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Old 01-12-2022, 10:29 PM   #1
vdubjunkie
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Default 2013 WRX ECU swap issue

My son has a 2013 WRX, and we decided it needed a replacement ECU. After purchasing one, and having it crank, but not start, he found the following video.


Basically the video shows how you can read the data from the EEPROM 93C86, and even shows a plaintext VIN in the data on the chip. The idea is that the VIN must match your car.
So, I pulled the chip from his "old" ECU and put it on the "new" ECU. However, this resulted in a security error. At this point, I stepped in and did a bit more research.
However, while the research points to the idea that you need to ensure you get both the ECU AND the immobilizer from the same car to overcome the issue we have, information is conflicting.
I'm happy to desolder that chip again, and if it gets us where we need to be, he's happy to purchase another ECU, but this time, with the immobilizer from the same car.

My question is this. Can anybody tell me definitively that this is all we'll need to get from the donor car in order for this to work, and there won't be another problem?
I looked over his video a bit better, and the ECUs he is showing as an example are from a 2007 car. While the EEPROM chip on our ECU is the same (S93C86), the data on our chip is NOT plaintext, leading me to think they may now be encrypting the data. What else has changed since 2007?

We also called our local Subaru dealer, and basically they said they could charge us at the hourly rate to try to reprogram the "new" ECU for his car, and it may or may not work. I also wonder if we could accomplish this ourselves with maybe FreeSSM.
I'm very familiar with data, but don't even yet have a means of sniffing the CAN bus, so I'm hoping somebody out there might be able to help me shorten my learning curve a bit. That said, while I would love to learn to fix all this myself, if possible, he is quite prepared to buy another ECU with the immobilizer if we can feel certain it will resolve the issue.
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Old 01-12-2022, 10:41 PM   #2
cdska
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I haven't read the eeprom from a new ecu but I highly doubt its encrypted or anything. Just copy the contents entirely from the old one and write it to the new one. You shouldn't even need to desolder the chip. If you are getting gibberish then you aren't reading the chip correctly
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Old 01-12-2022, 11:03 PM   #3
vdubjunkie
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cdska,


Thanks for taking the time to respond so quickly!



In order to read from my programmer without it complaining about voltage concerns, I had to at least lift the VCC pin. Once that was done, the adapter didn't like to hold the chip so well, so it was actually easier to just pull the chip.


I've actually got the image from both the existing and new ECU EEPROMs, and interestingly, there is very little on the new one. I would go as far as to say it could be a "blank" config or something.


I'm not going to claim to be an expert with reading data from these chips, but I tend to think the process would more likely fail than to download bad data. If you're familiar, do you have any thoughts on what could be wrong? The software I'm using is happy to use the chip "93C86(x8)@SOIC8". The chip itself reads "S93C86" on the top line, then left hand of the second line is "BD". When looking up datasheets, "S" seems to be Seiko, for a full part number of "S93C86B".



That aside, can anybody answer my most pressing question about whether we will find success with ensuring we have both the ECU AND immobilizer from the donor car? Or, might we run into yet another issue?
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Old 01-12-2022, 11:22 PM   #4
cdska
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make sure the pinout of the reader matches the chip pinout. theres nothing novel about the chip itself, maybe you mean w/rt published content on newer ecus, its just stored in the chip differently as it has a larger memory size than like a lr56 for example. 93s86 is definitely going to be the correct protocol you might need to specify the address length based on what your reader is expecting in chunks to parse with
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Old 01-13-2022, 08:22 AM   #5
vdubjunkie
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Next time I've got that chip off the board, or can power the whole board separately, I'll try seeing if I can get the data to show up plaintext.


If anybody is able to confirm for me whether an ECU with accompanying immobilizer will work, that is my most urgent need at this time.
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Old 01-14-2022, 10:46 PM   #6
Subie_
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Get the ECU, immobilizer, ignition cylinder & keys as a complete set to save yourself a headache. There's a chip (rfid ?) in the key that's tied to the system. I suppose you could pop the chip out of the "new" key and insert it into your existing key, so you don't have to swap out the ignition.

If it's no cost or effort, get all door & trunk cylinders if you can... why not? They're pretty much useless to the seller... aside from labor to pull them. It'll give you the option to do a full swap if you want to/need to.

Also, keep in mind that a locksmith might be baffled if you ever need to make a new master key if you swap the ignition. The master profile associated with your chassis won't match the "new" cylinder. I watched them do it to my Honda that I lost the keys to. There was a hidden profile/jig of sorts inside the car that they used to cut a new ignition key. It was pretty nifty, not sure if it applies to Subaru, but it appeared to be a standard locksmith thing.

Swapping the ignition is easy, simply cut 2 slots w/ a dremmel and use a flathead screwdriver - there's 2 shear bolts.

I tossed my old ignition. I wish I kept it, bc I've been using the "new" key with "new" ignition, ecu & immobilizer, but I still keep my "old" key on my chain bc the doors are keyed to to the "old" configuration I tossed - it's annoying... something to consider.

From my experience, the dealer cannot reprogram an ECU that's already been assigned a VIN. I ran into this a few years ago... they said they could, but when it came down to doing it, they and all other dealers in my area couldn't. They can only program a new, unassigned ECU.

Years ago I found a company out in Cali that claimed they could do it, but I just bought the whole assembly to avoid extra cost & hassle.

Not condoning it, but after you swap it, you'll realize you could steal any GD chassis in 5-10 mins Gone In 60 Seconds style... okay, maybe more like Gone in 300-600 Seconds

Note: re-registration at motor vehicle was super simple. They'll check your actual VIN and flag that the ECU doesn't match. I simply told them I replaced it with junkyard parts, they noted it in their system and that was it. They said it happens more than once daily and they're simply required to make note of it.

Last edited by Subie_; 01-14-2022 at 11:25 PM.
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Old 01-16-2022, 01:11 PM   #7
vdubjunkie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Subie_ View Post
Get the ECU, immobilizer, ignition cylinder & keys as a complete set to save yourself a headache. There's a chip (rfid ?) in the key that's tied to the system. I suppose you could pop the chip out of the "new" key and insert it into your existing key, so you don't have to swap out the ignition.

If it's no cost or effort, get all door & trunk cylinders if you can... why not? They're pretty much useless to the seller... aside from labor to pull them. It'll give you the option to do a full swap if you want to/need to.

Also, keep in mind that a locksmith might be baffled if you ever need to make a new master key if you swap the ignition. The master profile associated with your chassis won't match the "new" cylinder. I watched them do it to my Honda that I lost the keys to. There was a hidden profile/jig of sorts inside the car that they used to cut a new ignition key. It was pretty nifty, not sure if it applies to Subaru, but it appeared to be a standard locksmith thing.

Swapping the ignition is easy, simply cut 2 slots w/ a dremmel and use a flathead screwdriver - there's 2 shear bolts.

I tossed my old ignition. I wish I kept it, bc I've been using the "new" key with "new" ignition, ecu & immobilizer, but I still keep my "old" key on my chain bc the doors are keyed to to the "old" configuration I tossed - it's annoying... something to consider.

From my experience, the dealer cannot reprogram an ECU that's already been assigned a VIN. I ran into this a few years ago... they said they could, but when it came down to doing it, they and all other dealers in my area couldn't. They can only program a new, unassigned ECU.

Years ago I found a company out in Cali that claimed they could do it, but I just bought the whole assembly to avoid extra cost & hassle.

Not condoning it, but after you swap it, you'll realize you could steal any GD chassis in 5-10 mins Gone In 60 Seconds style... okay, maybe more like Gone in 300-600 Seconds

Note: re-registration at motor vehicle was super simple. They'll check your actual VIN and flag that the ECU doesn't match. I simply told them I replaced it with junkyard parts, they noted it in their system and that was it. They said it happens more than once daily and they're simply required to make note of it.

Thanks for the reply. It seems like you are basically saying that it will work, but are you able to verify definitively that that a 2013 will crank and ignite if we swap both the ECU and immobilizer from the same donor car?


If we do that, will I also need to swap the 93C86 chip (or at least image on the chip) to ensure the VIN of the car matches that on the ECU?
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Old 01-16-2022, 01:26 PM   #8
benflynn
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I have done this a dozen times, have a thread on it here
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Old 01-16-2022, 01:31 PM   #9
benflynn
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I pull the chip, read it, write a few spares, hot air solder the chip back on, use the spares to make extra ecu I can swapp out. I keep a cloned ecu in the car Incase I cook one during the endless reprogramming. I also keep a few spare chips with the key and vin already programmed so I donít have to pull the original again.
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Old 01-16-2022, 01:33 PM   #10
benflynn
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I use an SP200SE to read and burn and UYUE8580+ Hot air iron to remove and replace the chips.
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Old 01-17-2022, 07:05 PM   #11
vdubjunkie
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Do you have a link to your write up? I searched a while, but couldn't find it. I haven't heard of the LR5 chip yet. Is that what needs to move for the immobilizer? I had it in my mind the 93C86 has the VIN and key code.
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Old 01-17-2022, 08:19 PM   #12
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https://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?p=46686012#post46686012
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Old 01-18-2022, 09:38 AM   #13
vdubjunkie
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Oh, ok, I thought you meant there was a post where you described the process. Is all of the data that has to be cloned or moved to the "new" ECU on the 93C86 EEPROM chip, or are there two chips which must be moved? I'm hesitant to scrape the conformal coating off everything, to research what each of them are, but the only other 8 PIN SOIC chips on this board are not EEPROM chips.


I have two TPD1047 chips which seem to be a "power amplifier chip", and there's another 8 pin chip, even smaller than the 93C86, and I don't know what it is. The rest of the ICs on the board have MANY more pins, and certainly some sort of processing, not data storage.
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Old 01-18-2022, 11:31 AM   #14
benflynn
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I just pulled the sec chip, read it, burned that to mew one and soldered it in place. Iíll look at the chip I used when I get home. Toyota denso ecu have a similar process other than ot will learn the keys when replaced
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Old 01-27-2022, 10:21 PM   #15
vdubjunkie
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Trying to figure out how to move forward, and I've found an option for an exact same part # ECU with immobilizer. On the ad, it says they won't entertain return if it is not programmed with SSM3 or SSM4.

This leads me to believe that you cannot simply swap the ECU. Moving the EEPROM from the existing to new ECU did not work.

Can anybody say for certain what is required with a 2013? I'd bet it is different than say 2005, maybe even 2011. Nobody seems to talk about the year car they get working.

Our dealer wants to charge "upwards of $2k" to sell and program a new ECU. Can we buy one of these VXDIAG devices and just reprogram the system with a new ECU and immobilizer? Anybody?!
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Old 01-28-2022, 05:05 PM   #16
Alorenz7120
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Default Good question

I have an 2011 wrx with 2011 ecu. I'm trying to use a 2010 wrx EJ25 and it's wiring harness on the 2011 WRX.. It's cranking but not turning over. I wonder if this is any relation?
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Old 11-03-2022, 12:52 AM   #17
benflynn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vdubjunkie View Post
Trying to figure out how to move forward, and I've found an option for an exact same part # ECU with immobilizer. On the ad, it says they won't entertain return if it is not programmed with SSM3 or SSM4.

This leads me to believe that you cannot simply swap the ECU. Moving the EEPROM from the existing to new ECU did not work.

Can anybody say for certain what is required with a 2013? I'd bet it is different than say 2005, maybe even 2011. Nobody seems to talk about the year car they get working.

Our dealer wants to charge "upwards of $2k" to sell and program a new ECU. Can we buy one of these VXDIAG devices and just reprogram the system with a new ECU and immobilizer? Anybody?!
you didnít get it soldered down correctly, or there was an issue there originally. I have done it to a 2011 and 2012 ecu. Chip is a diff part number on the newer ecu
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