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Old 08-15-2017, 10:45 PM   #26
dan0492
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These definitions are from the COBB website for tuning and data logging definitions.

HERE: https://static.cobbtuning.com/cobbtu...ns%20Guide.pdf

"Camshaft Sw." -> Camshaft position sensor output. Value is ON with camshaft
rotation (i.e. when the engine is running).

In my Log #42, My Camshaft Sw is fluctuating ON and OFF over time. Based on the definition from COBB does this mean my Camshaft Sensor is turning off because of a weak, interrupted signal or is it functioning correctly? Also, is my Crankshaft sensor is broken because it is always in the ON position or is that function correctly because it is not fluctuating and staying in the ON position? Can i assume the Crank sensor is working because i am getting an RPM reading? Not sure what sensor picks up the RPM reading but i would assume its either Crank or Speed sensor.

"Crankshaft Sw." -> Crankshaft position sensor output. Value is ON with crankshaft
rotation (i.e. when the engine is running).

I have done tons of research on why my no spark condition is occurring and it is becoming very frustrating haha.

My next tests are to get the TGV's working again and to check the Oil Pressure sending Unit.
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Last edited by dan0492; 08-18-2017 at 10:00 AM.
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Old 08-18-2017, 10:54 PM   #27
aberger19707
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Bump, get any where with this?
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Old 08-19-2017, 03:38 PM   #28
Master467
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dan0492 View Post
These definitions are from the COBB website for tuning and data logging definitions.

HERE: https://static.cobbtuning.com/cobbtu...ns%20Guide.pdf

"Camshaft Sw." -> Camshaft position sensor output. Value is ON with camshaft
rotation (i.e. when the engine is running).

In my Log #42, My Camshaft Sw is fluctuating ON and OFF over time. Based on the definition from COBB does this mean my Camshaft Sensor is turning off because of a weak, interrupted signal or is it functioning correctly? Also, is my Crankshaft sensor is broken because it is always in the ON position or is that function correctly because it is not fluctuating and staying in the ON position? Can i assume the Crank sensor is working because i am getting an RPM reading? Not sure what sensor picks up the RPM reading but i would assume its either Crank or Speed sensor.

"Crankshaft Sw." -> Crankshaft position sensor output. Value is ON with crankshaft
rotation (i.e. when the engine is running).

I have done tons of research on why my no spark condition is occurring and it is becoming very frustrating haha.

My next tests are to get the TGV's working again and to check the Oil Pressure sending Unit.
Do you have the crank and cam sensor wires swapped?

Cam is supposed to just stay on, but is fluctuating.
Crank is supposed to fluctuate, but is staying on.

Your car HAS been completely rewired, twice, so anything could happen. Especially in the engine harness.

Also it may be giving you the cam RPM in that case, lol. 160rpm does seem slow for a starter. Shouldn't it be like 500 or something?
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Old 08-20-2017, 09:27 AM   #29
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aberger19707 - No i havent done much physically just more research. However the tuner did get back to me and was not much help. he didnt know what is normal for ON or OFF of the Crank/cam signals and didnt say much else about the other data.

The only thing i did do is trace the TGV wires from the ECU. The Right side signal wire has been out the whole time and the left is not where its supposed to be.

Master467 - I definitely do not have them swapped on the motor side at least. The engine harness is completely stock and the wires going to the ECU i have checked for continuity. They match up to where they are supposed to be on the ECU pinout.

160rpm seems right to me. It sounds completely normal during cranking and 500 rpm is just about idle speed so i think its good.
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Old 09-05-2017, 09:27 PM   #30
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LARGE UPDATE:

Took the car to ECS Performance today, great group of guys that were very helpful and professional. According to the Subaru swap Guru Paul, his best assumption is that this is a security / immobilizer issue. He was able to check if the key-immobilizer-ECU all match and then reprogram them to make sure. He confirmed my unanswered question about what the car does do if it is immobilized. For the 05 STI I was told the car will CUT SPARK IF IMMOBILIZED. Im not sure about other years but it makes sense that this is the problem if i have fuel, correct timing, the car cranks, etc...

Currently i do not have a security module or a keyless entry module. I was not aware that these were crucial to starting the car. I was always under the impression that the ECU/Immobilizer/Key and possibly BIU ALL MATCHING were the main factors for the car to start as this is what is sold together commonly. looking back on this now, not having a security module is kind of dumb and obvious that there would be a problem haha duh.

Paul informed me that the problem is most likely caused by me not having the two needed modules combined with the questionable self-done wiring of the previous owner. The car has 99-01 door cards on a 95 body style with 05 harness. In order to reset the Immobilizer on a current GD platform there is a procedure with the keyless entry to lock the car for a certain amount of time then unlock or whatever. I know there is a thread here on this i read it at one point. Because of my frankenstein car, the electric locks are not currently working so even if i had a keyless entry FOB remote, i couldnt reprogram until all the wiring for the door locks are correct. This leaves me with two options.

OPTION 1
Find an 04 STI ECU and re-pin my wiring harness. (I was told this is not a guaranteed fix) This bypasses the immobilizer issue and hopefully will bypass my keyless and security module problem. I believe it will. fingers crossed.

OR

OPTION 2
Continue with my 05 ECU, get both modules, a new 05 STI bulkhead / rear harness, new 99-01 door card harnesses (to use the plugs for the door card lock switches), and 95 door cord harnesses (to merge with the door card lock plugs and 05 bulkhead plugs). This is the route Paul suggested as i would not have to worry about the unknown wiring in the bulkhead and i would have working locks/windows.

This is where im at ... i would like to try option 1 if i can borrow a 04 sti ecu to test if it would start but im running out of time either way.

Anyone want to let me borrow your ECU? haha
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Old 09-05-2017, 10:31 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dan0492;
[B
OPTION 1[/b]
Find an 04 STI ECU and re-pin my wiring harness. (I was told this is not a guaranteed fix) This bypasses the immobilizer issue and hopefully will bypass my keyless and security module problem. I believe it will. fingers crossed.
The 04 has no immobilizer, so you should be good. I converted my 02 WRX to 04 STI ecm because of this.
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Old 09-06-2017, 03:24 PM   #32
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Yes i would like to just go this route. The best would be to test if it will start with the re-pinned harness but i dont know anyone that has an 04 sti to get the ecu. I guess i will just have to buy one.

This is what i have found so far on the subject:

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcwc View Post
A quick search seems to say any 04 ECU for 2.5L turbo engines should work, it just needs to be tuned for the new engine.

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...cu+differences
yep we just covered that bit. actually a tune will not solve the issues. 5 pins on the ECU have been swapped to prevent easy changing of the ECU. i doubt a simple tune could correct wiring of:

Vehicle speed sensor
A/C switch
Ignition switch
Test mode connector and most of all,
the fuel pump controller.

directly swapping an 04 ECU into an 05 will certainly cause it not to start.


From this thread: http://https://forums.nasioc.com/for....php?t=1976147

Are these the only required changes? Is there a thread that shows what exact pins are changed to where (e.g. B135 #22 pin to #25) or something. I know this isnt really safe information to share in the internet haha but i havent found a DIY or anything. Ill just use the ECU pinouts from NorthAustrialia.com

Last edited by dan0492; 09-06-2017 at 04:18 PM.
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Old 09-06-2017, 11:32 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Master467 View Post
No spark, with all the things you've checked, I'd put money on the ECU being screwed. Maybe it got dropped or wet, or it's immobilized.
I feel like I should get points for this.

Knew it would be something stupid, hope you get her running. At least it'll be so much more satisfying when you finally do get to drive her.
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Old 09-11-2017, 04:19 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Master467 View Post
I feel like I should get points for this.

Knew it would be something stupid, hope you get her running. At least it'll be so much more satisfying when you finally do get to drive her.
Yes you should get points haha.

I had that on the list of possibles too but i was avoiding having it towed somewhere until i was fairly confident it was that or something else wrong that i couldnt test.

Also i got the new 04 ECU, swapped the wires except for the A/C because i dont have it, and its not even priming the fuel pump. Now i have to find out why. its only 2 sets of wires to swap with each other so i didnt do this part wrong.

ON 04 STI ECU PIN-OUT DIAGRAM

1.A/C (im not using a/c at all)

2. Vehicle speed sensor (B135 - Terminal 27) - Green and Yellow wire
I swapped this with
3. Fuel Pump control unit Signal 1 (B135 - Terminal 26) - Purple and white wire

4. Ignition switch (B137 - Terminal 15) - Green and Red wire
I swapped this with
5. Test mode conector (B137 - Terminal 14) - Orange wire

Now i am stumped. The immobilized 05 ECU works fine but this one does not. Unless the pin-outs are incorrect idk what i did wrong. Maybe im missing something

Last edited by dan0492; 09-11-2017 at 05:59 PM.
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Old 09-11-2017, 09:11 PM   #35
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Well one of them IS the fuel pump control unit...

Run the AC wires for sh its and giggles.
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Old 09-12-2017, 09:57 PM   #36
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i know one has to be the fuel pump thats why its weird. I know its the purple/white wire because i cross checked it with the wiring diagram and i physically traced it to the fuel pump controller.

Im getting my ecu pinouts from NorthAustralia.com which i dont think is a USDM source. However everything worked with the 05 ECU and pinout is correct for everything else i have traced.

since i swapped the ignition and test mode connector as well i decided to try and read coeds through the OBDII port. I got NO DATA LINK which means that wiring is wrong too. I couldnt have done this wrong thats whats so confusing.

now im thinking its still a problem of the immobilizer wiring messing this up and causing the signals not to get through. I think my re-wiring of the harness to be comparable with the 04 ECU is correct. theres no way its wrong unless the pinouts im following are wrong.

I read a forum with someone doing European Domestic Market (EDM) to JDM ECU swaps, which had immobilizers since V7 and had some problems. Its in this thread.
http://https://forums.nasioc.com/for...d.php?t=723886

starting at post #9 with the best info coming from Vlad. I might try his suggestions on what wires to swap even though its following an EDM ecu. and it was a bit confusing when he described in post #13

Ok Robb,
do you have the diagram for your car?
For the JDM, if it had an immobilizer, it would be connected in B5 and B14
The Main relay without immobilizer goes to A6, with to A2
The fuel pump controllerD15 or D16
Fuel pump relay A5 or A14

In V9, they change the designation of some of the connectors. In USDM, they call D C.
So one has to translate designation each time.


***Is this true?*** is this coming from the view of translating a JDM pinout to what it should be in USDM?

Do you have the diagram of the fuel pump connection?
There is a control unit, the fuel pump connects to it.
There is a fuel pump relay and it powers the controller
There is a function signal, generated by the ECU.

I think that the ECU will not generate the function signal untill it completes the sequence with the immobilizer ECU.
Now since you're putting a non-immobilizer ecu in there, if you have the connections right, it should prime the pump right away.

Last edited by dan0492; 09-12-2017 at 10:22 PM.
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Old 09-15-2017, 12:13 AM   #37
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So i worked again today on this never ending and forever frustrating project of a car. Did a lot of research that didnt help much.

I called iWire in order to confirm the wire harness change i did was correct. They were very helpful and answered all of my questions. I described the build and what was done so far and, as i assumed, they knew what i was trying to do. So i officially have the wiring correct to run the 04 ECU, which i was 99% sure i did right, and so i asked what he might think the possibilities could be at this point. they said that its possible the ECU i got is bricked because it should not be doing that, and i agree. If the wiring is right, the immobilizer issue is no longer in the equation it should be working. However it could still be something else in the wiring.

I also contacted the previous owner who did the wiring and asked him what he was running in order to help narrow down the problem.

Previous owner said he ran:

1. 2011 wrx longblock and i assume 2011 ECU which means immobilizer, and has the CANbus system

2. He did have security and keyless entry modules installed but said that they were not require to start the motor. iWire also confirmed this is not needed for starting however im thinking that maybe they are, or at least just in my case with the custom wiring.

For me this is pointing to a broken ECU. If the pinout i followed is correct/wiring i did is correct i should at least get the fuel pump to prime, and the data link connector to work. If the ECU was working and it is still a security issue then it would do what my previous 05 STI ECU and immobilizer let me do. Which is to prime the fuel pump and to have a link to the ECU.

BTW i verified this by reverting the wiring i did and re-installing my 05 ECU. The pump primed just like before and i could read ECU codes, just like before.

I have also tried unplugging the immobilizer with the 04, unplugging the BIU with the 04 and cycling the key to the ON position 3 times in 5 seconds to reset the security. NO change.

And thanks so much for your help Master467 - not many people are responding but at least you are aiding me this process

Does anyone have any insight on what to do next im losing hope in this thing.
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Old 09-15-2017, 02:57 AM   #38
Master467
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dan0492 View Post
And thanks so much for your help Master467 - not many people are responding but at least you are aiding me this process
No problem at all man.

I just went through this last night, put an ej206 in a 04 wrx. Swapped everything down to the coolant lines on the block that are different in the twin turbo setup. Dumped it in the car, cranks, no spark. After a few hours of screwing around we found chipped teeth on the crank gear (so crank sensor wasn't getting a good reading). Swapped the metal cam gear while we had timing apart. Starts, runs, sputters (like timing is off, which is what I assume is because we just redid timing) and has a 3500 rpm revlimiter, so it must be in limp mode. Swapped cam sensor and issue persists.

Moral is, swaps are very difficult and can take forever to get right. Wiring is tricky, and you seem to have bought into a wiring nightmare.

OBDII not responding would tell me the new ECU is dead. There's really no other explanation, especially when you can plug the old one back in and it works, that eliminates bad grounds and weird wiring issues. All I can tell you is to try another one. Good luck man, 04 sti ecu's are the most sought after. Not sure where you are but I know a guy who may have one in Wisconsin, he's a kid who works at a junkyard that buys crashed imports and parts them out. PM me and I'll send you his facebook, he's willing to negotiate on price and ship.
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Old 09-15-2017, 02:31 PM   #39
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Yes i know these swaps are always difficult and its never fun when your not making any progress. I called the shop i bought the 04 ECU from which is 541 motorsports in Oregon. He told me that he knows its a good ECU because he pulled it from a running car before they parted it out. Hes not saying its not impossible that its bricked but he knows it worked before. He was very knowledgeable and has experience with swaps. I always appreciate when someone is willing to work through the problem with me. I am also extremely lucky i bought the ECU through them as they accept returns, which is unheard of with electrical parts. I know these are hard to come by so i might keep it a little longer.

He suggested i use a wrx ecu that is also without the immobilizer to rule out the ECU. I might try that because all i have to do is pay return shipping. Im not sure how this will work as the early wrx have DBC not DBW, 2.0L not 2.5 and many other differences. This would be just for a test to see if the motor will run but idk if its possible.

If this doesn't work then im over it. Ill do what i should have done right from the beginning and get the harness done by iWire or something. I was just trying to save like a grand haha

Also just found this for triple confirmation that i did this right
http://https://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.phpt=1521617

Post #7

BUMP - OK Another update. Since I have not been able to find the information I am looking for... I found an excellent link for pinouts on ecus dating back to 1991 models to current 06/07 models. Check this link: http://www.northursalia.com/modifica...ng/wiring.html

What I did was compare the diagram from 2005 STi and 2004 STi to find the pinout differences. It boils down to these pins from the 05 STi Harness to the 04 STi ECU:

B135 PIN 26- Vehicle speed signal, switch to PIN 27
B137 PIN 17- A/C Switch, switch to PIN 16
B137 PIN 14- Ignition Switch, switch to PIN 15
B137 PIN 15- Test mode connector, switch to PIN 14
B135 PIN 27- Fuel Pump Control Unit, switch to PIN 26

With a 2005 STi harness, the 2004 STi ECU is plug and play as long as you switch these pins. Now, you have avoided having to use the immobilizer and pertaining parts.

Last edited by dan0492; 09-19-2017 at 09:16 PM.
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Old 09-19-2017, 09:34 PM   #40
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IT RUNS!!!!


It has finally come to life and im so pumped. The 04 ECU was good i just made a stupid mistake.

Master467 you deserve a medal for your efforts.
Quote:
Run the AC wires for sh its and giggles.
werent even trying and got the right answer.

How it happened: So i sold a bumper beam from my old 04 wrx i had and the buyer had done swaps before so as we were talking about the car he suggested i ask Zephyr who i have see on the forums before and i knew he did wiring merges. So i contacted him and went over what i had done to change the harness pins to the 04 and i said i didnt do the A/C. He said thats fine but did i do the main relay switch. I didnt know there was one as the pinouts dont show it. Apparently the wire you switch the A/C with is the main relay as the car wont do anything without that, obviously.

On the 04 STI ECU pinout:

B137 Pin 16 - A/C switch

On the 05 STI ECU pinout:

B137 Pin 17 - A/C switch

So naturally im thinking that swapping these will just swap the A/C .... WRONG. The pin you switch the A/C with is the main relay. That was the problem. I looked through the whole pinout again and nowhere does it say Main relay -B137 Pin 17 for the 04 pinout or -Pin 16 for the 05 pinout.

Thanks to Zephyr, i now have a running car. And good thing i decided not to try the suggestion from the subie master - master467 or i would have had it done a couple days ago and you would have gotten the full credit for the fix haha. Such is life.

Last edited by dan0492; 09-19-2017 at 09:40 PM.
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Old 09-19-2017, 10:30 PM   #41
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Now that the car is running there are other problems i have to fix so that it is roadworthy.

The car idles but not the best. When i took the car to ECS the tech said i had the wrong plugs. They were for a NA 2.5 motor. Damn do i hate autozone and all that work there, they gave me the wrong plugs.

So when i put the car in gear and let the clutch out to go the car starts to die. If i return to neutral and maybe add a little gas the car is fine. When i rev in neutral its fine. I didnt do any crazy revs because i knew i had the wrong plugs, however, when the car comes down from a small rev it goes down to about 500 rpm, almost at the 0 mark on the tak ... just about dies, then catches itself and returns to idle. So i thought it was the plugs with the incorrect gapping.

TODAY just got new NGK's today and installed them. Same problem, almost dies when the engine is returning to idle/rough idle. From what i have briefly read it could be:

1. Bad Plugs - ruled out
2. vacuum leaks
3. MAF - I cleaned with maf cleaner when i removed the intake to put in new plugs
4. Idle control valve dirty - Do STI's have these?
5. I dont have an o2 sensor installed maybe its that? - i have a code for this. im going to get one tomorrow. My this i mean the one after the turbo and cat, i have the one in the header installed, i think this is called EGT sensor?
6. Fuel filter dirty - i have one in the tank but also have an inline (like a wrx)
7. Problem with my deleted evap system. - i have the line that normally is supposed to go to the charcoal box venting to atmosphere
8. Problem with fuel pressure - Code P1400 - this is common with P0447 so maybe unrelated.
9. Throttle body dirty

Current CEL codes:
P0447 - Evaporative emission control system vent control low input
P0037 - o2 sensor
P1400 - Fuel Pressure control solenoid valve circuit low

I have also been disconnecting the battery a lot when i was swapping ECU's. I also disconnected when i swapped plugs, i feel like i take the battery off too much. i probly dont have to do this for everything but i feel better when i know theres no power. Maybe i need to let the car learn a bit as i havent driven it out of my driveway yet.

Things that arent stock/current setup:

Walboro 255
Deleted Evap system
Completely stock STI motor. i havent removed anything
Previous owner ran speed density, i reverted this back to stock MAF

Im leaning towards the o2 sensor because the engine is basically new. It got a new shortblock with rebuilt heads. Something could be dirty but i think its the sensor or a vacuum leak.

Other problems:

The fans run constantly even with the key in the ON position, i havent researched this but its not the worst problem.

The clutch is making a funny sound in the middle of the depression. SO clutch OUT is fine, while pressing in the middle of the stroke i hear what sounds like a broom sweeping noise. then continuing to full depression the noise goes away. I bought a almost new low miles used clutch (about 500 mi) but this is maybe just the new parts meshing together.

If anyone has any info on my problems it would be great ... i will be doing more testing tomorrow

Last edited by dan0492; 09-19-2017 at 11:08 PM.
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Old 09-20-2017, 09:48 PM   #42
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So the problem appeared to be #9 I had a dirty throttle body. It didnt look super dirty but it was fairly dirty so after cleaning and re-installing it idled much better and didnt studder or almost stall when returning to idle speed.

+1 to me for finally fixing a problem myself haha
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Old 09-20-2017, 11:47 PM   #43
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Hey bud, this is Joe i came up with Jon to pick up that beam. Glad you got it sorted! Cant wait to see it all done, that really was a mess of a harness so its a good thing it was just a pin swap. I HATE trying to sort through other peoples merging mess lol

The idle issues could be from the ECU re-learning, i usually let them idle for a little while and let the computer sort out what it needs.

Current CEL codes:
P0447 - Could be a wiring issue as well, but this shouldnt affect anything
P0037 - This is a rear o2 code, it wont affect anything to drive the car, you can flash this out
P1400 - Check the pins on this one again, more than likely thats the issue
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Old 09-22-2017, 05:13 AM   #44
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Great to hear that she's running! I'll take my +2 for the thread! We need a video or at least some pics. Did you drive it yet?
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Old 09-28-2017, 08:41 PM   #45
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Hey Joe, yea im pumped its working now and since then i have been fixing all the little things that have come up. The codes are normal i think because the EVAP system has been deleted and i have no rear 02 sensor. Upon researching i think its common to have 0447 and 1400 together. Im going to wait until i get back from Germany next year and just get a tune and have them delete the codes.

The car has been running great and it seems healthy. i have to get my friend over to take some logs so i can see if anything is amiss.

Master467 yes i have to post some pics definitely. I have been driving and fixing to get everything working well. OMG is she fast and still on a stock motor. Im not going to do anything crazy, tryin to keep it reliable. and she sticks in the corners too. my first time experiencing coilovers, thick swaybars, and a car that weighs around 2800lbs so its a blast to drive.
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Old 09-29-2017, 12:06 AM   #46
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Old 09-29-2017, 01:31 AM   #47
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Wow, looks really fun. And solid for a 22 year old car.
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Old 10-12-2017, 09:22 PM   #48
hopefullynotrice01
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Tough part will be the electrical
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Old 12-08-2017, 06:58 PM   #49
Master467
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How's she running?
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Old 12-08-2017, 08:10 PM   #50
bugeyebreezy97
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I had a similar problem. Check oil, coolant, make sure crankshaft sensor and camshaft position sensor are not shot.. I changed starter alternator and battery... it could be something with swap do you have accessport?
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