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Old 05-05-2016, 08:23 PM   #26
KManZ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrsaturn7085 View Post
Yes, the 2015 has a different SAS. What I'm telling you is that the GR-series cars used the same exact SAS regardless of what rack was factory installed (this includes the RHD Spec C 13:1 rack).

The VDC module could be (and probably was) a different part number. Whether or not a JDM VDC will solve your problems (or even function with USDM wiring) is up in the air, but I'm just telling you is that the SAS is definitely the wrong path to go down in trying to resolve this.

So far, I'm finding only a few part numbers for this:

27596FG020 (2008-2009 STI inc. JDM)
27596FG090 -> 27596FG091 (2010+ STI inc. JDM)

27596FG060 JDM GRB w/EJ257

Unfortunately, my resources for parts no. lookup past 2010 aren't the greatest... and this is really the time frame I'd need to verify these things due to the Spec C coming out that year.
Ahhhh, I see what you are saying now. I didn't know the Spec C for this gen had a 13:1, so that explains my confusion.

The VDC module = $$$$. Forget that path as well, I'd rather just deal with it, as it's not that big of a deal.
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Old 05-05-2016, 11:31 PM   #27
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I have a friend who works at Subaru he said to get a Subaru dealer to re calibrate of the sensor to 0 after an allignment. They can do this by hooking it up to a computer. Hopefully this fixes the issue.
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Old 05-05-2016, 11:55 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by obsessionz View Post
I have a friend who works at Subaru he said to get a Subaru dealer to re calibrate of the sensor to 0 after an allignment. They can do this by hooking it up to a computer. Hopefully this fixes the issue.
This might be the key right there. I can tell you my alignment was done at Subaru.
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Old 05-06-2016, 04:40 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by obsessionz View Post
I have a friend who works at Subaru he said to get a Subaru dealer to re calibrate of the sensor to 0 after an allignment. They can do this by hooking it up to a computer. Hopefully this fixes the issue.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noximus View Post
This might be the key right there. I can tell you my alignment was done at Subaru.
I'm leaving work early today, might try to stop by dealer on the way home and see what they say. No need to tell them I have a '15 rack, but will say that car/VDC has been acting funny since alignment, wondering if there was something that needs recalibration

EDIT: came across a thread where someone reset their SAS. This would totally make sense because if it isn't reset you'll have erroneous SAS data sent to the VDC, which could be causing this issue. It can get knocked off center for various reasons; for example: a major wheel alignment after suspension work, steering rack install, steering rack bushings install, steering wheel install (all stuff that I have done )

Just need to see if it is a simple software reset using the SSM, or does it manually need to be centered it as well (like in thread linked below).

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...57&postcount=9

Last edited by KManZ; 05-06-2016 at 07:05 AM.
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Old 05-06-2016, 09:00 AM   #30
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KManZ let me know how you go with Subaru and getting the sensor realigned to 0.

Hopefully this fixes the issue.
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Old 05-06-2016, 12:19 PM   #31
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You do not need to go to Subaru to reset the SAS to zero. The procedure is incredibly easy, and outlined in the FSM. If you follow the following procedure and your steering wheel is straight after you get an alignment (at ANY alignment shop), you should be good to go.

Follow the FSM procedure for steering rack replacement, and don't skip ANY steps - the important one here being "16) Align the center position of the roll connector".
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Old 05-06-2016, 01:36 PM   #32
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Just finished at AndrewTech, and they said that the VDC was throwing a code indicating the SAS was out of spec by 4-some degrees. So, it has been reset, and I'm driving around trying to replicate the issue, but thanks to the torrential downpour here the right opportunity hasn't presented itself.

EDIT: code was C0071.

Last edited by KManZ; 05-06-2016 at 07:17 PM.
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Old 05-06-2016, 04:36 PM   #33
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Hopefully this fixes it!! Keep us all posted. I have a good feeling about it.
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Old 05-06-2016, 07:21 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KManZ View Post
Just finished at AndrewTech, and they said that the VDC was throwing a code indicating the SAS was out of spec by 4-some degrees. So, it has been reset, and I'm driving around trying to replicate the issue, but thanks to the torrential downpour here the right opportunity hasn't presented itself.

EDIT: code was C0071.
Thanks. There's no way to tell if there's a code without hooking up the subaru monitor?
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Old 05-06-2016, 09:56 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wobbletop View Post
Thanks. There's no way to tell if there's a code without hooking up the subaru monitor?

Unfortunately, as far as I know, all ABS/VDC/TC/Rear diff codes can only be read via the SSM.
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Old 05-06-2016, 10:32 PM   #36
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FreeSSM works for the GD-series cars, but I haven't gotten any confirmation on whether it will work with the 2008+ stuff. I've *heard* you can, but the cable costs about 10x more...
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Old 05-06-2016, 10:44 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrsaturn7085 View Post
FreeSSM works for the GD-series cars, but I haven't gotten any confirmation on whether it will work with the 2008+ stuff. I've *heard* you can, but the cable costs about 10x more...
How much more? More expensive than a Tactrix? If you have a link to it, I'd be interested to look into it. I know I can sell the cable locally if it ends that it doesn't work on the GR.
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Old 05-08-2016, 03:41 AM   #38
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Any updates KManZ?
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Old 05-09-2016, 06:42 AM   #39
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I highly recommend that anyone w/ the '15 rack who is experiencing issues, if they haven't already, have the steering angle sensor checked/recalibrated as one of the first troubleshooting steps.

Quote:
Originally Posted by obsessionz View Post
Any updates KManZ?
After the adjustment on Friday, I can report that the car drives pretty much identical. VDC comes on during throttle application during certain corner maneuvers. I'll have to take the car back in and have them see if any codes popped up in order to verify that nothing is going on; at the same time, I'm looking into what constitutes "normal" VDC operation, and whether or not my actions are inducing the behavior.

To reiterate, the VDC is only stepping in (cutting engine power) during heavier throttle application post-mid corner, and from some reading I am starting to suspect that the VDC might be more "nanny-ish" than I first expected.
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Old 05-09-2016, 07:23 PM   #40
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I'll be happy to get a hold of this. Then I wouldn't even notice the annoyance.

Start the car and start driving. It's when you forget to push the button of the traction control to turn it off and take a corner and the car starts holding back.

See below link? Anyone know where I could buy this part?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=95DbFA77hmc
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Old 05-13-2016, 08:40 AM   #41
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Any updates or fixes with this yet guys?
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Old 05-17-2016, 09:43 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by obsessionz View Post
I'll be happy to get a hold of this. Then I wouldn't even notice the annoyance.

Start the car and start driving. It's when you forget to push the button of the traction control to turn it off and take a corner and the car starts holding back.

See below link? Anyone know where I could buy this part?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=95DbFA77hmc
http://settingsaver.com/

I'm surprised this product isn't more popular. I got one from the guy when he first introduced it on this forum. I'm not sure if he's still making them.
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Old 05-18-2016, 01:45 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lupohki View Post
http://settingsaver.com/

I'm surprised this product isn't more popular. I got one from the guy when he first introduced it on this forum. I'm not sure if he's still making them.
It's not popular because he stopped making them. If you're lucky like I am to have found one, it's worth a lot of money now.
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Old 06-15-2016, 08:59 AM   #44
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Any news on this front? KManZ, others who experienced issues?

I'm highly considering swapping out my '11 WRX steering rack for the 2015 STI rack, however, I don't want to introduce unsolvable issues (I've been following this thread and the one on iwsti). I am perplexed as to why some cars don't have issues while others do.

Who here has performed the '15 STI rack swap and what year is your car?
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Old 08-27-2016, 08:24 PM   #45
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Anyone completely solved the issue yet? I would like to get it sorted without having to turn off traction control everytime?

Thanks
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Old 09-02-2016, 09:53 AM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by obsessionz View Post
Anyone completely solved the issue yet? I would like to get it sorted without having to turn off traction control everytime?
Thanks

Sorry, I haven't solved it.


I think that the VDC on the GR is not properly designed.


Throttle Limiting
-------------------
The VDC will limit the throttle while car is turning, even though no traction loss is occuring.


Individual wheel braking
-----------------------------
If in a turn, and a wheel experiences the slightest inconsequential slide due to local conditions, the brakes will stab on which will cause the car to drive straight on and hence interfere with directional control.


Oil Spill over road
----------------------
When you do lose traction (in your GR) , where will the VDC send you ?
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Old 09-29-2016, 05:57 PM   #47
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Any ideas yet I'm having the same issue in my 2011 forester after swapping in the 2015 rack? I was told that swapping in a steering angle sensor for a 2015-2017 model Subaru would correct the issue but would like to see evidence before dropping $300 on a part.
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Old 12-15-2016, 05:45 AM   #48
obsessionz
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Hey guys anyone tried updating the steering angle sensor to the 2015/2016 sti in their GR?
Or solved this problem another way. I'm still turning traction control off every day. Getting tiring lol.

Thanks.
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Old 12-15-2016, 11:31 AM   #49
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Have been watching this thread closely as I want to install the 15 rack as well. Following the issue of the VDC has me wondering. I think KManZ is on to something with this statement.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KManZ View Post
My assumption though, is that if the steering angle sensor is being fooled by the shorter '15 steering ratio, VDC thinks that the wheels are pointed in a super tight turn but the car is still moving forward... aka, it thinks the car is sliding while trying to make a turn.
My take on it is this. The SAS output is in degrees, it is tied to the Yaw Rate & G sensors. Since you have less physical steering input with the faster rack, the SAS is reading less degrees than I think the YRS & GS are experiencing. i.e. Those sensors are feeling a tight turn happening but SAS is saying no not really therefore the VDCCM ECU thinks "oh crap we're having an understeer event" and reacts to correct giving your the intrusive VDC reaction. This reaction by the VDC is probably dependent on throttle position as well.

I think mrsaturn7085 is correct that the SAS is same for all GR models...the difference I think is the VDCCM ECU in models with the 13:1 rack is programmed to receive that data differently. e.g. let's take wobbletops video for instance, the ECU for the normal rack output by the SAS of lets say 90 left is interpreted as 90 BUT with the 13:1 ratio rack making that same left turn becomes an output of a lesser value of lets say 60 going to the ECU. The ECU is programmed to compare the other sensor inputs to determine if it should react...there's probably an allowable ratio in the programming and now we're not in it?? Even though the VDCCM for the GR's is identified differently between the WRX (SM) and the STi (SN) I bet the programming to receive the SAS signal is the same.

I'm wondering if someone who is planning to do this would be able to go to have the SSM hooked up and take a reading at a specific # or turns on the steering wheel (let's say 1 full rotation from center) and get the # of degrees the SAS is outputting, then go back after installing the 13:1 and make same rotation and get SAS output, it "should" be less. According to the FSM getting this measurement should be possible.

Of interest having the SAS reset to 0 also resets the G sensor to 0, showing how tied together they are.

Thoughts? Am I way off base?
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Old 12-17-2016, 11:58 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darkstarmoto View Post
Have been watching this thread closely as I want to install the 15 rack as well. Following the issue of the VDC has me wondering. I think KManZ is on to something with this statement.


My take on it is this. The SAS output is in degrees, it is tied to the Yaw Rate & G sensors. Since you have less physical steering input with the faster rack, the SAS is reading less degrees than I think the YRS & GS are experiencing. i.e. Those sensors are feeling a tight turn happening but SAS is saying no not really therefore the VDCCM ECU thinks "oh crap we're having an understeer event" and reacts to correct giving your the intrusive VDC reaction. This reaction by the VDC is probably dependent on throttle position as well.

I think mrsaturn7085 is correct that the SAS is same for all GR models...the difference I think is the VDCCM ECU in models with the 13:1 rack is programmed to receive that data differently. e.g. let's take wobbletops video for instance, the ECU for the normal rack output by the SAS of lets say 90 left is interpreted as 90 BUT with the 13:1 ratio rack making that same left turn becomes an output of a lesser value of lets say 60 going to the ECU. The ECU is programmed to compare the other sensor inputs to determine if it should react...there's probably an allowable ratio in the programming and now we're not in it?? Even though the VDCCM for the GR's is identified differently between the WRX (SM) and the STi (SN) I bet the programming to receive the SAS signal is the same.

I'm wondering if someone who is planning to do this would be able to go to have the SSM hooked up and take a reading at a specific # or turns on the steering wheel (let's say 1 full rotation from center) and get the # of degrees the SAS is outputting, then go back after installing the 13:1 and make same rotation and get SAS output, it "should" be less. According to the FSM getting this measurement should be possible.

Of interest having the SAS reset to 0 also resets the G sensor to 0, showing how tied together they are.

Thoughts? Am I way off base?
How do you explain that the majority of us who have done this swap don't have this issue?
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