200 runs last year and they were damn well terrible past 150 runs (no surprise), but wanted a fresh set to start 2021 off with. Not a newbie to autocross.



A052
Pros: Most grip of all 200TW, best times by a bit, more comfortable an the RE-71R and RT660's on the street. Don't heat cycle out like the REs.

Cons: Many say they're not great for camber challenged cars. One guy in our region got 150 runs on a GS Civic with 0.6* camber, but I'm skeptical I'd get the same. $200 more. May or may not get through a 25 event calendar (~140 runs). Vaguer inputs.



RT660
Pros: Wear slightly better and would probably finish the season no problem. 95% of the grip of RE-71R's, but don't heat cycle out as quick. Better response/inputs than the Yoks.

Cons: Yoks have the edge in grip and probably overall times by a bit. Similar noise as the RE's.


Sounds like the Yoks are the 'go for broke choice for times, but also might have some added comfort for longer drives to event and the occasional Cars & Coffee.


The Falkens are basically the RE-71R replacement that have a hair less grip, but don't heat cycle out. Still a great tire and I drove them on a SSC setup car that had loads more grip than my old REs at about 175 runs at the time.


Would you chance it with the Yoks or play it safe with the Falkens?
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Old 02-02-2021, 02:54 PM   #2
subydude
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If you're not a noob to autox I would kind of expect you to know about the A052's love for camber and quick heat cycle out issues, especially when used as a DD tire.

I've driven on A052, Rival, RE71R, but not the Falkens (yet). The way they make grip varies, but given the people I know who've tested I'd run the Falken. My A052's were DONE in half the time of the other tires. This was on an EG civic with close to -4 degrees of camber as well and a 205 stretched on a 9 so no pinching or lack of camber.

Even with RWD, I wouldn't choose the A052 unless I had a lot more camber and could run a wider wheel to support the tire. I'd probably pick the Rival or RT660. If budget were key the nod goes to the Falken and if longevity were king I'd take the Rival.

All that said, The A052 will likely generate the highest grip (although it's mostly winning it through longitudinal grip) but have the shortest life. It likes wheel support and a lot of camber, but when it works it is pretty good. Just don't expect more than 50-60 runs competitively on them unless you're supporting it as noted. There's totally people who will get 100+ on a car like you note, but that doesn't mean they were competitive runs. I can totally drive 1-2 seconds off the pace and get way more runs out of my tires. Once supported I've seen upwards of 100-120 competitive runs, but they are falling off after that according to data I've seen.

Conversely, the Falken (and Rival) seem to last longer and generate grip differently. On such a low powered car I'd wager the Rival or Falken would do fine and I know for a fact the Rival is ok being pinched.
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Old 02-02-2021, 03:17 PM   #3
T-37
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Everything I've been reading says a052's will heat cycle fast.

Reading on the specs, the Falkens seem like they run slightly wide as well

I bought some Nov '19 dated RE71Rs as combined use setup until switch to an A7 dry / PS4S street/wet setup hopefully later this year.
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Old 02-02-2021, 04:22 PM   #4
subydude
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Were I running a 200TW class and money no object I'd go A052 and find the limit via data until a new set was needed. On a DS car trying for 150 runs a year, assuming I want to be competitive I'd swag it at 2 or 3 sets for a year. If I was willing to run them past their prime a bit but not truly sacrifice my season (aka, I didn't have a lot of competition or I wasn't running a PAX class) I'd guess 2 sets a year. If I was a middle pack runner and just wanted to have fun running against my buddies, 1 set.

I know a number of people who bought them and have gone back to other tires after because the juice isn't worth the squeeze. The people who do like them AND are getting ok life are generally people in SLA cars with good camber, RWD, and are managing their care between events (aka, not street driving them).
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Old 02-02-2021, 10:03 PM   #5
cmiovino
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T-37 View Post
Everything I've been reading says a052's will heat cycle fast.
Quote:
Originally Posted by subydude View Post
and quick heat cycle out issues
I've been mainly hearing they don't heat cycle out much at all actually.

The only real major negative in relations to heat cycles is after about 125 runs on the second half of a 45 second course, they're going to start getting greasy.
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Old 02-02-2021, 11:27 PM   #6
subydude
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You're not talking to the right people then.
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Old 02-27-2021, 02:51 PM   #7
pazzoduc
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A slight diversion:
The Hankook R-S4's are back in stock, in case anyone was wondering.
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Old 02-27-2021, 03:02 PM   #8
Kostamojen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pazzoduc View Post
A slight diversion:
The Hankook R-S4's are back in stock, in case anyone was wondering.
Thats good to hear. Only the RS4's, Falkens and BFG's are in the size I'm using... 245/40r15. I want to try the Falkens but the RS4's are cheaper last time I checked.
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Old 02-28-2021, 10:53 PM   #9
subydude
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Unless you're endurance racing the RS4 would not be my choice. They are great in terms of tire wear, but are off the pace by over a second on average. As a lapping tire though at track days they're fantastic.
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