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Old 12-29-2016, 06:19 AM   #26
KillerBMotorsport
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harey View Post
I have also had issues with AOS's returning milky yellow gunk into the sump.
Here's a post from our FB page on the subject...

It's a topic of conversation we see pop up in forums and Facebook groups regarding PCV system goo and the concern with how it's dangerous. We had posted this earlier in the year but it's still relevant information.

The photo is from my 2012 STi with >60k miles, stock at the time, and 60% of the miles are from a 6 mile commute to work every day.

It's funny how a few pics and some disgust can grow into a farce. Not picking on anyone specifically here, this internet folklore goes back to the beginning of car forums and the ease of posting digital images. The misinformation has become so prominent, some product marketing has even used it as part of their marketing campaign; protect your engine from harmful 'goo'! I recommend avoid such product suppliers as they are either preying on fear, or don't understand the process their own product is involved in.

The 'goo' as it's often described, is nothing more than a byproduct of internal combustion engines. It's produced by the engine and is EVERYWHERE within it. It also accumulates to a level on EVERYTHING inside the engine. This happens no matter what catch can or A/O separator (or combination) you may have on your car. Surfaces exposed to cold (like the oil fill tube pic included here) will accumulate it faster, but the accumulation is more based on driving conditions and environment (how far you commute, what the car is used for, etc..) than anything else. In fact, any part of the PCV system that is away from heat (metal surfaces off the engine like the PCV crossover lines, PCV lines and even lines running your can/separator will accumulate it. The more non-hot stuff you add, the more it will accumulate in those areas. On the internals, or with can's separators in general, heated or not, the hotter the engine (operational and environmental), the less goo will accumulate on surfaces. That does not mean it's not there.

Another not so well known fact is that this 'goo' is not detrimental to the engine... at all! It's been in engines for over 100 years.

Come to think of it... the goo can be detrimental. Under just the right conditions, it can accumulate to a level that can inhibit flow through the plumbing. Keep in mind you need to have a very specific set of conditions, and it's VERY rare. I've mostly seen it on stock cars (Subaru and non-Subaru), but I'd think adding a can or separator and increasing that number and length of lines susceptible to clogging, would be a step in the wrong direction if you were trying to avoid it. Then again, if you're the kind of guy to has installed one of these devices, you're probably pretty in touch with your car, keeping up with maintenance, checking the condition of things, etc. so likely a moot point.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Harey View Post
I then fitted the mishimoto dual catch cans on my fa20. They have not caught a drop of oil in almost 20k miles.
Why haven't you questioned the functionality of the unit? Every engine produces blow-by gasses that contain everything from soot, fuel hydrocarbons, water, oil, etc.... If there is nothing in there, it's really one of three things: 1) You have a miracle engine as never seen before by mankind. 2) The unit does not perform as marketed. 3) Something is wrong with the installation.
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Old 12-29-2016, 10:26 AM   #27
CGumina
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I have the Mishimoto dual catch can setup on my car, and have been pleased with it. The left hand can (PCV/Turbo lines) have caught a fair amount of moisture and roughly a teaspoon of oil since being on there, the other side is almost always dry. Probably overkill for stock car, but I have a shorter drive to work (~10 miles), and really didn't want moisture getting worked into the system during winter.

My only gripe: plastic fittings to get into the cans. Why oh why is a $300 catch can setup being shipped with plastic fittings. I have brass fittings that will be making their way into the car when I have time.
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Old 12-29-2016, 02:45 PM   #28
Harey
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So you create more goo by running an aos or catch can due to the longer lines. One returns the goo to the engine and one does not.
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Old 12-29-2016, 03:45 PM   #29
KillerBMotorsport
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harey View Post
So you create more goo by running an aos or catch can due to the longer lines. One returns the goo to the engine and one does not.
Neither creates goo, it's always there. It's everywhere in your engine. There is no detrimental effect, unless it accumulates to the point of clogging a line, which it can do on an OEM setup, heated aftermarket units, and non-heated units. What it really comes down to is keeping up with appropriate amount of maintenance for your setup and driving conditions.
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Old 12-29-2016, 05:37 PM   #30
lowbee
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CGumina View Post
I have the Mishimoto dual catch can setup on my car, and have been pleased with it.......really didn't want moisture getting worked into the system during winter.
How many winters have you gone through with the Mishimoto catch cans ? Do you park outdoor all the time ?

I like the KillerB unit but one thing holding me back is that the KillerB AOS is not heated which (to me) means there is a good chance condensation will form inside the unit (and if not drain properly) to cause freezing then block air passage. I have read horror stories about freezing AOS getting oil into the turbo due to build-up crankcase pressure.

@KillerBMOtorsport Can you talk about how you see your unit perform in extreme cold weather and why it won't freeze up ?

Does the oil drain back via the crankcase vent in your unit ?
What is KillerB's take on the lack of fresh air exchange that used to be facilitated by PCV and it is now removed ?
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Old 12-29-2016, 06:09 PM   #31
gn4rwhals
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Anyone got an install guide on the Killer B unit?
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Old 12-29-2016, 07:20 PM   #32
DrJibletz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dev6565 View Post
Sooperwrx12 +1 for mentioning the Radium Engineering unit, I didn't even know it existed and took a few minutes to look into it. It looks like a very high quality unit but it seems like the price point just isn't there to make it competitive.
I run the Radium Engineering AOS as well, would highly recommend it. Not the cheapest option, but it's a gorgeous piece and it comes as a combo with the master cylinder brace.


Last edited by DrJibletz; 12-29-2016 at 07:26 PM.
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Old 12-29-2016, 09:24 PM   #33
KillerBMotorsport
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lowbee View Post
@KillerBMOtorsport Can you talk about how you see your unit perform in extreme cold weather and why it won't freeze up ?
Well I can say this much, no one makes a unit with heated lines, and if there's going to be a clog... it's there.

From the units we've had in use through a Virginia winter, there's been no issues. Not even enough build up to be anywhere near concerned with the unit's or the PCV system's performance. Does this translate into the same kind of operation in Canada? Probably not, but the unit is very easy to clean if need be, in less than 10 minutes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lowbee View Post
Does the oil drain back via the crankcase vent in your unit ?
Yes

Quote:
Originally Posted by lowbee View Post
What is KillerB's take on the lack of fresh air exchange that used to be facilitated by PCV and it is now removed ?
For idle emissions beneficial, but from a performance perspective, useless since you're pulling vacuum on the crankcase (or at least we are with our unit).

Quote:
Originally Posted by gn4rwhals View Post
Anyone got an install guide on the Killer B unit?
It's pretty straight forward. Vent lines to the appropriately sized inlet ports on the separator. Tee goes on the blocks crankcase vent with the small line going to the drain. Outlet port to the turbo inlet.
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Old 12-31-2016, 04:08 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by PERRIN_Thomas View Post
.....We should have one for the new cars here in a few months
Is that just a different mounting / hose kit for the FA ? Or is the AOS an updated design different from the AOS for the EJ series ? If it is a different design, can you talk about what's new ?
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Old 01-04-2017, 01:39 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lowbee View Post
Is that just a different mounting / hose kit for the FA ? Or is the AOS an updated design different from the AOS for the EJ series ? If it is a different design, can you talk about what's new ?
It is going to be very similar to the EJ design, the can will look a little different along with new lines and different fittings to accommodate the FA motor.
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Old 01-24-2018, 11:13 AM   #36
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I have read this whole thread and multiple others so don’t be playing the search form card !

I know the benefits of both a Catch Can & an AOS, as I have a 850WHP Evo with a Catch Can set up. My question is I live in Colorado Springs and my Subaru is my daily driver. I messaged Radium Engineering inquiring about what option would be better for the High-altitude, Colder Climate I live in. This was Raidum’s reply to me : “ If you do a lot of driving at sub-freezing temperatures, then you might want to avoid the AOS because it allows water vapor to travel through the system. This vapor can freeze and clog hoses if temperatures are low enough”. Given I do drive this car below 32° Maybe 30-40 days a year, what would you all recommend the direction I go?
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Old 01-24-2018, 11:41 AM   #37
KillerBMotorsport
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Originally Posted by Evoballer View Post
“ If you do a lot of driving at sub-freezing temperatures, then you might want to avoid the AOS because it allows water vapor to travel through the system. This vapor can freeze and clog hoses if temperatures are low enough”. Given I do drive this car below 32° Maybe 30-40 days a year, what would you all recommend the direction I go?
Then you might as well put filters on every vent if you're worried about accumulation. The bottom line is PCV lines; stock OEM, aftermarket or otherwise, ALL require inspection and periodic replacement. This is even outlined in the factory service manual. Cold climates are most susceptible since moisture can freeze faster, especially when the car is only driven short distance and not fully run up to temperature. Heated, not heated, makes no difference in regards to the lines as well.

I recommend talking to some shops in cold climates for recommendations, as they deal with this issue on a regular basis.
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Old 01-24-2018, 12:39 PM   #38
DonDonDon
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AOS is definitely necessary on these cars. LSPI is a big factor in our motors dying through mega detonation and it happens due to the oil droplets that get into the combustion chambers. An AOS or catch can will help remedy this, but it is a big added expense depending on what you get.

I have an IAG Street AOS. Got it on sale for $377 shipped. Got a quote to install which takes roughly 4 hours.

Check out the Last Human's Garage on YouTube where he does an update after installing the IAG AOS. He used to have oil build up on his intercooler which eventually gets into your intake manifold but after the install it was bone dry.

I went through a lot of logs and revisions with Ron at Phatbotti and he wanted WOT starting from 2K RPM in 3rd. Most if not all LSPI happens in the lower RPM range. With the IAG AOS installed I never got any knock, not even the 1.41, with WOT from 1900 to 2000 RPM.

Don't flame me guys but I was super worried about LSPI at one point and read a bunch of articles on how oil companies are trying to design their oils to resist LSPI in these small boosted engines. This IAG AOS gives me peace of mind as I get tuned for higher boost levels and E50 which will cause even more blow by.
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Old 09-17-2018, 11:42 AM   #39
Naterade77
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Hello folks. Just got a 2018 WRX. Now I’m all paranoid abokt pre ignition. As a general rule, keep out of heavy boost below 3k rpm? Can anyone offer a good guideline as to the best way to have some fun but not risk LSPI? I also need to train the wife, cause the deal was we HAD to share it. Lol
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Old 09-17-2018, 03:07 PM   #40
killadawg
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I've been running the IAG comp AOS for 3 1/2 years on a stage 3+ and lived 3 of those years in the NE with winters hitting -35 in winter and 102+ in the summer time. I did tons of short city drives, long hauls, hard AutoX etc.. I did an upgrade to my intake tract this last week and realized that my intake tract is like new!! no moisture, no gunk etc.. seems to have been doing its work!! yes mine is VTA so not legal but I drive in Mexico.. right!!.. Pre-detonation I don't have much of, yet I did upgrade quite a few parts to say the least

https://wheelwell.com/killadawg-09-1...41d10fa57c83de

your OCI will be the most critical part! maintenance goes a long way
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Old 09-17-2018, 06:40 PM   #41
andrewkpt
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all im gonna say is ..AOS work in my opinion. i had a IAG and it worked well , and i noticed a slight benefit from using it . i only got this after starting to build my motor slowly with bolt ons , and then after a block swap. i think they are worth it imo
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Old 09-17-2018, 06:57 PM   #42
YungBoba
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Naterade77 View Post
Hello folks. Just got a 2018 WRX. Now I’m all paranoid abokt pre ignition. As a general rule, keep out of heavy boost below 3k rpm? Can anyone offer a good guideline as to the best way to have some fun but not risk LSPI? I also need to train the wife, cause the deal was we HAD to share it. Lol
Keep out of high boost at low RPMs. Don't lug the engine; I usually try to stay at least at 2.5K or above. Downshift a gear or two if you need to pass on the freeway. Basically use your common sense and don't floor it in 6th gear every day and you'll be good to go.
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Old 09-18-2018, 12:23 PM   #43
Naterade77
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Originally Posted by YungBoba View Post
Keep out of high boost at low RPMs. Don't lug the engine; I usually try to stay at least at 2.5K or above. Downshift a gear or two if you need to pass on the freeway. Basically use your common sense and don't floor it in 6th gear every day and you'll be good to go.
Thanks for the advise!!
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